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  1. #1
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    Default Advice wanted for a strong, effective product

    visit-red-300x50PNG
    After 5 weeks and 22 field tests, I have a total of zero real hits.

    [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/frown.gif[/img] Have been using small to moderate applications of TE/m, PPA/m,

    and/or SOE gel packs during these tests.

    I would still like to continue testing for a period of 6 months, and

    would like to field test a couple other products. What can people recommend to me as the strongest, most effective

    product for 50 dollars or less? Although I\'d like to purchase a couple more things, I\'d like to put a 50

    dollar limit on any individual product, since it\'s quite possible the products will do nothing for me, and I will

    then feel I\'m flushing the money down the toilet. So, I will not be testing PI, P10, or A1.

    I would really,

    really like to find a mone that does produce some results; I definitely do not want to come to the conclusion, 5

    months from now, that these products are the equivalent of oil from long, legless reptiles. I would much rather be

    able to state that some pheromones are effective and very worthwhile, and want to recommend them to everyone. So

    please, let me know which under-50-dollar products have been the strongest, and most likely to produce at least some

    reactions in people. I would like especially to hear from people who have used TE and/or PPA with little or no

    results, but went on to find another product which worked well.

    Thanks,
    AzMike

  2. #2
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    Default Re: Advice wanted for a strong, effective product

    Maybe you can be more descriptive on the amounts, appiciation points, coverscents and settings you have

    been using these products. PPA/m is the only product from love-scent that did\'nt give me any results whatsoever

    (i\'ve used every product except Edge Essentials) PPA/w is a different story.... that stuff is worth the

    di\'nero...

    Even if you can\'t afford a good coverscent, there\'s always \"Old Spice\" bodyspray\'s..

    those things are great, i\'ve been getting endless compliments on the \"Pure Sport\" version... more than any

    cologne i\'ve ever worn. Also it\'s great for covering TE/m.. 1 spray of TE/m to the chest and a generous amount

    of Old Spice bodyspray and your literally a chick magnet. Don\'t Underestimate TE/m, I got laid the first time I

    used it and i\'ve been hooked ever since.

    Too bad you wont be able to explore the world of PI/m...

    Phantom.


  3. #3
    Doctor of Scentology DrSmellThis's Avatar
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    Default Re: Advice wanted for a strong, effective product

    WAGG.

  4. #4
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    Default Re: Advice wanted for a strong, effective product

    AzMike, what kind of hits are you looking for?

  5. #5
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    Default Re: Advice wanted for a strong, effective product

    </font><blockquote><font class=\"small\">Quote:</font><hr />
    I would really, really like

    to find a mone that does produce some results; I definitely do not want to come to the conclusion, 5 months from

    now, that these products are the equivalent of oil from long, legless reptiles. I would much rather be able to state

    that some pheromones are effective and very worthwhile, and want to recommend them to everyone. So please, let me

    know which under-50-dollar products have been the strongest, and most likely to produce at least some reactions in

    people. I would like especially to hear from people who have used TE and/or PPA with little or no results, but went

    on to find another product which worked well.

    <hr /></blockquote><font class=\"post\">

    This is kind of a

    goofy argument. I\'m assuming you are frustrated and want to vent, but please understand if you aren\'t

    noticing results that really has no impact overall on whether pheromones \"work\" or are snake oil. We all have a

    vested interest in them working, so we all will look favorably on any evidence whatsoever that may help the cause.



    In my experience, \"hits\" are more a sign of the person \"working\" than the mones working per se. I can

    wear all the pheromones in the world and sit at home and I wont\' get any hits. If you aren\'t in situations

    where you can succeed, there is little use in them. I don\'t know about your situation, but I often find people

    who complain about \"things not working\" haven\'t changed anything else in their lives. Pheromones can be part

    of the whole package in creating new strategies for success, but they aren\'t the only thing.

    It is very hard

    to judge how effective mones can be/are. Part of the problem is that this a niche market. Brad Pitt isn\'t looking

    for the perfect pheromone. Guys/girls who are getting play all the time don\'t usually worry about these kinds of

    things. So the universe of buyers tends to be people who have \"struck out\" in the past. And speaking as someone

    who has struck out in the past, whether or not I had pheromones on would not change the outcome.

    Don\'t ask

    them to change everything, they can\'t and try and work on other aspects of repetoire to increase the chances for

    hits.

  6. #6
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    Default Re: Advice wanted for a strong, effective product

    </font><blockquote><font class=\"small\">Quote:</font><hr />
    Maybe you can be more descriptive on

    the amounts, appiciation points, coverscents and settings you have been using these products. PPA/m is the only

    product from love-scent that did\'nt give me any results whatsoever (i\'ve used every product except Edge

    Essentials) PPA/w is a different story.... that stuff is worth the di\'nero...

