I have a date

[krtel]

I just turned 17 a month ago, why? I go off to college in 6 months. I figured it out now though. Thanks.

- Krish

[**DONOTDELETE**]

hmmm - lack of confidence on his part? Maybe you need a different phero mix LOL. Remember that we as men have to be careful with what we do these days. We\'re so afraid of reading the \"signals\" the wrong way and being accused of un-invited sexual advances. Women\'s lib is fine, but christ, now we\'re just twice as confused! I am woman, hear me roar, and don\'t you dare touch me.... but if you don\'t take me know and f*ck the shite out of me you\'re not aggressive enough. It makes my head spin.

[**DONOTDELETE**]

Glad to hear it Krish. This is the \"undeclared\" minor that you will be studying in college [img]/ubbthreads/images/icons/wink.gif[/img] along with keg-tapping 101.

[**DONOTDELETE**]

The point is, you should Do What YOU want. And don\'t be afraid to be slapped down for it. So you make a move and get rebuffed. You live to make a move another day and find out it\'s not the end of the world.If I didn\'t know from experience there are guys who, if they want me, will show it, I might fool around with the guys who can\'t get up the nerve because they\'re afraid of my rejection or afraid of looking stupid or afraid of whatever they\'re afraid of, but those guys are all caught up in their heads. A guy who knows he wants me will make a move. A guy who wants me to take all the risk is not a gentleman...I\'m a bitch, I admit it (like anybody\'s surprised). But a bitch needs a strong hand, not someone she has to spoon feed... I\'m amending this ... it\'s not even a matter of whether or not I\'m a bitch. I wasn\'t mean to the guy in the slightest. I said earlier I \"kicked him out.\" I couldn\'t sit there any longer watching him zone in front of The Weather Channel. I patted him on the leg and asked if he was ok, suggested maybe he needed to go home and get some sleep. He said uh, ok, yeah, and got up and ambled out, apologized that he was so out of it. We had joked around that it didn\'t matter what movie he brought over because we wouldn\'t be watching it anyway. ... he had a good idea ahead of time that I wanted to play, and ostensibly, that\'s what he was interested in, too. My apartment is immaculate, I\'m not kidding, there is not one surface anywhere you couldn\'t eat off of. Gleaming floors, wood you can see yourself in, a couple of candles lit, the overhead lights off and the indirect lighting on, I was completely groomed head to toe, clean, silky, shining hair, a little makeup carefully applied, perfect manicure, perfect pedicure, soft, and scented. I think it was clear I made some effort. I complimented him on his choice of movie. I tried to start conversation but he wouldn\'t hold up his end. I took my slipper off, he was sitting fairly close, I was sitting next to him in a half lotus and the sole of my clean, soft, bare foot with red toenail polish facing toward him, (I\'m describing my foot because I want you to know it\'s not like it was funky) and I start absent mindedly rubbing my foot. How easy it would have been for him to say, \"Here, let me do that.\" How easy it would have been to move from foot rub to leg rub to home free. Nothing. I get up and go to the bathroom, come back, he\'s moved closer on the couch to where I was sitting. I sit back down and pick my brush up and brush my hair while watching the movie. Again, it\'s a prop. It would have been easy for him to say any number of things, does that feel good? yes. Do you want me to brush your hair? yes. Do you like your neck rubbed? yes Do you like your back rubbed? yes do you like your front rubbed? even better ... etc. Nothing.Several things went through my mind. I could have done the incendiary approach and sit myself on his lap, take off his glasses and ask him if he wants to play. I could have done the hold his face and kiss him. I could have put my bare foot in his crotch and asked him to rub it.But why? I can wait. I\'d rather wait than have to go through all that. I just would be more comfortable with someone more direct. It just didn\'t click, I guess. No big deal. The movie really was good. I\'d like to see it again.RR, how did Emotional Train Wreck Girl ruin what started out to be such a great night? if you feel like talking about it...

[Xehupatl]

well you know what they say:

marijuana in your brain
takes more time to ejaculate
roll up a spliff and throw away the day
with marijuana in your brain ....

[**DONOTDELETE**]

FTR - It sounds like you were giving hints even I couldn\'t miss! Damn I\'m getting horney just reading your post!!
as for my date story: OK here goes.
I told her (the night before) I\'d pick her up at 8:00. I called at 7:10 and she was asleep taking a nap! That threw me off, I had been primping for an hour, and I DON\"T PRIMP!! I showed up with flowers in hand (the thanksgiving bouquet) and she gave me a little hug along with \"I\'ve gotten more flowers in the last month than I have in my whole life and they are all from you\" which made me feel good. As soon as we got in my car it went down-hill. She started talking about other guys she dated, failed relationships,chemistry that wasn\'t there in other guys, etc...this carried on through dinner. We got to the restaurant and she knew the steward (??) and had a lengthy chat without bothering to introduce me. (can we say awkward!) the service sucked the food was OK, and then she saw someone from work she knew who stopped by the table with his girlfriend. My date chatted with him, and I chatted with his girlfriend (would have had a shot at her too [img]/ubbthreads/images/icons/wink.gif[/img] ). I basically suffered through dinner just wanting to get the hell out of there. Long story short: I took her home and she said \"I\'d invite you in but I have to take a shower and get ready to go out tonight\" WTF!!!!!! She couldn\'t be bothered to shower and get ready for a date??? This is a girl who flip-flops between being totally stoked that I asked her out and then ends up being a total waste of my time. Per my last post on this thread: GAME OVER! This little girl is a waste of my effort. I\'m glad I did it b\'cause now I can move on, but I still feel like a sucker. Someday I\'ll find a woman who appreciates the fact that there is chivalry in my blood, and love in my soul.

