And you would be well within your rights to do so. There is no excuseOriginally Posted by Silver
for some man (or woman) of any age being a crude ass to anybody.
I really don't think that women
think guys hit on them all the time. I mean, heck, half the time I'm at a party with my girls we're whispering
back and forth 'Do you think he's looking at me? I think he's looking at me. No, he's not looking at me.'
I agree with you, belgareth, in that holding the door for a woman is very gentlemanly, and should never be
responded to with rudeness. I also agree with you, tongue, in that if an older man hit on a woman respectfully,
then they should still be treated with courtesy, although I personally find hitting on a woman who could be your
granddaughter kind of gross no matter the sophistication of your approach.
However, the women in this particular
article that I was talking about are not responding to polite compliments and flirtation, but rather guys that
won't take a hint, or are crude and lewd, men who "still believe that a woman enjoys hearing comments about the
size of certain regions of her body, so that everyone in earshot can turn around and examine her merits, too" and
say things such as "Baby, let me work on you and that hot little body."
Now, I consider myself a very polite
person, and I would never even think about being rude to a guy who held a door open for me, but when hear comments
like those, and I have before, by all that is good and right in the world, I reserve my right to yell at him to my
heart's desire.
~Silver
And you would be well within your rights to do so. There is no excuseOriginally Posted by Silver
for some man (or woman) of any age being a crude ass to anybody.
To compel a man to subsidize with his taxes the propagation of ideas which he disbelieves and abhors is sinful and tyrannical.
Thomas Jefferson
I don't feel orSilver writes, "when a guy hitting on you is clearly twice your age or more, you have the right to a dose of
bitchiness. But most of the time you just have to take the good with the bad."
consider myself old but, alas, I just turned 50. Inside I have the same feelings and desires I did 25 years ago, and
that applies to women. I can still fall in love, be a total fool and hurt just as bad as I did 30 years ago. When I
was in high school and college I was mainly attracted to "older" women. i.e., mid-20s. Over the years that
preference hasn't changed much. I figured by age 50 I'd be done for but lots of younger women are attracted to me
and let me know in no uncertain terms. I rarely comeon to women--shy & don't want the image of a dirty old man--but
women are much bolder than they were 20 years ago. They're usually surprised when they learn my age--they think
I'm in my 30s--but it doesn't deter them. Once in the relationship the trappings of age quickly melt away. I'm
not a sugar daddy--I'm a college professor & professional musician--but women 20-30 are strangely attracted to me
(younger women usually leave me alone). Perhaps it's part of the vintage craze but I can't complain.
"I'm just a dirty hornytoad" -Gegogi
I'm a couple years younger
than Gegogi and completely understand his point of view. The biggest advantage of age is that it opens more
opportunity. It's really strange but in the last few years I have had more hits from women in their late 20's to
early 30's than I ever did when I was that age. As a businessman I can't afford to be seen as a dirty old man who
hits on youngsters either. It isn't necesary to hit on them, they make their opinions very plain. Not all, of
course but a surprising number of them and they are usually some of the best lookers.
To compel a man to subsidize with his taxes the propagation of ideas which he disbelieves and abhors is sinful and tyrannical.
Thomas Jefferson
Originally Posted by bjf
I was
talking to a lady online today (we spoke once or twice in the past). I told her I was heading to Starbucks and if
she would join me, she immediately became defensive and suspicious, so I assured her that I just wanted to chat and
nothing more.
She told me that it was a rarity, which to me was kinda sad.
Well to make a long story short
we met at Starbucks and chatted, she told me that she was getting an early start on preparing her Christmas meal. I
told her that I was going to brew some ginger beer but wasn’t planning on a formal Christmas dinner (unless the ex
makes one), at this point she invited me to her home for Christmas dinner and thanked her for the consideration
(undecided).
We parted eventually but I couldn’t help remembering how she carried with suspicious. It seems
that they are those who for some strange reason can’t see men and women as just being friends.
BTW I was
looking at her ass when we walked to her car, but that’s beside the point.
DCW
Last edited by DCW; 12-24-2004 at 03:28 AM.
I'm a couple ofOriginally Posted by belgareth
years older than both of you.
There seems to be a serious shift in attitude about sex that occurs when a female
hits her mid to late 20's.
