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Thread: Reved up SOE

  1. #1
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    Default Reved up SOE

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    JKOHL, is there anyway that you can make a reved up version of SOE that contains stealth None in the mix? i think you would have the ultimate product as so many of us get great results with SOE when we had in either TE or some none for that matter....i would love it personally as the smell of SOE you cant improve on, like maybe just for us none freaks...

  2. #2
    Bodhi Satva CptKipling's Avatar
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    Default Re: Reved up SOE

    You could just mix with AE or some other stealth -none product. Old AE has a fragrance which is undetectable after about an hour.

  3. #3
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    Default Re: Reved up SOE

    Stealth *none product? What do you mean, I thought *none has a horrible scent w/out fragrance?

    - Krish

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    Bodhi Satva CptKipling's Avatar
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    Default Re: Reved up SOE

    When people say stealth -none, they are normally talking about Stone Labs -none, which has been scrubbed of certain impurities.

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    PheroWizard oscar's Avatar
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    Default Re: Reved up SOE

    Jamboot,

    I wouldn\'t hold my breath waiting for JVKohl to come out with an SOE with A-None, but I am curious to see his response.
    Your best bet is to get hold of one of the 10mL. bottles of 1mg/mL A-None (that are on the frequent buyers page at $89) and spike SOE to your own specs. This way you get to vary the ratios as well.

    On the subject of Stone A-None\'s stealth, when I first got the chem-set and got a whiff of the A-None, I estimated that it was probably about half as stinky as Primal Instinct. That\'s not bad, since it\'s got twice the concentration.
    If I were to do a commercial for Stone None, I\'d say something like, \" ...75% LESS cat-pissy than the leading brand!\", because if it\'s half as stinky at twice the strength, then it would be 1/4 as stinky if cut to the same concentration as PI.

    That having been said, you still must be careful even when mixing Stone A-None with SOE. Those musk components in SOE will allow a mix that smells good TODAY, with the A-None fully covered, to become a stinker tomorrow or the next day.
    Even though the A-None smell of Stone\'s stuff is far less pronounced than other less clean A-None products, SOE\'s ingredients WILL latch onto the A-None smell and amplify it over time.

    It\'s as though there\'s an ongoing chemical reaction going on in a mixture of SOE and any A-none product. A-None\'s aroma just seems to proliferate in SOE. This isn\'t necessarily a bad thing, it just requires some management.

    I\'d suggest small batches, either used immediately, or allowed to age subject to further adjustment.

    Oscar [img]/ubbthreads/images/icons/smile.gif[/img]


  6. #6
    Enlightened One
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    Default Re: Reved up SOE

    The stealth -anone would be the stone labs chem set or even NPA which is a component of DD#1 and also DD Lite.

    DD#1 = 70% SOE and 30% NPA
    DD lite = 95% SOE and 5% NPA.

    Hope that helps or just get alter ego for men and go for it with SOE in a 50:50 mix. Some of the less purified -anone mixes can stink to high hell sometimes.

  7. #7
    PheroWizard oscar's Avatar
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    Default Re: Reved up SOE

    Watcher,

    Read this at normal speed please.

    NPA is in no way a \"Stealthful\" A-None product.

    It stinks nearly as badly as Primal Instinct does.

    When you feel compelled to post pure babble, or mere parrot-like echoings of prior posts, that\'s one thing. I\'m used to that.

    When you start giving bad information that\'s something else.

    Let your mind catch up with your fingers and try proofreading your posts.

    WHY would you have said that? Do you really not know? Or are you just so obsessed with cranking out a certain number of posts each day that you think the content doesn\'t matter?

    Oscar



  8. #8
    Phero Pharaoh BassMan's Avatar
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    Default Re: Reved up SOE

    <blockquote><font class=\"small\">In reply to:</font><hr>

    NPA is in no way a \"Stealthful\" A-None product.

    It stinks nearly as badly as Primal Instinct does.

    <hr></blockquote>I think there\'s another factor to be considered here, too. I went in to the office with about 8 dabs of PPA on today. I had added RM scent to old PPA to make \"new\" PPA. And I figured 8 dabs to be not too bad of a dose, especially since I couldn\'t smell the \"stealth\" none at all.

    Wrong.

    I had classic OD symptoms most of the morning - folks nervously avoiding me, except for two middle-aged (and presumably, smell-challenged) women, who couldn\'t get enough of me. About noon, I got tired of it, washed about 1/2 of it off (my hands and wrists) and went back to a more acceptable none response.

    Don\'t believe that just because you can\'t smell \"clean\" none that it is safer. I can still OD real easy on the stuff.

  9. #9
    PheroWizard oscar's Avatar
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    Default Re: Reved up SOE

    BassMan,

    I\'m curious. How much RM did you add to the old PPA? And how did it smell?