[**DONOTDELETE**]

I can\'t tell you how much I don\'t like this girl.

[jose]

Read Doc love\'s articles on http://www.askmen.com you could have avoided this whole thing from the very beginning.

[proteus]

See my take on this is there are two kinds of woman. The type of woman who has her head screwed on right and appreciates someone who is a gentleman as you tried to be (these are in the minority unfortunately - don\'t know whether it\'s always been this way but it seems lately a lot of the gals are really \"flakey\" - this crosses all ages too, not just the younger ones as I\'ve experienced this flakiness with one or two somewhat older women), and then the other type of woman who unless you really have a good grasp of the \"game\", you will never succeed with them.

From my perspective it\'s pretty clear that if she made that comment about the flowers, and hadn\'t even showered, told you she was going out after your \"date\" and would shower for that, well it\'s pretty clear that in her eyes you had \"supplicated\" too much, and she had no \"respect\" for you as a result.

When for a brief moment you were very direct ((when you asked her out on the date directly/confidently, behaving like a classic super-confident dominant alpha) she obviously responded very positively to this dynamic, but then she probably took into account all the other stuff as she thought about it (e.g. when she said she\'d never received so many flowers in a month - not good at all!! Too supplicant for this type of woman), and subconsciously had you categorised already, knew she had you if she wanted (=no challenge) hence the total lack of respect.

Next time with a woman like that never supplicate (no flowers until she\'s done something to really deserve them etc.) , call her on her bs, and if she\'s chatting up other guys during the course of the date, stand up, pay for your dinner and walk out. Women like this will walk all over you if you let them, and while it\'s classy to see the date through to the end, sometimes you just gotta make it clear to her that you have self-respect and won\'t tolerate this bs.

Anyway, read the stuff Jose suggested and check out some of the other often mentioned websites if you want to learn how to deal with women like this. Unfortunately, since they are in the majority, unless you learn this stuff, you will lead a very sporadic and unsuccessful dating life as I did for years until I made some changes to how I approached this kind of woman.

[**DONOTDELETE**]

God, I swear I hate to read posts like that. I can\'t argue with you because obviously this girl was as rude as RR says she was and obviously, Proteus, you\'ve been through the mill with some really rude women, but ... damn, sam. The thing is that you\'re then forced to be rude in return, and if you don\'t like yourself when you\'re rude, seems like you just end up cranky all around. Proteus, I so agree with you and your recommendations. I\'ve never heard of the kind of disrespect RR got shown and she would have more than deserved his getting up and walking out, and the kiss off was UNREAL, what a little bitch.But are you really telling me that\'s how most women treat most men?I guess my question is, if you see that someone\'s going to disrespect you just because they can, they have no standards of behavior for themselves, no code of honor. so to speak, why would you want to deal with them at all?I err too much on the side of \"no second chance,\" but ... reading these posts I\'m thinking maybe some guys could stand to learn to cut their losses sooner, too.

[proteus]

Well FTR I\'m in NY and hangout at the clubs/bars etc in the city practically every weekend, and unfortunately I see a lot of the ladies who are in this social scene who are like this. I don\'t get this disrespect (anymore I should lol) because from the getgo I present myself a certain way and have never had to walk out on a date because women like this know who they can do this stuff too without being called on it.

As to your specific question, why would I want to deal with this kind of woman? Well, it\'s simple - I don\'t intend to live a celibate life while I wait to find a decent woman, so I figure I will control the situation, control the dynamic so that I get what I want. I will play things very straight if the lady I\'m interested in shows me that she is non-flaky, honest etc. but if she is into all the bs, then I know how to handle her too and have no compunction about using all the \"skills\" I\'ve learnt to seduce her. There was a time when I said I would just wait for Ms.Right, but I went through a period where I didn\'t get laid for almost 2 yrs. coz even the ladies I figured were \"nice\" ended up doing the LJBF stuff, so that\'s when I began looking at some of those seduction sites, looked for phero sites etc. and now I can honestly say that I can very confidently deal with this kind of woman, and now it\'s the reverse - they chase me rather than vice versa.

you seem about as direct/non-flakey as women go FTR and I say this as a real compliment, but there are a lot of women who are so screwed up they don\'t have any idea of what they want from one moment to the next, will be friendly, all over you one minute, then next minute wonder what ever gave you the idea that they were interested in you in a sexual/romantic manner.

