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Thread: Androstadienone

  1. #31
    PheroWizard oscar's Avatar
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    Default Re: Androstadienone

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    Gents,

    There\'s loads of info on A-dienone available through research links on old posts authored by Truth back in Nov. and Dec.\'01, and some have been bumped up to much lower numbered pages.
    At the time I thought he was posessed, but I\'ve since gone back and checked a lot of them out. They\'re definitely worth a read. Seems A-dienone was most often classified as a \"mood enhancer\" for women, by those doing the studies.

    If the stuff stinks like A-None as Thunder stated, I\'ll probably add cologne at 9:1 or 10:1, as I do with the chem-kit A-None which is also 1mg/mL.

    Oscar [img]images/icons/laugh.gif[/img]

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    Default Re: Androstadienone

    I wanna here result\"S\" from Thunder using Androstadienone.

    Travis

    [ March 13, 2002: Message edited by: Travis ]

  3. #33
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    Well, I bit, and I suppose the stuff will surprise me in the mail. One detail I have to note, it is mg, not Mg. Mg is megagrams (10^6 g) or magnesium, depending on yer slant.

    I am guessing that it is 10 mg of -dienone in 10 mL\'s of alcohol. Why would Stone Labs change their MO? And at 1mg/mL it would work out identical to the chem kits. As far as the smell, well, I guess we will have to wait on that one.

    Application notes I have mustered... I have a hard time getting too excited about this. I am pretty sure that each applicator will behave differently. The only way to really test it, is to fill it up with alcohol, weigh it and spray/dab, reweigh about 5-10 times to see how much is missing. Of course you\'d have to weigh the empty container also to get the weight of your mix. You would also need a very expensive reagent grade balence, and a lot of patience. I start to get a headache when I get to thinking about how to take care of all the varibles. I guess my point is, start small and find what works for you.

  4. #34
    Administrator Bruce's Avatar
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    Default Re: Androstadienone

    http://love-scent.com/kits/extra/order.html
    25 sold in the first 24 hours,
    so 75 left.
    Sold a lot of the chem sets too. Down to 15 of those, but can order more of either.

    Bruce

  5. #35
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    Hey Bruce, you said something along the lines of restricting what was posted about -dienone. Well, as one of 26 people who are going to have the stuff so far (Remember Thunder has a nice stash too) do we get any ground rules about what is permittable to talk about? And quite honestly, I know that a lawsuit would make life a real pain in the rear, but I seem to remember something about 1st Amendment rights... I was just curious to see what your take on the subject was.

  6. #36
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    well, I think it\'s 10mg of -dienone in 10ml of alcohol (or possibly oil?) , c.f. with PI which has 5mg in 10ml , so its a little strong for direct application, but fine for adding to a cologne or diluting with some ethanol.

    Thunder was the first to bite the bullet and experimentaly try a few Mg of raw crystals, which he mixed with ethanol (IIRC), so were pretty much talking about the same thing.

    dosage wise, I think there is something mentioned in the patents about amount used, IIRC dosage for most pheros is meant to be optimum by applying about 0.02Mg of product (Right?) and this stuff probably wants a lower dosage. Id play with 0.01Mg doses to start with, you can always double no. of sprays if its ineffective (at least if you dilute w/ ethanol and apply cologne separately) make a small batch (i.e. a few drops if possible) in a vial or atomiser and play.

    anybody want to do the maths for how much ethanol ( or alcohol) to add to a 10mL bottle if you were looking to get 0.02Mg per spray / drop / dab / bucket or whatever your favourite method of application is? What did scientist estimate one spray and one dab to be in mL volumes again? If I get bored with doing real work again I\'ll go back and try to find em and work it all out.

    I really should look back and remember my molarities and concentration calculations [img]images/icons/crazy.gif[/img] [img]images/icons/laugh.gif[/img]


    BTW , how do you feel about us discussing this on your forum bruce? Im sure someone could spare some semi-anonymous server space and set up a -dienone forum to keep things safer legaly, but I can see reasons you wouldent want to encourage this idea too. Balls in your court, and thanks for bringing us this product, I just hope its as good as we hope. [img]images/icons/laugh.gif[/img]

    Pheros are fun [img]images/icons/cool.gif[/img] [img]images/icons/tongue.gif[/img]

    [ March 13, 2002: Message edited by: Nutz ]

  7. #37
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    well, as a patent attorney, I think I can see what Bruce is doing but will keep my own council. I wouldn\'t worry too much about that side of things...........