It doesn't at all surprise me that Silver (at 19) finds being hit on by men 20
years her senior "gross." It also doesn't surprise me that females 25-35 find you and Gegogi (and me, for that
matter) "interesting."
I noticed the shift when I was 30, and rather suddenly the females I was with started
playing with their sexual urges, rather than fighting them. I had completely forgotten that dynamic, only to be
reminded of it in the past few years since my divorce.
My best friend for some years now has been a
20-something. If she had been her current age (25) instead of 20 when we met, we would have been lovers rather than
best friends - we've had more than one convo on that topic. Ah, well.
-Bass
somewhere between amused and obsessed...
DCW,
That is sad but it
illistrates my point nicely. One of the things I like about meeting people places like this forum is that we can be
friends without them either thinking I am hitting on them or making judgments about their appearance or any other
trait beside who they are.
Bassman,
My middle daughter just turned 18. She once asked my SO who is 28 what she
saw in a man my age, she thought it was kind of gross too. Jessica, on the other hand, finds men her own age to be
almost intolerable because of their attitudes towards women. If I was a fat old buzzard who didn't care for hmself
it might be different though. She doesn't think much of that type either.
To compel a man to subsidize with his taxes the propagation of ideas which he disbelieves and abhors is sinful and tyrannical.
Thomas Jefferson
Originally Posted by DCW
haha, funny
ending.
re: friends
Because some women realize how complicated it is to just be friends with guys
considering most guys just want to be friends as a way to become lovers. When they try friendships and reject the
guys eventual advances, it leads to an upset male, and ultimately an upset female.
Too much confusion. And
it is not as easy as everybody stating what we want from the beginning, because nobody knows that all the
time.
Friendships with the same sex are simpler. Nobodies feelings get hurt, nobody gets burned.
The shift inOriginally Posted by BassMan
attitude has to do with a shift in biology more than anything else. As we all know, men's sexual peak comes at
what, 19? Women's at 30? Not to say just life experience doesn't play a role, but biology is what ultimately
controls the attitudes of both sexes.
And once women get hornier, they don't just get interested in the
older guys if you know what I mean.
True, most of my friends are women and yes some were past loversOriginally Posted by belgareth
but we value the friendship and continue to talk and relate life's experience.
You'll be surprised that in a
city as big as Houston just how many lonely people they are, in my opinion people don't value relationships and
frienships like they use to.
DCW
It soundsOriginally Posted by bjf
like the guy wasn't very honest about what he wanted in the first place. If he wasn't misleading the lady, he
certainly was misleading himself.
To compel a man to subsidize with his taxes the propagation of ideas which he disbelieves and abhors is sinful and tyrannical.
Thomas Jefferson
Same here, many ofOriginally Posted by DCW
my friends are women. It's refreshing at times because men seem to want to compete with each other where a man and
woman can relate without that nonsense. I think you're right about how people don't value relationships as much
anymore. It so often comes down to "what can they do for me?" That's a terrible way to live.
To compel a man to subsidize with his taxes the propagation of ideas which he disbelieves and abhors is sinful and tyrannical.
Thomas Jefferson
I no longer "work out", but I do yoga and walk constantly. I've gotton moreOriginally Posted by belgareth
than one woman half my age exasperated trying to keep up with my energy level...
As I suspect Gegogi can testify
- being a performing musician covers a multitude of sins... It won't make _every_ young woman hot for you, but it
certainly improves the odds.
-Bass
somewhere between amused and obsessed...
DCW and Bel -Originally Posted by DCW
Same here - I have many female friends. The relationships tend to be more intimate than those I have with males -
with the exception of one close male friend who has a very well developed female side.
A lot of males,
including some I've known and played music with for years, seem to be afraid of developing closeness with another
male, unless it's in a very structured way, such as sports (I played soccer in an earlier incarnation), or music.
I've always supposed it's cultural...
-Bass
somewhere between amused and obsessed...
Hmm, I don't know, I guess I
don't see it as a physical thing. The physical aspect is a PART of why I think dating a much older man would be
kind of weird, but it's not the be all end all. Like, I wouldn't consider physical attractiveness to be THE
reason I find a guy who could be my grandfather undateable. Physical attractiveness is always a factor, but if t
here is chemistry there then there's chemistry, no matter the age.