Let me give you an example. This gal I dated once (gorgeous gal, very tall, long legs, a redhead as a matter of fact lol) in college - typical NY kinda gal likes to club/movies etc. We go out on a lunch date, then we go out on a second date to dinner, a movie, she\'d been getting very close to me lots of mutual touching etc, no kissing yet, then as we are waiting for the movie to start she changes the subject to tattooes, tells me she has one. I don\'t say much, just something like \"interesting\" and she asks me if I want to see it. I say sure, why not, and figure maybe it was on her arm covered by her jacket. Well, she proceeds to unzip her pants, then slides them down, she\'s not wearing any panties and so is completely naked, and shows me the tattoo which is right next to her privates of privates (being polite here lol) . So of course I\'m stunned she\'d do this on the second date but I keep my cool, she lets me take a good look, asks me if I want to touch it which I do, then she zips them back, we watch the movie and I figure I have more than enough indications of interest and figure to try and make some moves that night and so later as we leave and go to my place I move in to kiss her etc. and she draws back and starts giving me that whatever made you think I wanted more than just to be friends crap :-) - (if I knew what I know now this would never have happened) and says I really like you etcetc. but lets just be friends okay, hangout, don\'t want to get \"involved\" right now. This to me is about as flaky as things get but this is the kind of bs that all too often gals around here will pull so unless you know how to maneuver, well you\'re pretty done for even before you get through the first date.

[**DONOTDELETE**]

No wonder some guys are \"confused.\" Dealing with psychos would kinda make you confused. I\'ve been sitting here feeling so guilty for cheering RR on -- I was completely convinced this girl was nuts about him -- then she pulls this stunt -- now I\'d really like to smack her around a little.


I hear what you\'re saying about if you wait for the right one, you\'ll be celibate, and you don\'t want a celibate life. My life is kind of celibate -- I don\'t get to have sex anywhere near as often as I\'d like to -- because I haven\'t made my mind up that it\'s important enough to me to have to deal with the stuff guys do with a woman who\'s direct, which is, either treat her with complete disrespect for being honest about her needs, or talk a bunch of crap and then get scared and do nothing. I\'m embarassed to tell you all the stuff Movie Guy wrote to me in IM\'s about what he likes to do, how giving he is in bed, etc etc. -- he\'s in his 30\'s and we even had a discussion wherein I asked him why he wanted to date a woman older than himself, did he have a Mrs. Robinson fantasy? because I\'m NOT Mrs. Robinson, I like a take-charge kind of guy ... I was very clear, or thought I was -- it\'s been almost two months now since I\'ve been touched by human hands, much less had sex, and it\'s to the point now I dream about it and I\'m feeling physically bad from deprivation -- Studly Do Right\'s on the west coast until the 30th, so no hope there -- and I decide out of desperation to take somebody up on his offer ... and then get led on by some guy who can\'t walk his talk. What happened to me is maybe a version of this girl who pulled her pants down and then said she just wanted to be friends. Mixed messages is putting it mildly. And that kind of thing happens a lot, which is why I don\'t take too many men up on their offers. Too often, it\'s a lot of talk. Or they want to treat me like a whore (and I don\'t even get paid...lol).

I\'m beginning to think maybe I\'m wrong about these how-to-deal-with-the-bitches sites. Maybe it really is as bad as you guys say it is.

Let\'s get T-shirts made up that say \"If you can\'t bite, don\'t growl.\"

[**DONOTDELETE**]

FTR - Thanks for all of your posts, I enjoy hearing your opinion on stuff. Like I said I\'m glad at least I can get this girl out of my system. I would be a little more concerned about how I handle women if I hadn\'t gotten laid a few times [img]/ubbthreads/images/icons/smile.gif[/img] over the summer. I still have a girl calling me from california, and I haven\'t seen her in three months! I think this situation was a fluke. There was some history with ETWG that goes back about 6 months. It wasn\'t until recently that I really liked her. This is strange for me because I rarely let myself get emotionally attached. My profession isn\'t exactly conducive to having a relationship, and I know and accept that. I haven\'t had a \"girlfriend\" in over three years, but I definately haven\'t suffered from celibacy. I\'m starting to wonder if I\'m only good at the short-term, but get slammed in the emotional relationship arena. A couple of things I have considered are: It\'s getting cold and I have been sitting in one place for a long time. Maybe I\'m sending out a sub-conscious desperation signal. In the summer when I was still new here I had a more cocky attitude. I\'ve never had a problem picking up a one-night-stand until now. I had a great night out last night. I ended up showing a girl around \"my place\" and she left me her home phone # ... but I didn\'t seal the deal. That has never happened before. Usually once I get a girl here she melts down and I\'m in like flint. So whatever message I\'m sending ETWG isn\'t the only one who\'s reading me funny. I don\'t entirely blame her (Emotional Train Wreck Girl) notice the nickname I have given her. This was trouble from the start, but the RescueRanger thought he could heel her heart and make everything all better. Oh well - time to mave on. I just need to get back in touch with my inner cocky-bastard.

PS - Yes it\'s really that bad out there.