    Phantom.

    <hr

    /></blockquote><font class=\"post\">
    1. Amounts- have varied from 1 or 2 small dabs to 2 big sprays from the

    Love-scent-supplied atomizer, where each spray appears to be quite a number of dabs. These are amounts I\'ve used

    for PPA/m and TE/m. I would guesstimate this would be the equivalent of slightly less than one drop, up to 4-6

    drops. For SOE, used 4 times total, I used between 1/3 and 1/6 of a gel pack each time. I never used SOE alone,

    always in combination with TE/m.

    2. Application points- almost always put some on side of neck, the so-called

    \"pulse points\". Sometimes put some on top of chest, sometimes back of neck, a couple times behind ears.

    Several times, before going to swing dance lessons, smeared a small dab between wrists. The wrist is often swung

    around the woman\'s head (and nose) in this dancing.

    3. Coverscents- with PPA/m, usually none, it has its own

    distinct fragrance. With TE/m, supposedly Sandalwood, a few times no cover, several times Dolce &amp; Gabbana,

    recently several times Diesel Zero Plus. 4 times I added SOE to TE/m, and 3 of those times didn\'t add additional

    cover, once I added D &amp; G. The reason I say \"supposedly Sandalwood\" is, my bottle doesn\'t seem to have

    any perfume-type fragrance I can smell at all. It just smells like a hospital. The bottle is labeled \"Fragranced

    Pheromone Spray For Men\". But it\'s not a spray bottle, just a bottle with a lid. So if the spray part is

    mis-labeled, the \"fragranced\" part might be too.

    4. Settings- various. A few times on hikes with outdoor

    clubs, a few times in group dinners in restaurants, twice at a singles mixer with a fair amount of alcohol served,

    twice in a bar, once at a health club working out, once at a picnic with about 20 people (half women), a few times

    on dinner dates with one woman, several times swing dancing. In the last setting, only a small number of people are

    in their 20\'s, most are in their 30\'s, 40\'s, and 50\'s. In fact, just did field test #23 at a Sunday

    evening dance, since my original post on this. Tonite did 2 small dabs of TE/m, and 2 sprays of DZP cologne. No

    hits at all, and in fact, a younger woman there (about 30), who I had seen a half dozen times before, mentioned to

    me that she had a boyfriend, for the first time tonite. Also, I had a few trips to the grocery store before or

    after the settings listed above, with no reactions from any women in the stores.

    AzMike

  7. #7
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    Default Re: WAGG

    DrSmellThis:</font><blockquote><font class=\"small\">Quote:</font><hr />
    WAGG.

    <hr /></blockquote><font

    class=\"post\">
    Although I am looking for some women I know to get more \"chatty\", I am definitely looking

    also for sexual hits. Would WAGG (without the -N) provide that?

    AzMike

  8. #8
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    Default Re: Advice wanted for a strong, effective product

    I was a skeptic going in. But I got enough surprising results early on to investigate in earnest, to

    see if there was a scientific basis.

    Two things are quite certain in my mind based on respectable scientific

    sources that I researched:

    * A1 lights up the sexual area in women’s brains when they are exposed, even at

    undetected and scent-covered levels.

    * Androstenol changes the sex-hormone release rates in women’s brains.

    Of

    course there’s lots more emerging evidence, but these two recent well-documented facts convinced me it’s not

    snakeoil.

    The problem is that it’s an emerging field as it relates to human beings. So whatever you are using is

    a bit of an experiment – it will be decades I think before the human phero language is well understood

    scientifically.

    The good part is you get to be an experimental pioneer, if you are so inclined.

    I can tell

    you that interactions have become much easier since I began to experiment, especially with women approaching me and

    initiating conversations. I had expected failure and tried pheros on a whim, but the results really changed my

    mind. And there’s enough science to validate my experience, that it’s not ‘all in my head’ or the result of some

    changed attitude. But there’s been some rough spots along the road, especially with scent od’s. Such is the price

    of exploration.

    Anyway, I understand the budget issue. Work with what you already have, try small doses and use

    social skills to maneuver close enough for the pheros to work in their soft-spoken way. I’m a huge fan of A1, but

    it’s expensive (however it is probably a component of TE &amp; NPA, even though the ingredients are officially

    secret). The downside of TE/NPA is the smell, which much be managed closely. Androstenol can get things going with

    less bad smell. But you probably already know all that…

    I can honestly tell you that I have noticed a huge

    increase in responses from women when I am close to them for some time (like sitting next to them or standing

    close). They often flirt physically by taking my arm, touching thighs – you name it – and its come from women I

    just met as well as ones I’ve known for years. I really must credit the pheros, cause in the previous decade before

    pheros this probably happened to me only twice. Now it’s a fairly regular event. The trick for me seems to be a

    light dose, and close physical proximity for a while . The longer they are near me and as conversation unfolds the

    more overt their reaction becomes.