The way I look at it, it's about where you
are in life. I mean, how old is pierce brosnan? Hotter than most guys my age, that's for sure. But he's still
over 50, and there are still the problems that arise from such an age difference. Which is not to say I wouldn't
shag pierce brosnan, I mean every girl's got to make an exception for bond, but this is just to illustrate that
it's not the physical attractiveness that's the main issue here. A guy at 50 is looking for vastly different
things, from a relationship, from other people, and from life in general. The gulf between a 25-30 woman, who is
probably already working out in the real world, worrying about a rent a utility bill and the groceries, and a man in
his 50s, is most definitely significantly smaller than the gulf between an 18-25 year old, most likely in school or
just recently out of it, looking for freedom, experimentation, and excitement, and the same man, or even a 40 year
old. I don't think the younger women are less mature, or just not sexually come into themselves yet, but rather
just looking for such different things.
Maybe I could see myself dating a 50 year old when I'm 30. Who knows,
I don't think so, but it's within the realm of possibility. But I just REALLY can't see myself dating even a 40
year old now, or within the next 5 years, if that makes any sense.
Cheers,
~Silver
p.s. Bassman and Gegogi,
being a musician ALWAYS helps
True, male to male friendships are"Friendships with the same
sex are simpler. Nobodies feelings get hurt, nobody gets burned."
usually simpler. Most of my guy friends tend to confine themselves to one activity--e.g., smokin' buddies,
drinkin' buddies, jammin' buddies--and are uncomfortable if you stray to far afield or get too personal. On the
other hand, relationships with my female friends--the majority of my friends--tend to be more personal and
multifaceted. That isn't to say I haven't hurt or been hurt by male friends, you merely have less oportunity due
to the narrower relationship. And, man, male egos are the most fragile of all...
Yeah, for some reason you look a lot better under"As I suspect Gegogi
can testify - being a performing musician covers a multitude of sins... It won't make _every_ young woman hot for
you, but it certainly improves the odds."
stagelights compared to daylight! However, many women I meet after performances tire of me quickly once they see the
music thing going on all day.
"I'm just a dirty hornytoad" -Gegogi
Silver,
You're voicing
concerns I had when Jessica started letting me know she was interested in me. She's still a student, will get
hooded soon. I couldn't imagine what we would have in common outside the bedroom. It took a long time of my
treating her as a friend for me to see that she was serious and could be a good companion to me. The last thing I
wanted was to get into a relationship that was going to get either of us hurt.
She surprises me all the time
with her insights and maturity. We can go to the ballet or a play together, afterwards go get ice creams and walk
along eating them and giggling like children. Or take a bottle of wine for a moonlit walk along the seashore and
just enjoy one another. It's a strange thing. I guess it helps that she's about three times smarter than me, I
have to respect her.
To compel a man to subsidize with his taxes the propagation of ideas which he disbelieves and abhors is sinful and tyrannical.
Thomas Jefferson
I have to say, intelligent and well educated women are a massive turn on for"It's a strange thing. I guess it helps that she's about three times smarter than me,
I have to respect her."
me. Such women have said the very thing that I find attractive scares many men. In fact, the mere mention of
graduate degrees sends most guys reeling. Plus the more accomlished a woman, the more competive she tends to be in a
relationship. The downside is you can't pull the wool over their eyes so easily. They'll nail your butt to the
door everytime.
Silver you're unusually smart and thoughtful for a 19 year old. Most guys your age are way
behind you. I wouldn't be surprised if you finish college in 4 years, unlike most students, and enter the real
world at the tender age of 22 or 23. So beware of scaring off potential BFs! My sister--a lawyer--used to play dumb
in order to get dates. She even lost to guys at tennis and downhill skiing on purpose. Otherwise, once they caught
wind she was smarter and faster, their egos were too limp to show their face again.
Incidentally, Belgareth,
Bassman and I are only old enough to be your father, not grandfather (unless we were gettin' busy in junior high!).
"I'm just a dirty hornytoad" -Gegogi
I've been married twice.Originally Posted by Gegogi
Both had graduate degrees. Actually, both were my age - well, the first was three years older.
You say they get
tired of you when they see the musical discipline... I almost always date creative types. My first lover became a
very successful commercial artist. I've dated actresses, sculpters, painters. Both wives were therapists - creative
souls in their own way. I'm finally dating a performing musician - the first, actually. I can't imagine a woman
who wasn't a slave to her own creative impulses tolerating me for long...