    Oscar [img]/ubbthreads/images/icons/smile.gif[/img]

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    Banned User jvkohl's Avatar
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    Default Re: Reved up SOE

    Bruce and I discussed SOE with -none; but I\'m still very concerned about adding it. Best bet is Oscar\'s approach--get the chem set and experiment. The biggest problem is that -ol converts to -none. So, even
    with SOE, you will get some -none effects after you\'ve worn it a while. No, don\'t ask how long. Come on,
    folks, the time line will vary with your body temperature, level of hygeine--too many other factors to mention.

    I wasn\'t aware that Stone Labs was doing anything different with -none preparation (e.g., stealth -none).
    The -rone available from Sigma is 99%+ pure, don\'t know about -none, but it\'s hard to imagine 1% of the
    molecules creating a stinky problem, especially with dilution to 1 mg/ml. But I\'m not a chemist or perfumer.
    Phil, at Stone Labs, knows what he\'s doing, I\'m sure.

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    Default Re: Reved up SOE

    If jkohl has reason to not add -none then I have to go with him on that. If you look at the supposed \"best\" mixes made on this forum like JB#1 or the new PAN and they all seem pretty -none heavy but the thing that supposedly makes those work is the \"secret\" ingredients in NPA and not really the -none.

    Same goes for TE. Numerous people say they get no hits from PI or RM alone and lots of people are successful with SoE alone. So if jkohl did all this research that shows negative reactions to -none then I have to believe that. I haven\'t read too many hits from a -none only product and the only mixes as I said before, is mixing with NPA or TE because of the \"secrets\" in there and we don\'t even know for sure how much -none is being used as it doesn\'t take much -none to make a product \"stink\"

  12. #12
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    Default Re: Reved up SOE

    1) Couplins negate bad effects of -none. (PCC and EW)
    2) Phil stone who is another leading researcher recommeneds a smaller amount of -none in his products.
    (AE/PPA/Any other products he sells P10 etc)

  13. #13
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    Default Re: Reved up SOE

    My uneducated guess is that different levels of -none will attract different kind of women. Some women are always looking for \'\'the bigest male\'\' but let`s not forget those who are more shy, quiet and cuddly who may prefer to avoid those \'\'agressive looking (smelling) alpha-males\'\'.

    I`m secretely testing reactions amongst my friends...

  14. #14
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    Default Re: Reved up SOE

    Watcher, I would say your \"rules\" vary with the person.
    1) For me -none negates the effects of Copulins; not the other way around. JB1 is the only thing that a bit of is okay. Any other -none product negates the effects of my EW.
    2) While I am sure many people love AE, it has never done anything good for me. I hope SOE does not ever see any -none in it. There is no need for it. If people want -none we got -none products coming out the ying yang. We can use it complement whatever other products we want.

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    Default Re: Reved up SOE

    ---------------------------------------------------------------
    it\'s hard to imagine 1% of the molecules creating a stinky problem, especially with dilution to 1 mg/ml.
    ---------------------------------------------------------------

    Yep, I hear ya. Nonetheless, my nose tells me that Sigma -none is significantly smellier than Stone Labs -none. If I crack open a fresh bottle of P10, about all I can really detect is a faint alcohol smell - definitely not the case with other pheromone preparations featuring close to the same amount of -none.

    All I know is what my nose knows. lol



  16. #16
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    Default Re: Reved up SOE

    MadMaxx - I\'m in the same boat with you on your AE opinion, hasn\'t done a thing for me. And, you can add AFA to that pile as well. TE &amp; SOE do work well as cornerstones for me.

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    Phero Pharaoh BassMan's Avatar
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    Default Re: Reved up SOE

    <blockquote><font class=\"small\">In reply to:</font><hr>

    I\'m curious. How much RM did you add to the old PPA? And how did it smell?

    <hr></blockquote>Not RM, RM-scent. The scent used in RM and purportedly, in new PPA.

    10 drops (from the RM-scent dropper) into a 1 dram bottle of PPA. It smells good. I have it right here in my pocket. I would think it smells somewhat like new PPA, but I don\'t have new PPA to compare it to.

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    Doctor of Scentology DrSmellThis's Avatar
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    Default Re: Reved up SOE

    In the world of perfume chemistry 1% can often make a huge difference. Imagine adding 1% EW to another smell, for instance; even if the resulting mix was hugely diluted.

    I don\'t see how Phil Stone is recommending \"smaller\" -none. Quite the opposite seems true to me. Look at p10 or Rogue Male.

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    Default Re: Reved up SOE

    <blockquote><font class=\"small\">In reply to:</font><hr>

    The -rone available from Sigma is 99%+ pure, don\'t know about -none, but it\'s hard to imagine 1% of the
    molecules creating a stinky problem, especially with dilution to 1 mg/ml. But I\'m not a chemist or perfumer.