    Anyway, try that. Make pheros a component of your conversation with women,

    and see what happens. Try it with enough girls to see if you notice anything, or compare to reactions on days you

    don’t use pheros. I’m like you – if I hadn’t noticed anything going on I wouldn’t have stuck with it. But I can

    vouch for my own results, and hope you have similar experiences.

  9. #9
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    Default Re: Advice wanted for a strong, effective product

    Great Post Irish. AZMike I suggest Alter Ego with all three mones. It\'s the first product I bought

    and probably the most successful stand-alone. I\'ve got more sexual hits with it that way. Since I\'ve tried

    mixing AE/NPA I\'ve OD each time. Too much aggression. When I\'ve added SOE or WAGG I get thought of as being

    gay. It\'s definitely better to have the SOE/WAGG added though because the AE/NPA can be dangerous for me. One

    girl at club claimed that I said that I wanted to f_ck her even though I had not talked or touched her. She went to

    a bouncer claiming this and I got bounced. Also I have had women think I had said f_ck to them during conversation

    even though I hadn\'t or exclaim \'f_ck\' out of the blue. I think the message they get from AE alone is less

    intrusive and more are likely to react favorably. As if it\'s more of a \'I so want to get to know you\'

    instead of the more blatantly intrusive \'I wanna f-ck you\' that occurs when near an OD.

    I\'m gonna go

    by the less is more theory and try AE again alone. Also NPA with cologne. Pheromones can be dangerous if too much is

    used IMO. But if you do make sure to have SOE &amp; WAGG.

  10. #10
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    Default Hopefully an effect on the outcome

    </font><blockquote><font class=\"small\">Quote:</font><hr />
    This is kind of a goofy argument. I\'m assuming

    you are frustrated and want to vent, but please understand if you aren\'t noticing results that really has no

    impact overall on whether pheromones \"work\" or are snake oil. We all have a vested interest in them working, so

    we all will look favorably on any evidence whatsoever that may help the cause.

    In my experience, \"hits\" are

    more a sign of the person \"working\" than the mones working per se. I can wear all the pheromones in the world

    and sit at home and I wont\' get any hits. If you aren\'t in situations where you can succeed, there is little

    use in them. I don\'t know about your situation, but I often find people who complain about \"things not

    working\" haven\'t changed anything else in their lives. Pheromones can be part of the whole package in creating

    new strategies for success, but they aren\'t the only thing.

    It is very hard to judge how effective mones can

    be/are. Part of the problem is that this a niche market. Brad Pitt isn\'t looking for the perfect pheromone.

    Guys/girls who are getting play all the time don\'t usually worry about these kinds of things. So the universe of

    buyers tends to be people who have \"struck out\" in the past. And speaking as someone who has struck out in the

    past, whether or not I had pheromones on would not change the outcome.

    Don\'t ask them to change everything,

    they can\'t and try and work on other aspects of repetoire to increase the chances for hits.

    <hr

    /></blockquote><font class=\"post\">
    Ummm...first, I\'ve never used any pheromones when I planned to sit at

    home, something I tend to do a couple nites per week. I have applied the mones prior to going out to situations

    where I would be either with a large number of people, including many women, or in a couple cases, where I was on a

    date with one woman. I don\'t believe in wasting any sort of product.

    I don\'t have illusions about putting

    on mones, and expecting them to do all the work. I am not expecting women to come up to me and start ripping my

    clothes and her clothes off. However, I AM looking for subtle signs that would be out of the ordinary. One of

    these would be increased eye contact. During the 23 times I\'ve used mones so far, I have noticed no women who

    had a big increase in eye contact with me. No stares or anything. I have noticed one or two times what may have

    been a rather slight increase, but these were women I was unfamiliar with.

    In many settings, I have purposely,

    but briefly, walked past a woman, so I would be within a foot or so of her for a second or 2. This was with a

    moderate dose of PPA/m or TE/m on. This didn\'t turn any heads. In a dance situation, the woman is automatically

    within range of you. In some other social settings, I might be standing 2-3 feet from a woman when conversing, but

    might walk closer to her for a few seconds, so she might get a whiff.