Bel -
One of the big attractions of
a younger woman for an older man is his appreciation of the finer things. It is so lacking in most younger men.
Theatre, ballet, opera. I date women who are already involved in the arts - but it would be great fun to share these
with someone for their first time.
-Bass
somewhere between amused and obsessed...
Actually my former wife is a
performig musician and music teacher. Female artists and musicians are really tough to meet, let alone someone that
shares a mutual attraction.
"I'm just a dirty hornytoad" -Gegogi
The fake wedding ring story
goes right along with this one;
http://www.conjecture.com/bitch.htm
The Bitch Theory.
Keep in mind that the women that were questioned about their fake engagement band were from New York City. There are
lots of women there and they just so happened to interview the snobs. I'm sure they didn't bother to talk to any
of the women that weren't into playing games or acting stuck-up.
And with the Bitch Theory, seems like the
snobbish "My pussy is made of gold and diamonds" mentality really turns around to bite them when they get older. It
goes from; "I'm so hot all men want to get me into bed." to "I'm 50 and I'm lonely and miserable and nobody will
sleep with me. Oh woe is me!"
Men's powers of attraction can stay well into middle-age.
Married twice myself,Originally Posted by BassMan
once was horrible the other great. Both were my age. You're probably right about that, Jess enjoys the plays and
Ballet. Although she is no stranger to the arts, her parents are patrons of the arts. She was surprised to learn
that I don't watch TV, much less sports.
Gegogi,
The few ladies I've dated who weren't pretty bright and
well educated bored me quickly. If a woman can't hold her own in a conversation or doesn't have other interests,
she's not very interesting for long. I won't play the "who's the boss" or any other competitve games in a
relationship. There's no point to them. Jess tried it a couple times and found that I just didn't respond, she
gave up. I don't ever bother to try to fool her or lie about things, if she doesn't like something about me, she
can learn to deal with it. It tends to make things easier in the long run.
Silver,
I would have loved to
have met a woman like you when I was in college! You've got a lot of good attributes but most important is that you
are smart and have your own opinions. Don't ever let that change.
To compel a man to subsidize with his taxes the propagation of ideas which he disbelieves and abhors is sinful and tyrannical.
Thomas Jefferson
Why? It qualifies under the science of attraction, doesn't it?Originally Posted by bjf
To compel a man to subsidize with his taxes the propagation of ideas which he disbelieves and abhors is sinful and tyrannical.
Thomas Jefferson
I'd say no, but you're the mod, and
I respect that it is your role to evaluate that.
We're discussing relationships
between disparate age groups and what does or does not attract people of different ages. It seems to me that has a
lot to do with attraction but if you differ, please send me a PM and we can discuss it.
To compel a man to subsidize with his taxes the propagation of ideas which he disbelieves and abhors is sinful and tyrannical.
Thomas Jefferson
Originally Posted by belgareth
Why on earth couldn't you meet a women like Silver in College. They are all over
campus.
My goodness, I live right next to a small private college, and spend a bit of time at the bigger
State University.
In my experience many of the young women have the same traits of Silver, almost to the
point of fault. I chat with them in coffee shops, bars near campus and have dated of few of the more open minded
ones who wern't imtimdated by an older gentleman.
Most people I know, have their own opinions and are
reasonably smart. They have no intention of changing until their mode of thinking changes. Which correlates with the
terrific article posted by Felstrom.
First, keepOriginally Posted by tounge
in mind that I'm talking about the mid-seventies, things have changed a bit since then. Most of my first time
through college was at a small state college in the middle of nowhere. The science curriculum was limited and there
were few of the really top flight students. Also, there was almost no asian population there, the few I met were not
all that bright or outspoken.
To compel a man to subsidize with his taxes the propagation of ideas which he disbelieves and abhors is sinful and tyrannical.
Thomas Jefferson
Fair Point. I'm sure that there is
a difference between now and the seventies. Also the science field then was pretty much filled with males. And going
to a school in the middle of nowhere didn't help. But were you specificaly looking for an Asain women?
Asian women have always
fascinated me, they can be incredibly lovely.
To compel a man to subsidize with his taxes the propagation of ideas which he disbelieves and abhors is sinful and tyrannical.
Thomas Jefferson
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