  8. #38
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    Default Re: Androstadienone

    Naughty,
    Drop me an e-mail. I\'d like to hear what you have to say on the issue. Rather not go into it on the forum too much.
    From what I figure, the worst that could happen would be to have to stop selling the stuff, and even that is not very likely. Once this thread disappears, which it will at some point, it is not even being sold to the public. There are chemical houses all over the US selling this chemical, the trick being that it is just a chemical and nothing more with no claims of usefulness whatsoever. It could be argued that openly selling it on the Love Scent site implies certain claims, so we are not doing that.
    As far as future discussions, some suggestions have been made already. Maybe I can keep an eye out and do some editing when needed to make sure they are followed. How about giving it a product name like \"Andro 10\" or something like that?
    Cheers,
    Bruce

  9. #39
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    Hey, I\'m back! Bruce was nice enough to reinstate me, even though I flew off the handle on him and was behind some of the \"mischief\". =P. Anyway, we\'ve come to an understanding, and the real issues are actually much more minor than I had thought. Anyway, very sorry Bruce!

    Well, so much to catch up, especially on the -dienone!

    Back to Thunder... I am also sorry that things didn\'t work out for you with selling -dienone. However, I really don\'t think there\'s real money to be made with -dienone, due to patent issues. I hope the -dienone works for us and gives us something else to play with, but no matter how successful it is, Bruce will probably have to continue to sell it as a small-time operation through word of mouth on this forum.

    As far as who started the -dienone thing, no one can claim being first, since Realm was talked about from the beginning of this forum (June 2001?). I joined the forum back in November and started the first big wave of -dienone talk, but it died down since no one had access to it outside of Realm for Women. One day, I was reading a paper on -dienone and saw that the authors got the -dienone from Steraloids, Inc. I found their website and posted the link to the forum, hoping somebody like you would pursue it. Judging from the seriousness of the Steraloids site, I didn\'t think it was worth pursuing myself. I had no interest in selling it like you and Bruce -- I just wanted to be the happy end user! Anyway, no one pursued the -dienone after I posted the link to Steraloids back in December.

    So when you came on this forum last month and said that you had purchased -dienone from Steraloids, I naturally I assumed you got the tip from my earlier post. However, apparently, you got their independently and wasn\'t even aware of the earlier talk of -dienone, probably because the search function on this forum doesn\'t work for posts prior to this year (anyway to fix this, Bruce?). Anyway, I was cheering you on all the way! I just wanted somebody to supply the -dienone.

    Now, I\'m also happy that Bruce will be supplying us the -dienone, and at a lower price than Steraloids ($80 for 10 mg!). Thunder, I think we all do owe you thanks for creating the second wave of -dienone talk, which generated enough excitement, so that we weren\'t denied this time! Thank you. Thank you!

  10. #40
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    Well, according to literature, -dienone is the most prominent androgen component in human axillary sweat (slightly ahead of -none). So, calling -dienone \"Andro 1\" would be even more appropriate. =)

  11. #41
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    I like \"Phero X\" [img]images/icons/tongue.gif[/img]

  12. #42
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    Default Re: Androstadienone

    Andro 1 might be more practical as phero x might look a little suspicious? Imagine you are a spy in a foreign country. Would you want to call yourself \"Mr. X\"? [img]images/icons/smile.gif[/img]
    Bruce

  13. #43
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    Default Re: Androstadienone

    Truth,

    I\'m GLAD you are back....

    Travis [img]images/icons/smile.gif[/img]

  14. #44
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    How about Andro X ? It is the roman numeral for 10, and also has the \"In Like Flint\" spy appeal. Just a thought.