    I have struck out many times in the past

    myself, but have had a number of home runs, certainly not as often as I\'d like, but these home runs were all

    before I started using mones about 5 weeks ago. Speaking of strange arguments, I don\'t know why you\'d state

    that pheromones would have no effect on the outcome. Doesn\'t exactly sound like a promotion of them. If they

    would have NO EFFECT on the outcome, why would anybody buy them?

    I don\'t expect to dab mones on, go to a

    social function, sit on my butt, do nothing, and expect women to flock to me. But I would hope they would help

    increase the chances of women acting favorably when I approach them. At the very least, I would hope to see

    increased eye contact from SOME women.

    AzMike

  11. #11
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    Default Re: Advice wanted for a strong, effective product

    </font><blockquote><font class=\"small\">Quote:</font><hr />
    Too bad you wont be able to explore the

    world of PI/m...

    Phantom.

    <hr /></blockquote><font class=\"post\">
    I do have the potential to become a

    hard-core experimenter and tester, buying PI/m, A1, P10, even the chem sets. I just need to see some evidence that

    the not-so-expensive mones work first. If I find a product or dosage that produces a fair number of hits for me, I

    will be hooked. [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

    </font><blockquote><font

    class=\"small\">Quote:</font><hr />
    AzMike, what kind of hits are you looking for?

    Phantom.

    <hr

    /></blockquote><font class=\"post\">
    I am looking for almost anything out of the ordinary. Increased eye

    contact, flirty/touchy behavior, increased chattiness, etc. Like most of us, I am mainly looking for a product that

    will produce sexual hits, rather than friendship hits. [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smirk.gif[/img] But I am

    keeping my eyes open for any behavior that seems outside the normal range of what I\'ve seen in the

    past.

    AzMike

  12. #12
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    Default Which comes first: eye contact or phero effects?

    Since you mention a desire to get more eye contact, I’ll throw this out there for what it’s worth.

    Irish’s Scheme for Pursuit Encounters:

    I basically operate on the anthropological courtship scheme…courtship

    operates through several stages before progressing to intercourse, and the order of the stages is important. The

    first stage is the sending of presence and gender cues – all non-verbal. Eye contact is perhaps the most important,

    although there are many gestures that are subconsciously processed. Next comes return signals of recognition and

    permission to approach. Everything so far is non-verbal, and includes the eye contact you are looking for.

    Next

    the big hurdle: approach and speech, followed later by touching during the conversation. The moment builds rapidly

    from here, with the couple seeking solitude for more intimate touch, kissing, and sex. Of course there’s little

    advances and retreats throughout the process, and depending on how it goes the whole cycle can happen in one

    encounter, or be spread out over many encounters. This is pretty basic stuff, but the idea of courtship occurring in

    stages is what I’m getting at.

    At what stage do pheros fit in? Well, at natural concentration levels on the human

    skin, I think it would be when we were pretty close to the woman. Several years ago E. Miller made the point that

    pheros are for close-in effect, not long distance signaling, and I tend to agree. Miller thinks the visual is for

    long distance signals (eye contact, gestures, gender cues). If the theory of courtship stages is correct then the

    visual would therefore be the primary sense in the early (longer-distance) stage of courtship. Only when the couple

    had drawn closer together would the pheros begin to have significant impact (at distance smells are dispersed by the

    wind, confused with other people’s and the environment, etc.) Visual cues are individual-specific at any distance;

    smell cues are only individual-specific at close range in the ‘normal’ course of things.

    Said all that to say

    this: Signals like eye contact may be more significant in the early courtship encounter, when there is some physical

    distance, and not designed to be facilitated by pheros. You don’t need pheros to catch a girl’s eye across the room:

    people are quite sensitive to eye contact anyway. But in the later stages of an encounter, when you have drawn

    physically close, then the pheros are exerting their influence. It makes sense to me, since only after you are close

    would you be within ‘smelling range’ of an individual.

    Loading up on commercial pheros to catch attention may be

    counterproductive. The heavy dose could be repellent when you do eventually move in closer, and you may be getting

    the courtship sequence out of order anyway by trying to increase eye contact with smell cues. Go ahead and catch her

    eye contact up front, then move in for the phero effects as you begin to converse at close range.

    In my

    experience this holds. For me phero use tends to increase the sexiness of the conversation, the openness to touch

    (giving and receiving)...the things associated with later courtship phases. I’ve had girls hanging on me and asking

    why I smell good, what cologne I’m wearing, etc. That’s why I’m so big on not od-ing to the point where they will

    be offended when they do get close. I use pheros to facilitate my conversation and touching moves, not really so

    much to draw initial longer-distance attention. I can use my eyes for that anyway without smell cues.

  13. #13
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    Default Re: Which comes first: eye contact or phero effects?

