Reply With QuoteI don't care for the smell of
most pheromone products so a nice cover scent is essential. Seems I recall most natural pheromones are near
scentless, but are carried in smelly stuff like armpit and crotch sweat.
Why do some mones smell good to people and other
don't? And Newbie Mones Experience.
Has this question been asked before?
I mean why would some
people think SOE and Chikara smell great and others think it smell like cat piss or BO?
I'm just wondering,
because maybe our sense of smell might be telling us what will work for us and what won't?
I remember in Psych
101 our instructor was telling us about our pheromones are used naturally to attract the opposite sex.
She gave
us one example and that was, there was this study where they took three sweated T-shirts from three different men.
They gave those three shirts to a woman to smell, and she found that two of them smelled absolutely nasty and she
fell in love with the three one.
I remember her saying that our pheromones carry our immune system signiture, or
something like that. Pretty much we try to look for a partner with different immunities so that when we reproduce
our off spring will have those immunities. Kind of like natural selection.
Any ideas guys? This might be alittle
out of my league being a newbie and all. But i'm just curious.
Also, here's my pheromone experience so
far.
I'm Chinese, about 5'9" 135. Hmm got the free samples and 7 gel pack of both SOE and Chikara.
Haven't
really had to much success, but i might be ODing, or maybe i need to use products with more none?
When i've used
Chikara though, i've noticed that some people around me started sneezing. Possible OD?
I want to attact college
aged woman, so i'm still working stuff out.
Tried SOE, didn't get a hit but i was playing cards with a bunch of
girls and one said that she "felt weird" like "giddy". Could that be an affect of SOE?
But i'm looking for some
stronger hits, what i'm used as dosages so far, i'm tried 1/2 gel of chikara, then the other 1/2 about 7 to 8
hours later.
Tested Chikara for about 3 to 4 days.
Used SOE once so far, and that was about 1/2 gel pack.
Than finished off the pack about 8 hours later before the card game.
I hope that helps, and thanks alot
guys.
Jon
I don't care for the smell of
most pheromone products so a nice cover scent is essential. Seems I recall most natural pheromones are near
scentless, but are carried in smelly stuff like armpit and crotch sweat.
"I'm just a dirty hornytoad" -Gegogi
Some people are just more
sensitive to the scent of pheromones than others. Some may smell just the cover-scent and like the smell of that,
while others might pick up a hint of the mones and be put off by it. I don't know how much that has to do with the
t-shirt and immune system study you mentioned. That deals more with an unconscious repulsion of a person based on
their immune system, not the scent of the pheromones themselves. If I remember it correctly, the conclusion was
that people are attracted to those who have an immune system different from their own, and are sexually repulsed by
those with similar immune systems (aka family members).
Through experience you'll find that there is a very
broad spectrum of variance of reactions people have to pheromones. How noticable the scent of the actual pheromones
is something you always have to take into consideration, because it doesn't matter how well they work, if the
people you're around are put off by how you smell (its happened to me before). Experimentation will give you a
better idea of how much to wear in front of different people and situations. If too many people think you smell
like cat piss, tune it down a bit.
Also as Geoggi recommends, wear a cover-scent if you aren't already.
Right not I am using a cover
scent but i have tried SOE and Chikara without one before. I like the smell of both of them but maybe that's just
me?
My cover scents have been Axe Voodoo and touch. I don't know if the low quality of my cover scent is causing
no effect?
I am asian I am around mostly caucasians so should i try products with heavier none.
Thanks.
Probably so, but don't jump the
gun too quickly. What products do you have right now?
For summer I suggest Geir ...
I got a sample from basenotes.com for.. ask around and you can get a free sample on the forums. It's mhmm mhmm
good!
Having been hit onIf I remember it
correctly, the conclusion was that people are attracted to those who have an immune system different from their own,
and are sexually repulsed by those with similar immune systems (aka family members).
a number of time by first cousins, I wonder about that. I had the impression they were fighting attraction, not
repulsion. Also it flys in the face of the father-daughter, uncle-niece or brother-sister molestation that has
become all too common. I always though we were socialized not to hit on relatives. I know in Hawaii sexual abuse of
close family members is extremely common. It is believed about 20% of all girls in Hawaii are molested by a close
family member.
Of course the urge to bust a nut may be stronger than any social or hormonal brake.
IOriginally Posted by Gegogi
don't buy into their findings too much myself. It seems to me that if people were really most attracted to people
with different immunity systems for their own, we'd see a much greater degree of inter-racial dating. While
inter-racial dating has become more common-place over the years (where I live anyway), I still think most people
tend to stick within their own ethnicity.
Currently i have SOE and Chikara
gel packs and all the free samples.
I might try SOE with Chikara tomorrow and see what happens. I'll be on my
campus so around the girls and social situations where i want the mones to work.
I wonder for Asians because we
don't sweat that much, atleast i don't, which might mean i need more none?
Thanks for the replies
guys.
There were some other interesting studies that our prof. told us about. But think alot of people here
already know that info.
Many of the Asian posters (Geoggi and I included) around here report seeing
better results with higher amounts of none than people of other ethnicities. Definately keep that in mind in the
future.
If you haven't already, be sure to pick up the beginner's special. I'd also recommend picking up some
NPA
Part of pheromone production is due to hormone metabolism, another part is due
to immune system differences. Racial differences are more likely to be associated with hormone metabolism than with
the immune system differences. There is sufficient data available from non-human animal and human studies to show
that both areas of research: hormone response and immune system response are valid.