  15. #45
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    I just wanted to let everyone know I recieved my bottle of Natural Attraction pillow spray today and it smells really good. I do smell a slight -none type scent after a few minutes which might be the -dienone. As soon as I get the -dienone I ordered, I\'m gonna spike a small portion of it with some extra -dienone and apply it as cologne. Seeing as how the scent was probably engineered to go along with the scent of -dienone, I think it will mask it nicely if it does happen to smell as rank as Thunder says it does. Just to let you know Bruce, I am still very loyal to your company and only decided to get this stuff because it was a pillow spray, which was something I hadn\'t seen here, not to mention that it contained -dienone and I was very eager to test it in some form for a small amount of money. If only I had waited a few more days, I could have just skipped the Natural Attraction and bought only the -dienone from you. Anyway, I hope i get some good results when I finally get the stuff. It sounds really promising considering the results Thunder had. I\'m glad that you decided to carry it for us here in the forum.

    -Andy

  16. #46
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    Ditto. I got my pillow spray also. I actually don\'t like the smell too much, though it\'s OK. It smells a lot like a cheap version of Jovan Musk2. Don\'t know if I should say anymore, but I look forward to getting the raw -dienone. =).

  17. #47
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    Thunder, we\'d all like to hear more about your continuing -dienone experiments. From my understanding, it\'s been several weeks now. Did your miraculous results the first weekend continue? What\'s your current opinion?

  18. #48
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    First of all Thanks for the props Truth. You are right I was not aware of you starting the first thread on -dienone. I did put a alot of time into this, trying to set up something, but alas. Did you get the kind of responses like I did. I found that approx 15ml mixed with 5 mg was way to strong. I used the raw crystals. Not aware if their is another form. I never did figure out how much weight my atomizer was spitting out with each spray so I\'m not sure if I went over the .05 limit or not. The mist is fine and short bursts so I don\'t think it was to much. I sprayed some on a shirt and did not wear it and could still smell it 4 days later. I sprayed it on a shirt I wore and sweat in and it lasted about 2.5 to 3 days. This was one spray. I sprayed 2.5 shots on me before dancing and I had to go to the bathroom to wash some off. It will be interesting to see what come from Phil&Bruce. My brother has been in town for the past couple of weeks and he is 17 so no club action. Not even all nighters(rave type). I have been wearing it though trying it with different combonations of -mones. Women are very warm with -dienone alone. Mixed results with combose. Probably do not have the mixtures down right yet. Remember not alot of real personal space testing in the last couple of weeks though. He\'s gone now so I will resume. I\'m 32 so we had kind of a generation gap going. Oh yeah, alot more looks at the gym. Girls, sometimes guys, using the machine right next to me when there is a whole gym full of open equip.
    Need more time for study. I\'m not sure if it\'s just me but when I was using it everyday I think it started to irritate the skin on my neck. Again speculation as I have hypersensitive skin do to acne medication. I am glad that people give me kuddo\'s for starting the thread. Do those things cap at 140 because it\'s been like that for a while. Since Bruce kinda snuffed my request for sales and went with Phil who has better suppliers and more knowledge, he has been kind enough to offer me some sort of deal to get in on the action since I did create alot of interest in the product, which seemed to be a dead deal until I started my obsessively driven ivestigation. Now it seems many people are very interested, Id like to think it something to do with me,not cocky, I know it did.I know I\'m rather new to this industry but I do have business sense and for the nature of my field am still going to school...sigh...so when I study something, including papers, questions, answers, and any other sourcr of knowledge I learn quickly and actually have a very good understanding of the subject including the Anatomical side. Bottom line. I\'m not dead yet, just temporarily frustrated and trying to get caught up on all the stuff I neglected. Thanks everyone for your support. I hope you find the success that I had. Remeber they still won\'t come running, but if you have game enough to inter personal space, your in.

    [ March 15, 2002: Message edited by: Thunder ]

  19. #49
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    Glad to see you back Thunder.

    Too bad you haven\'t been able to test -dienone out to a great extent. I\'m sure there will be an explosion two weeks from now, when the rest of us crazies get our hands on it.

    I don\'t know what you meant when you asked if I got responses like you did? With -dienone? The thread? I definitely didn\'t get any lengthy threads going with -dienone. Like I said, getting the raw form didn\'t seem imminent, so there was no excitement. As far as max thread length, I\'m pretty sure there has been even longer threads than the -dienone thread you started. There used to be something called the \"hit parade\" that would go on forever, until someone started another thread.