    </font><blockquote><font class=\"small\">Quote:</font><hr />
    Said all that to say this: Signals

    like eye contact may be more significant in the early courtship encounter, when there is some physical distance, and

    not designed to be facilitated by pheros. You don’t need pheros to catch a girl’s eye across the room: people are

    quite sensitive to eye contact anyway. But in the later stages of an encounter, when you have drawn physically

    close, then the pheros are exerting their influence. It makes sense to me, since only after you are close would you

    be within ‘smelling range’ of an individual.

    Loading up on commercial pheros to catch attention may be

    counterproductive. The heavy dose could be repellent when you do eventually move in closer, and you may be getting

    the courtship sequence out of order anyway by trying to increase eye contact with smell cues. Go ahead and catch her

    eye contact up front, then move in for the phero effects as you begin to converse at c

    <hr /></blockquote><font

    class=\"post\">


    i just wonder if u are ugly , how would women make a eye contact with u. even u try to make

    eye contact with her, if u dont have some x factor in ur physical part to catch her eyes, i dont think she would be

    attracted / going to bother about u , isnt it? [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/crazy.gif[/img]

  14. #14
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    Default Re: Which comes first: eye contact or phero effects?

    bernard:

    That is why I got pheromones. I am butt ugly and it looks like someone smashed a bag

    of marbles into my face, on a good day. In a perfect world, I would be able to get the visual attention and

    invitation from women. However, since that is not something that happens, pheromones provide me and many others of

    this forum with that edge to get your foot in the door.

  15. #15
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    Default Re: Which comes first: eye contact or phero effects?

    then wha do u think between good looking feature that would mesmerize all the woment and more

    naturalpheromone, which one is better? if only given 1 choice , which 1 do u want to have? personally i still feel

    having better charming look would be more advantage than having natural more pheromone. i just do not know why i had

    this thought![img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/crazy.gif[/img]

  16. #16
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    Default Re: Which comes first: eye contact or phero effects?

    Bernard, looks don\'t mean quite as much to women as one might think. But thinking you\'re ugly on

    the starting line is a formula for FAILURE! We all have to play the hand we\'re dealt, but you owe it to

    yourself, if to no one else, to make the best of your life and the body you\'re given and to change the things you

    can. Work out, eat healthy, take pride in your body, be friendly, and you\'ll become someone people WANT to hang

    out with, add the proper pheros to the mix, and you may never melt the ice queens, but you\'ll find girls taking

    interest in you that you might have thought were out of your league not too long ago, and now they wanna play in

    YOUR league [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/cool.gif[/img] Trust me that is the way it works, and you truly have

    to love yourself before anyone else will. Working out is a GOOD solid start and (as long as you\'re careful

    [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]) can ONLY be a step in the right direction. You CANNOT lose

    ANYTHING by working out. It makes your BODY look good, it makes you FEEL good, and people around you WILL notice

    the multi-level changes in you.

    Slinger

  17. #17
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    Default Re: Advice wanted for a strong, effective product

    </font><blockquote><font class=\"small\">Quote:</font><hr />
    I was a skeptic going in. But I got

    enough surprising results early on to investigate in earnest, to see if there was a scientific basis.

    I can tell

    you that interactions have become much easier since I began to experiment, especially with women approaching me and

    initiating conversations. I had expected failure and tried pheros on a whim, but the results really changed my

    mind. And there’s enough science to validate my experience, that it’s not ‘all in my head’ or the result of some

    changed attitude. But there’s been some rough spots along the road, especially with scent od’s. Such is the price

    of exploration.

    I can honestly tell you that I have noticed a huge increase in responses from women when I am

    close to them for some time (like sitting next to them or standing close). They often flirt physically by taking my

    arm, touching thighs – you name it – and its come from women I just met as well as ones I’ve known for years. I

    really must credit the pheros, cause in the previous decade before pheros this probably happened to me only twice.

    Now it’s a fairly regular event. The trick for me seems to be a light dose, and close physical proximity for a while

    . The longer they are near me and as conversation unfolds the more overt their reaction becomes.

    Anyway, try

    that. Make pheros a component of your conversation with women, and see what happens. Try it with enough girls to

    see if you notice anything, or compare to reactions on days you don’t use pheros. I’m like you – if I hadn’t noticed

    anything going on I wouldn’t have stuck with it. But I can vouch for my own results, and hope you have similar

    experiences.

    <hr /></blockquote><font class=\"post\">
    Thanks for your informative, encouraging, and

    thoughtful post, Irish. I\'ve had very little in the way of women approaching me and initiating conversations

    with me since I started using pheros around Oct 1, once in a great while they do, which is just about the same as

    before Oct 1. And I\'ve noticed no increase in women flirting physically by taking my arm, touching thighs,

    etc.