    <hr></blockquote>Rather pure reagents in the organic world are often described as \"four nines,\" or 99.99%. The difference in price, availability, and suitability for a particular purpose between 99% pure and 99.99% pure is enormous.


  20. #20
    Banned User jvkohl's Avatar
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    Default Re: Reved up SOE

    Agreed. At some point, however, you must decide it\'s pure enough. Though a potent mix like EW can have tremendous effects, it\'s still unlikely that a 1% impurity would present a problem. I\'m not saying it couldn\'t but in most cases, I doubt anyone takes the time to determine exactly what the impurity is. Acutally, the Erox/Pherin
    chemist once told me that -rone has no odor. He attributed any consciously perceived odors to the impurity factor. But then, he\'s used to working with picogram amounts, not milligrams/milliliter. The vomeronasal/vomeropherin angle is a very different approach than the androgen metabolite/hormone response/behavioral response. Some research now indicates that vomeropherins might effect behavior, but so far no pathway for them to do so has been defined; there\'s no connection to the limbic system, though there are some hormonal effects. Tricky stuff to decipher but there remains two scientific \"camps\": one focussed on vomeropherins, the other focussed on hormone effects from the androstenes, or behavioral effects in general.

  21. #21
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    Default Re: Reved up SOE

    How can there be no delivery to the limbic system when you inhale pheromones straight up your nose and into your brain?

  22. #22
    Banned User jvkohl's Avatar
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    Default Re: Reved up SOE

    To date; no connection between the human VNO and any other structure in the brain has been demonstrated. The human VNO is referred to as a blind pouch for this reason. It\'s just there. That\'s why my focus has always been on the hormone response, which affects all of the limbic system. By focussing on the hormone response, all the controversy over the presence (and now the function) of the human VNO is eliminated, allowing progress to be made. Those who are caught up in the VNO controversy are still trying to persuade other researchers that it must somehow be connected. Accordingly, their products can be the only true pheromone products--because they stimulate the VNO. That\'s marketing for ya\'. In contrast, I.Savic et al, showed that two of Berliner\'s vomeropherins had different effects in male compared to female brains with focus on the all important medial preoptic area (MPOA), where LeVay found a neuroanatomical difference between hetero/homo males and women. There are also studies that show, in other mammals and in humans, pheromones can act via the main olfactory system, rather than only by a VNO-connected accessory olfactory system. This stuff is not for the faint of heart, however. For example, drawing from Savic\'s work, I detailed how the development of male homosexual orientation is a function of pheromones and olfaction. Trouble is, the neuroscientific details of this article (published in two parts in Across Species Comparisons and Psychopathology) are so complex as to preclude understanding -- at least by most. The depth of the article presents no problem to those who have studied the biological basis of behavior for a few years, but there just ain\'t that many of us around. (I\'ve asked permission to distribute the article for those who have, and am awaiting a response from the ASCAP editor.) So, unfortunately, that leaves us waiting for some journalist to poorly interpret the message, and then offer it to the mass media. You can bet I\'ll catch some flack when that happens. Thankfully, I\'m real cocky these days--and have lots of support from the real neuroscience heavyweights, in case I run into trouble. In any case, if anyone trys to argue such issues with me; they\'re going to lose. That\'s why debate takes so little time nowadays that I can spend time on the Forum. It used to be that nearly all my time was spent in debate with other researchers. I\'m having lots more fun, now. Can ya\' tell?

  23. #23
    Phero Pharaoh
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    Default Re: Reved up SOE

    Well, how about creating a seperate version of SoE, one with the original pheros and 1 with all three pheros. I wonder what ppl would think of that.

    - Krish

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    Default Re: Reved up SOE

    Alter ego exists with all 3 pheros. ALthough if james kohl could come up with new compounds then perhaps it may take off as well. Development and discusssion is the best way and jkohl has believers here who understand his approach and science based arguments and the forum presents a new front on which to push the correct theroy without running into \"researcher attack syndrome\" by those caught up with the VNO mind war type of belief system. Two seperate belief systems fighting it out, although some are prepared to adapt to better and more refined arguments and presentations.

    http://www.anitadoth.myby.co.uk/anita%20doth_2%20u%20downloads.htm

  25. #25
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    Default Re: Reved up SOE

    Yeah, I think the main three products I\'ll ever buy from here is SoE, AE, and NPA. I just recently bought SoE.

    Well, since some people suggested that SoE had *none in it, I just thought this solution would make both parties happy. You could have SoE-original and SoE-new, you know? I mean, I think SoE would then be able to compete with AE, and hell, if a version of SoE comes out that has *none in it, that\'ll be my one stop source of pheros right there.

    - Krish

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