Work

[Bruce]

This quote on the nature of work is

reputed to be over 3000 years old:

---
What is work? What is beyond work? Even some seers see this not

aright. I will teach thee the truth of pure work, and this truth shall make thee free.

Know, therefore what

is work, and also know is wrong work. And know also of a work that is silence. Mysterious is the path of work.



The man who in his work finds silence, and who sees that silence is work, this man in truth sees the Light

and in all his works finds peace.

He whose undertakings are free from anxious desire and fanciful thought,

whose work is made pure in the fire of wisdom: he is called wise by those who see.

In whatever work he does

such a man in truth has peace: he expects nothing, he relies on nothing, and ever has fullness of joy.

He has

no vain hopes, he is the master of his soul, he surrenders all he has, only his body works: he is free from

sin.

He is glad with whatever God gives him, and he has risen beyond the two contraries here below: he is

without jealousy, and in success or in failure he is one: his works bind him not.

He has attained liberation:

he is free from all bonds, his mind has found peace in wisdom, and his work is a holy sacrifice. The work of such a

man is pure.

Who in all his work sees God, he in truth goes unto God: God is his worship, God is his

offering, offered by God in the fire of God.

There are Yogis whose sacrifice is an offering to the gods, but

others offer as a sacrifice their own soul in the fire of God.

In the fire of an inner harmony some surrender

their senses in darkness: and in the fire of the senses some surrender their outer light.

Others sacrifice

their breath of life and also the powers of life in the fire of an inner union lighted by a flash of

vision.

And others, faithful to austere vows, offer their wealth as a sacrifice, or their penance, or their

practice of Yoga, or their sacred studies, or their knowledge.

Some offer their out-flowing breath into the

breath that flows in: and the in-flowing breath into the breath that flows out: they aim at pranayama,

breath-harmony, and the flow of their breath is in peace.

Others, through practice of abstinence, offer their

life into Life. All those know what is sacrifice, and through sacrifice purify their sins.

Neither this wold

nor the world to come is for him who does not sacrifice: and those who enjoy what remains of the sacrifice go unto

Brahman.

Thus in many ways men sacrifice, and in many ways they go to Brahman. Know that all sacrifice is

holy work, and knowing this though shalt be free.

But greater than any earthly sacrifice is the sacrifice of

sacred wisdom. For wisdom is in truth the end of all holy work.

Those who themselves have seen the Truth can

be thy teachers of wisdom. Ask from them. bow unto them, be thou unto them a servant.

When wisdom is thine,

Arjuna, never more shalt though be in confusion; for though shalt see all things in thy heart, and though shalt see

thy heart in me.

And even if thou wert the greatest of sinners, with the help of the bark of wisdom though

shalt cross the sea of evil.

Even as a burning fire burns all fuel into ashes, the fire of eternal wisdom

burns into ashes all works.

Because there is nothing like wisdom which can make us pure on this Earth. The

man who lives in self-harmony finds this truth in his soul.

He who has faith has wisdom, who lives in

self-harmony whose faith is his life: and he who finds wisdom, soon finds the peace supreme.

But he who has

no faith and no wisdom, whose soul is in doubt, is lost. For neither this world, not the world to come, nor joy is

ever for the man who doubts.

He who makes pure his works by Yoga, who watches over his soul, and who by

wisdom destroys his doubts, is free from the bondage of selfish work.

Kill therefore with the sword of wisdom

the doubt born of ignorance that lies in thy heart. Be one in self-harmony, in Yoga, and arise, great warrior,

arise.

-Krsna (from the Bhagavad Gita)

[bronzie]

nice quote, do you know the

origin of the word sin, as seen from the ancient roman perspective? its not something so bad and worthy of church

punishment....not so much a church violation, but it means, "to take a miss" in something, meaning ' to fool ones

self....'

[Bruce]

"spirituality" by definition (of

this forum anyway) should be "good for you" similar to the way vitamins are good for your body or herbs and reading

are good for your mind, just at a more fundamental level. Churches and even entire religions may have their own

agendas. There is a book called "Chicken soup for the Soul" or something like that. I've never read it, but I

think the idea with a title like that was to break away from the unfortunate bad reputation that religious material

has developed over the millennia, and offer people something that is "good for you" at a spiritual level as well as

psychological or physical.

You know, when I was very young there was a huge taboo against all things

psychological. They were considered something for "crazy" people. You couldn't even be caught reading a book that

was good for your mind. Now that is all past us. Maybe some day we will get the confusion about religion sorted

out.

B

[belgareth]

Even that definition for

spirituality is weak, Bruce. Having a limb amputated could be good for you under some circumstances. Here in N.

Texas I deal with a lot of Southern Baptists and they tell me that accepting their savoir into my heart and asking

for his forgiveness is good for me. In both cases, I'd really rather pass.

Could we define spirituality as

something inside you that makes you feel good, supports you in times of need or adversity and inspires you to help

others?? Would it be something that potentially brings out the best in a person?

From my perspective, religion

is something external and could be considered a social function. Spirituality is internal and should be free of the

guilt that mars so many of the ''great" religions.

[Bruce]

When I made that post, I thought to

myself "um... this could be asking for debate trouble" but live and learn. I'll be more careful next

time.

Yeah, I would personally also like to avoid the arm-loss therapy if possible, but no doubt it could be

"good for you" spiritually. You could force yourself to make the worst of it, but the next guy might be able to

embrace it somehow and grow. History has born that out over and over.

Anyway, let's see if we can follow the

golden rule I set up and not criticize others' ideas.

Peace, Love etc etc,
B

[belgareth]

I wasn't trying to criticize,

was trying to open the topic up to discussion. That's the best way I know to learn.

[bronzie]

Spirituality? who defines it,

where does it originate from? and what effect will it create in the person who is in a spiritual state? My guess it

it depends on ones life experience, and often Spirituality is closely related if not inseperate to the psychological

and the physical. People enter, what they call a religious state of mind, is that spirituality? many people say yes.

Even though thier religious state was formed and taught to them by others. i.e all the major religions attempt to

put people in spiritual religious sates of mind. They are easier to control as a mass, if they have one common

ideology, kind of a social proof.

An example was Jim Jones, were the people in his presence in a religious or

spiritual state? my guess is they were, to do what they did.

I personally believe, to find true spirituality,

you need to detach from human influence, the modern world, and become a kind a hermit or monk. If anyone on this

forum has been to a Place called Mt Athos, they willknow what im talking about. Prince Charles of England goes there

every year for a few days, to find some solice in stressfull under spotlight existence.

[Bruce]

Bel,

No harm done. Just a little

worried about getting into a debate. Forums like this easily turn into arguments.

Peace and Love,
Bruce