    I didn\'t expect to do any field tests at all Monday. But on a whim, decided to hit the health club after

    work today. I get the impression from some posters here that I should try light doses more, so I intend to do that

    more when I go somewhere where there\'s many people I know. BUT, I know very few people at the health club, so I

    decided to do the opposite. I gave myself 4 sprays of TE/m, and 3 sprays of DZP cologne, to see if a big dose would

    make a difference. I did feel that some women may have looked at me more than normal, but not a big increase. No

    women seemed repelled by me, and I didn\'t notice any glares from any males in the club. One unusual thing was I

    was on a calf-exercising machine, and a male next to me started up a conversation about how he was hoping to buy a

    machine like the one he was working on, but it was 500 dollars, way too expensive.

    It is unusual for any stranger

    in this health club to start a conversation with me, and this seemed especially strange since I was using a -none

    only product, with no -nol or -rone. If this had been a woman, I would have considered it to be a bonafide hit, but

    not a male. ANY woman who acts unusually toward me, will be a hit, regardless of whether she\'s a beauty queen,

    or looks like Frankenstein. But not guys.

    On leaving the club, I walked by a woman who was on a hike I was on in

    mid-October, and we stopped and chatted for a few minutes. I didn\'t expect to see someone I knew like that, but

    this happens once in a while. She didn\'t seem more friendly or flirty than normal, but also didn\'t seem less

    friendly, or repelled by me, in spite of my big TE application. She was standing 18-24 inches away, for about 3

    minutes.

    AzMike

  18. #18
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    Default Re: Advice wanted for a strong, effective product

    </font><blockquote><font class=\"small\">Quote:</font><hr />
    Great Post Irish. AZMike I suggest

    Alter Ego with all three mones. It\'s the first product I bought and probably the most successful stand-alone.

    I\'ve got more sexual hits with it that way. Since I\'ve tried mixing AE/NPA I\'ve OD each time. Too much

    aggression. When I\'ve added SOE or WAGG I get thought of as being gay. It\'s definitely better to have the

    SOE/WAGG added though because the AE/NPA can be dangerous for me. One girl at club claimed that I said that I wanted

    to f_ck her even though I had not talked or touched her. She went to a bouncer claiming this and I got bounced. Also

    I have had women think I had said f_ck to them during conversation even though I hadn\'t or exclaim \'f_ck\'

    out of the blue. I think the message they get from AE alone is less intrusive and more are likely to react

    favorably. As if it\'s more of a \'I so want to get to know you\' instead of the more blatantly intrusive

    \'I wanna f-ck you\' that occurs when near an OD.

    I\'m gonna go by the less is more theory and try AE again

    alone. Also NPA with cologne. Pheromones can be dangerous if too much is used IMO. But if you do make sure to have

    SOE &amp; WAGG.

    <hr /></blockquote><font class=\"post\">
    Thanks bigdog. I actually considered Alter Ego as

    my initial purchase, and its a good candidate for my next one. I haven\'t gotten any negative reactions from

    anybody yet, while using mones. I don\'t want to get bounced from a club, but no one- female or male- has acted

    in a negatively-aggressive manner toward me yet, even with 2, 3, or even 4 sprays of TE/m.

    I wonder if your body

    type will affect if you get these negative reactions. I am in great cardiovascular shape, I hike up big mountains

    every few weeks. But I am thin and not really muscular. I work out at the gym, and actually have decent upper-body

    strength, but don\'t seem to have the genetic makeup to get much in the way of visible muscles. I wonder if some

    guys who get these bad reactions [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mad.gif[/img] with mone ODing, have more of a

    \"big bear\" body type. A \"mesomorph\" if you will.

    AzMike

  19. #19
    Sadhu bjf's Avatar
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    Default Re: Advice wanted for a strong, effective product

    Supposedly we use visual cues to figure out someones pheromoens signature.

    I think with the big

    guys, they are interpreted as having a lot of none, and when they use sytnhetic pheromones that are largely none,

    targets get both the implied visual reaction and the reaction from there actual pheromone signature, and it has

    threat written all over it. It (the visual aspect) either legitimizes the feelings that the none gives the targets,

    or could be more like having a double-dose of none.

    Yes they definitely are more likely to have those bad

    experiences ODing, even if their natural none + synthetic none equals the exact same total as mine.

  20. #20
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    Default Re: Which comes first: eye contact or phero effects?