    As far as responses with -dienone, I still believe that Realm for Women may be the only product which did something for me. I never got great results with Edge, SOE, NPA like the other guys here. I sometimes wonder if it\'s related to my theory that -dienone conditions the responses of all the other pheros through sexual experience. I tend to like more conservative girls who\'s conditioned responses might not be so strong.

    So, you mixed 5 mg in 15 ml of solution and sprayed it. Did you add cologne?! Well, this would be a 0.333 mg/ml solution. Scientist had once calculated that a spray is approx 0.13 ml, so one spray would give you 0.43 mg -- already more than twice the believed optimal dose. However, I think the optimal dose on clothing might be higher than on skin due to lower release rate.

    By the way, from the Realm patents, it\'s inferred that Realm for Women contains somewhere between 1-25 ug of -dienone per ml (0.001-0.025 mg/ml). I know it\'s a big range, but at least we have a starting point. Let\'s assume that the -dienone concentration is the max at 0.025 mg/ml. That\'s still less than 1/10th the concentration of your mix. Of course, the reason Realm for Women is so weak could be because it\'s designed to primarily affect the wearer, so it doesn\'t need to radiate so much.

  20. #50
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    So to get the ‘ industry standard’ 0.02 mg from one hit of an atomiser spray you need about 0.2mg per 0.13ml which would work out as about 7 or 8 sprays per ml, meaning you need 0.02mg * 7-8 in one ml of solvent ( cologne, ethanol etc: ) or 0.16 mg per 1 ml.

    Soo. If you wanted to get 0.16 mg /ml you’d take 1 Mg of the 1mg/ml phero your playing with, and add 1mg / 0.16ml , or 6.25ml of solvent per 1mg of product.

    That gives you 6.25 ml of liquid, with a concentration of 0.16mg/ml giving 50 sprays from an atomiser, each dispensing 0.13ml of liquid containing 0.02Mg of pheromone.

    Rember, were starting with a 1mg/ml solution, so there’s already some alcohol present effectively, 1ml per ml of phero you want to mix. So take away 1 ml of solvent for every ml your mixing, i.e. to make a 0.16 mg/ml solution you’d add 5.25ml of solvent to your 1ml of pheromone solution.


    Id probably mix a batch using 0.5mg of phero to start with, giving 25 sprays and having to add 2.125 of solvent. You might also want to aim to get a 0.02mg/ml dose from 2 sprays, ie. Get a 0.053mg/ml solution by adding 0.5 mg of phero to 11.5 ( 12.5 – 1 ml, for the alcohol already in the pheromone mix)

    Ok, I think that right, but make sure you correct it if its not [img]images/icons/laugh.gif[/img]
    It’s based on 0.02mg being the optimum dose, which is from memory, so could be wrong.

    oh, and If I did my usual trick of saying M ( mega) rather than m ( milli ) , then use m [img]images/icons/shocked.gif[/img] damn units [img]images/icons/laugh.gif[/img]

    [ March 15, 2002: Message edited by: Nutz ]

  21. #51
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    if anyone does get their hands on the androstadienone, what\'s the most ideal solvent to keep it in as an additive? just a passing thought.. cos I\'m more interested in the details than te concept.

  22. #52
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    I\'ve found 20cc(ethonol, or cologne) to 5mg of -dienone works for me. Lets see how Stone Labs turns out, maybe he has a different form of the chem. I used crystals.

    [ March 15, 2002: Message edited by: Thunder ]

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    Nutz, I think it\'s more important to blend a ratio of cologne (solvent) to -dienone that masks the smell of the -dienone. Getting the 0.02 mg in one spray may not be feasible. 2 sprays is probably better.

  24. #54
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    Damn good mathmatics you got going on there Nutz. Which atomizers are you talking about though. 50 sprays from what kind of Atom.
    I am not using the one\'s on the site.

  25. #55
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    Yeah, 2 (+) sprays is certainly a good idea ( I did mention it, but I defiantly don’t blame you if you got bored half way through [img]images/icons/laugh.gif[/img] ).

