I can't help if you choose to

take it personaly. Since I was not directing it at you personaly I will not bother to respond to any portion

addressing that. Go back and look for pointless name calling, as one example. Also, please point out a single

example where you agreed with Bush publicly.

You can look yourself but I specifically stated I agreed with

Obama's stand on limiting incomes of executives in corporations that took bailout funds. Another position I

disagreed with Bush on and agree with Obama on is stem cell research, still another is abortion. I completely agreed

with Clinton's welfare to work plan, as well. As far as closing Guantanamo, I am looking for some workable

alternative. I do not see releasing prisoners of war back into their native lands as being all that rational but I

do not support torture either.

Some things I disagree with both Bush and Obama on are the increases in the size

of government, the increases in the burden of government on the people, the increases in the invasion of our rights

and privacy. I always will oppose huge increases in government, government spending and invasions of our privacy and

the loss of our rights. It seems to me that you ranted quite a bit about loss of privacy under the excuse of

national security, please correct me if I am wrong, but you seem to be perfectly willing to accept it under the

auspices of universal healthcare, something I am utterly opposed to for what seem rather obvious reasons that I have

brought up a number of times.

It is a fine thing that you take all your sources from mainstream media, if that

is where you want to get all your facts. Many have noticed over the years that the mainstream media is biased.

Perhaps some radicalism is appropriate?

You and I see government in a different manner. As far as I can tell,

you want a nanny state where I believe people need to be taught to be more self reliant and to stop relying on the

government for everything. In the end, with the right training, the people could be taught enough to reduce

government to a more appropriate size and power. It isn't something that is going to happen in my lifetime and I am

well aware of that. Frankly, the way things are going I am pretty certain that we are going to more or less follow

the former Soviet Union. Not only is that terribly sad to see for a people who were once proud, rugged individuals

but it is going to cause untold pain and suffering for the very people the government alleges it is trying to help.



I've used several numbers but whether the appropriate size is 1% of current or 10% or 98% is not the point.

The point is that the ongoing, uncheck growth in government is bad for everybody except the very few "leaders".



<start: humor> I'm glad to see we are back to disagreeing, Doc. I was worried there for while when we kept

agreeing <end: Humor>

I've learned a lot and seen a lot of new things from debating with you. Don't take it

personally, please! We may disagree but you still have my respect