    </font><blockquote><font class=\"small\">Quote:</font><hr />
    Bernard, looks don\'t mean quite as

    much to women as one might think. But thinking you\'re ugly on the starting line is a formula for FAILURE! We

    all have to play the hand we\'re dealt, but you owe it to yourself, if to no one else, to make the best of your

    life and the body you\'re given and to change the things you can. Work out, eat healthy, take pride in your body,

    be friendly, and you\'ll become someone people WANT to hang out with, add the proper pheros to the mix, and you

    may never melt the ice queens, but you\'ll find girls taking interest in you that you might have thought were out

    of your league not too long ago, and now they wanna play in YOUR league

    [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/cool.gif[/img] Trust me that is the way it works, and you truly have to love

    yourself before anyone else will. Working out is a GOOD solid start and (as long as you\'re careful

    [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]) can ONLY be a step in the right direction. You CANNOT lose

    ANYTHING by working out. It makes your BODY look good, it makes you FEEL good, and people around you WILL notice

    the multi-level changes in you.

    Slinger


    <hr /></blockquote><font class=\"post\">

    Also, there\'s

    such a thing as ugly-sexy. Bogart, Tommy Lee Jones, Tom Berenger. Then there are guys like Tom Sellick and Brad Pitt

    who are classically attractive, but don\'t have much sex appeal. In guys, looks don\'t often have a lot to do

    with sex appeal. It\'s presence that matters.

  21. #21
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    Default Re: Advice wanted for a strong, effective product

    AZMike-I am fairly stocky and muscular. That could contribute to the bouncer issues for I\'ve heard

    they tend to go after guys that are perceived similar to themselves. I do believe OD contributed and alcohol can

    somewhat too. I don\'t think I\'ve been too aggressive but yet I have seemed to be more confident &amp; perhaps

    cocky since using pheros. As Irish mentioned it is wise to watch carefully for cues. I\'ve learned to better watch

    for that now. A girl that works at the club I was bounced from also figured out I wear pheros as she keeps telling

    me she knows I buy off the internet. That doesn\'t help for she surely told others. The manager welcomes me back

    for I have friends that frequent there. Yet I think it\'s right for me to avoid the place for now.

    I

    mentioned before that too much none kind of gives out the \'I wanna F_ck you\' vibe. While I think AE gives out

    the more \'I\'m really digging you and wanna get to know you\' vibe. I first bought AE and used alone and the

    best results with it alone. Combos have not worked well for me so far. Lately I have been overutilizing nol which

    has given me alot fo social hits. Yet I have been perceived strangely enough by some as gay. I\'m not gonna use

    SOE or WAGG with AE that much for that reason. I\'m just gonna stick to AE alone or NPA/cologne for now. AE has

    enough nol &amp; rone IMO.

  22. #22
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    Default Re: Which comes first: eye contact or phero effects?

    </font><blockquote><font class=\"small\">Quote:</font><hr />
    Next the big hurdle: approach and

    speech, followed later by touching during the conversation. The moment builds rapidly from here, with the couple

    seeking solitude for more intimate touch, kissing, and sex. Of course there’s little advances and retreats

    throughout the process, and depending on how it goes the whole cycle can happen in one encounter, or be spread out

    over many encounters. This is pretty basic stuff, but the idea of courtship occurring in stages is what I’m getting

    at.

    <hr /></blockquote><font class=\"post\">
    Not to get away from the topic of this thread, but I really

    liked Irish\'s post. This is one area that I\'d like to learn more about, the \"approach and speech\".



    I tend to agree that in order for the \'mones to work you must be in close proximity to the other person.

    Having had two long-term relationships in a row I have not been on the dating scene for over 12 years and I\'m now

    back on the prowl if you will. But I\'d like to get some advice on how to go from a smile from across the room to

    approaching the person and striking up a conversation. Am I worrying too much about it? Should I just walk up and

    say, “Hi!\"? Hehe... What gives you the clue that a woman is attracted, if even only slightly, to you from across

    the room?

    -- Johnny

  23. #23
    Phero Pharaoh
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    Default Re: Which comes first: eye contact or phero effects?

    </font><blockquote><font class=\"small\">Quote:</font><hr />
    </font><blockquote><font

    class=\"small\">Quote:</font><hr />
    Next the big hurdle: approach and speech, followed later by touching during

    the conversation. The moment builds rapidly from here, with the couple seeking solitude for more intimate touch,

    kissing, and sex. Of course there’s little advances and retreats throughout the process, and depending on how it

    goes the whole cycle can happen in one encounter, or be spread out over many encounters. This is pretty basic stuff,

    but the idea of courtship occurring in stages is what I’m getting at.