    If your blending with cologne, you want to be careful you don’t make the solution too weak that you reek of cologne but have a low phero signature however, which is why using plain alcohol may be better for experiments, with cologne added separately to cover up afterwards.

    The atomizers are the ones bruce currently sells ( I think) scientist worked it out by squirting some alcohol out of one into a cap, and sucking up the liquid. I have a feeling the original thread has been lost in the recent trouble.

    Dunno if they would hold enough liquid for a whole 50 sprays in one bottle though, that stuff was just some rules of thumb for myself and anyone else who wants to have some figures to play with, the maths should be good though.

    truths bang on about masking the scent, you said that it smelt strong thunder, did you add any cologne to mask, was it a lot? It\'s an important factor, but its also pretty subjective so maths doesn’t work as well on that [img]images/icons/laugh.gif[/img]

    Personally I\'d prefer to keep the cologne at my normal level ( i.e. pretty low, being a young U.K. male we tend not to wear any or very little. deodorant is the \'smell\' of choice nowadays ( not v. good with pheros though [img]images/icons/smile.gif[/img] ) I’d probably apply a light coat of cologne on top of the phero. I figure that if the phero is doing its job then the target wont care if there’s a slightly strange, yet likable smell around me. most people seem to think sweat is the nearest smell to a lot of pheros (right?) but who cares if a girl thinks your sweating if she thinks you smell great at the same time [img]images/icons/wink.gif[/img] .

    Anyhow, I guess thunders the only one who can talk about covering the scent at the moment, all of this is conjecture and common sense until we see some real product! [img]images/icons/smile.gif[/img]


    BTW, if my calculations were correct, that means that there are 500 applications at 0.02mg dosage in that bottle! [img]images/icons/laugh.gif[/img] that gotta be a years supply! [img]images/icons/shocked.gif[/img] [img]images/icons/tongue.gif[/img] are we sure I got it right?

    [ March 16, 2002: Message edited by: Nutz ]

  26. #56
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    JOBOO, so has the pillow spray been working for you? My results have been mixed. I like the scent of Realm for Women a lot better, even though it\'s kind of feminine, so I might go back to it. Anyway, this is all for pre-trials before the -dienone concentrate arrives. =)

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    Truth,

    Well, I haven\'t noticed too many results except its effects on me. I have had some really wierd dreams lately. Also, a girl from school, who is also a close friend, came over to work on a group project the other day. We did the work in my room and about 10 minutes into the work, I felt like I was having a panic attack! Something about the way she smelled brought back memories of my ex girlfriend (who I greatly miss) and it was driving me nuts. Needless to say, that night I had a dream about the girl who is in my group. I asked her what perfume she was wearing and she said it was \"Lucky You\". I think my ex girlfriend used to wear that also. I don\'t know if it was just the plain smell of the perfume ot the fact that we were sitting on my bed and I was possibly picking up the phero\'s as well as her cologne, reminding me of all the messing around me and my ex used to do in that bed. So, thats all I\'ve noticed lately. If phero\'s are involved in this, It might be the estratetranol (did I spell that right)...It is supposed to be included in the spray along with -dienone. I hope someone else can figure out whats going on here.

    -Andy

  28. #58
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    J0B00,
    Sleep can be affected according to study nr 3 on this page: \"...under the vaginal secretion they tend to sleep more restless.\"

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    JOBOO, interesting comments about the dreams. In the deleted Natural Attraction thread, somebody had also commented about having sexual dreams when spraying his pillow. Was that you? If not, then we have multiple people experiencing the same thing.

    The pillow spray is interesting because it\'s implied to contain both -dienone and estra-. The first few days I wore it, I also believed that it lifted my mood. However, it hasn\'t affected me as much the last few days. Maybe, wearing the pheromones of the opposite sex 24 hours a day, eventually blunts your response them. That\'s not good for the people at Erox who plan to use these pheromones as mood elevators. It may also affect your romance life. Not good...

    How would you compare the pillow spray to Realm for Women. I\'m not convinced it\'s better even though I\'m able to use much more of it. Maybe, the estra- interferes with -dienone signal. =P.

  30. #60
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    Default Re: Androstadienone

    JOBOO, have you been using the pillow spray on your clothing or your pillow?

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