    <hr /></blockquote><font

    class=\"post\">
    Not to get away from the topic of this thread, but I really liked Irish\'s post. This is one

    area that I\'d like to learn more about, the \"approach and speech\".

    I tend to agree that in order for the

    \'mones to work you must be in close proximity to the other person. Having had two long-term relationships in a

    row I have not been on the dating scene for over 12 years and I\'m now back on the prowl if you will. But I\'d

    like to get some advice on how to go from a smile from across the room to approaching the person and striking up a

    conversation. Am I worrying too much about it? Should I just walk up and say, “Hi!\"? Hehe... What gives you the

    clue that a woman is attracted, if even only slightly, to you from across the room?

    -- Johnny

    <hr

    /></blockquote><font class=\"post\">

    Eye contact is a biggy. Does she subtly \"check you out,\" then look

    away quickly, if you notice? Does she meet your eyes for one or two seconds, and then look someplace else?

  24. #24
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    Default Re: Which comes first: eye contact or phero effect

    </font><blockquote><font class=\"small\">Quote:</font><hr />
    Does she subtly \"check you out,\"

    then look away quickly, if you notice? Does she meet your eyes for one or two seconds, and then look someplace else?




    <hr /></blockquote><font class=\"post\">

    I have this all the time. I heard it makes a difference when

    she looks away to the ground after it or looks at something else. What is better?

    [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/confused.gif[/img]

  25. #25
    Pheromaniac Sexyredhead's Avatar
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    Default Re: Which comes first: eye contact or phero effects?

    It\'s not so much that she looks at you and looks away, but if she looks at you, then

    looks down and away. That\'s a sign of interest.

  26. #26
    Sadhu bjf's Avatar
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    Default Re: Which comes first: eye contact or phero effect

    i didn\'t know looks at something else was bad. Looking at the ground is submitting I thnk. Is

    looking to the side not also a sign of a good thing? And what happens if they look at you for about 15 seconds like

    they want to kill you? That happened to me the other night.

  27. #27
    Pheromaniac Sexyredhead's Avatar
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    Default Re: Which comes first: eye contact or phero effect

    </font><blockquote><font class=\"small\">Quote:</font><hr />
    i didn\'t know looks at something

    else was bad. Looking at the ground is submitting I thnk. Is looking to the side not also a sign of a good thing?

    And what happens if they look at you for about 15 seconds like they want to kill you? That happened to me the other

    night.

    <hr /></blockquote><font class=\"post\">

    Generally if they look at you, then look off to the side

    before dropping their gaze, the woman isn\'t interested in you. She may be wondering where you got that hat.

    [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img] Guys, on the other hand, don\'t generally look down, but away,

    then come back. But watch--is she looking away AND down? That\'s still down.

    [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

    If she looks at you for 15 seconds like she wants to kill you,

    maybe she\'s had a few too many and you look like her ex-bf, the lousy cheating bastard! Anyway, I\'d probably

    stay away from anybody giving me hostile glares from across the room.

    [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/tongue.gif[/img]

  28. #28
    cuddlebear
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    Default Re: Which comes first: eye contact or phero effect

    So down and away simultaneously is the key? Worth a try ... I will watch for that in the future.

    I\'m so glad we have females here [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]


  29. #29
    Sadhu bjf's Avatar
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    Default Re: Which comes first: eye contact or phero effect

    i think she meant down and then away OR down and away.

    to the sde, you should be fine to, they may

    notice you but haven\'t made the judgement to submit, which is what looking down signals. But it is hard to go

    and break up a conversation either way, if she is with her friends, if she doesn\'t hold eye contact long enough

    for you to smile.

    I have found some pheromone doses they can always smile back, while others they are too

    paralyzed to return the gesture or even look away.

  30. #30
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    Default Re: Which comes first: eye contact or phero effect

    </font><blockquote><font class=\"small\">Quote:</font><hr />
    If she looks at you for 15 seconds like

    she wants to kill you, maybe she\'s had a few too many and you look like her ex-bf, the lousy cheating

    bastard!

    <hr /></blockquote><font class=\"post\">
    Hahaha! Okay, this is all fascinating to me. Is this a

    proven behavior? Eye contact (maybe a smile) and then looking down and away? So rolling of the eyes and mouthing

    \"bug off!\" is a definite not a good sign? ROFL - Just kidding. I mean, some things are clear as day, but for me

    the BIGGEST hurdle is just getting past the eye contact to actually approaching the woman. I guess I\'m just sort

    of shy about walking up to a woman I\'ve never met and striking up the conversation. That is where I need to work

    on things. I just want a definite sign before I take that chance I guess. Sort of embarrassing for a 35 year old man

    to be shy about approaching women, eh?

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