With regard to comments
on incest, most instances seem likely to be opportunistic rather than "driven" by pheromones.
JVK
Interesting.
Science isn't my
field of study, so forgive me if I'm not too scientifically savvy...but would hormone metabolism affect something
like inherent testosterone levels? If such were true, would that be the reason why asian mone productions seem to
be lower than other ethnicities?
I think IWith regard to comments on
incest, most instances seem likely to be opportunistic rather than "driven" by pheromones.
mentioned that, although in a more elegant tone: "Of course the urge to bust a nut may be stronger than any social
or hormonal brake." Nevertheless, my cousins tried to manufacture an opportunity and even tried to drive off my GF
by making her uncomfortable. Of course, we blamed it on the alcohol...
Sexual abuse by a family
member is not opportunistic but an action driven by many factors, mostly psyciatric and nothing to do with pheromone
production. People and family members that sexually abuse thier relatives create the opportunity and action
themselves, they do not wait for a "green light" to find an opportunity to abuse. If one were to place blame on
pheromones as the drive behind sexual abuse of a family member (usually a minor), they would be totally ignorant on
the whole subject of molestation, in fact attributing that type of abhorrent behaviour to pheromones is in a sense
justifying the root cause to be very limited, which it is not.
As for first cousins hitting on you, its
more common then you think, its happened to me, its a social action or reaction to something and not pheromone
related, in fact in middle eastern culture first cousins marry each other freely without any social taboo. Again
this action has more to do with the culture of these countries then with pheromone production.
I still think incest among close
family members usually begins as a desire to bust da nut, and a family member is more alluring than Mary Palms.
However it can and often does grow into something bigger. I had a former GF that was molested nearly everyday from
the time she was 9 to 14, and still had strong mixed feelings about him 10 years later. It probably contributed
greatly to her preference for older Asian men.
Last edited by Gegogi; 04-13-2006 at 03:18 PM.
Jvkohl, my statement with
regards to pheromones not playing a part in sexual abuse of a family member was not aimed to undermine anything you
said, I didn’t mention you, nor did I quote anything you said to support this, simply because you didn’t mention
anything in this regard, in fact you suggested the opposite, I don’t understand why you got so defensive with that
comment. My comments were in response to the subject matter of the overall post in which members suggested a link
and not a "blame" between pheromones and incest.
As for my statement that sexual abuse is not merely
opportunistic as you suggested in your post, yes it’s based on research and not merely my opinion. When we talk
about incest, are we talking about sexual abuse of a minor by an older family member as some members of this forum
pointed out or incest between two consenting adults that are related by blood? I presume since you used the word
“opportunistic” which has predatory overtones you meant abuse of a minor by an older related member of their family.
I could provide you a whole bibliography and countless research papers on sexual abuse of a minor within the
realm of incest and sexually motivated crimes which includes incest, and you will discover that it is not as simple
as saying, quote: “incest seems likely to be opportunistic”
You or anyone can start by reading Michel
Foucault and others on the whole subject of child sexual abuse and incest and other crimes of a sexual nature, and
you will discover its not as simple as saying its a case of opportunity. In fact, the Judiciary handling of such
crimes at least in my native country is influenced by academics that support and acknowledge the workings of the
French philosopher that I have mentioned above and other prominent psychiatrists and philosophers that deal with
this subject.
I have studied Law at University in my home country, and we paid a great deal of time
researching the workings of Foucault and others when dealing with crimes of a sexual nature which includes incest
and child abuse.
Thanks for clarifying this. I didn't intend to be defensive, just ensure that nothing was
attributed to me by default, which sometimes happens.
Human behavior is never as simple as a simplistic statement used
in summation, or to make a point.
I've discussed these issues with many of the world's
leading researchers--most study some aspect of sexual behavior, but one: Roger Masters is an expert on Biology and
the Law. I may or may not have a broader perspective, since my focus has always been biology. Here's what I've
written in my book Precis about what's referred to as the "Law of Propriniquity (not a legal term)."
------------------
http://psycprints.ecs.soton.ac.uk/archive/00000480/
"17. Chapter 10 reveals
evidence of odor-driven hormonal effects on human behavior and on sexuality, again using cross-species comparisons
that link information provided in earlier chapters. Examples supporting a link between pheromones and human
sexuality are discussed. The "Law of Propinquity" appears to be invalidated by experience with pheromones that
create more of a friendship or kinship bond, perhaps also creating an antibond effect on love. There is evidence
that humans mate for genetic diversity on the basis of unconscious odor associations, and that odors may be involved
in the Coolidge effect."
-------------------------
There may be more data from biology that supports the
simplistic "opportunistic" approach than the relatively complex approach of Foucault and others. And, with some
certainty, I suggest that an ethological perspective (e.g., cross-species comparisons), which again may be too
simplistic, also supports the opportunistic approach.
It might help me if you could summarize what you've
learned with specific regard to incest (without adding in any other crimes of a sexual
nature).
JVK
Jvkhol, sorry for late reply,
just got caught up with other things, and couldn’t reply properly to your last posting.
Firstly, I just want
to make it clear, that what Roger Masters states in regard to pheromones might be true or might be false, I don’t
know, however one thing I have to stress here and that is if anyone attributed an opportunistic theory to incest
particularly the incest/sexual abuse of a minor, they would be banished as irresponsible and in fact would be a
totally absurd line to follow, if not plain demeaning to both the victims of such actions and to the community at
large, these actions are serious crimes for a reason, and cause a great deal of pain and suffering to the victims
and the people involved along with the victim. The word opportunity in this context does not only equate to
simplicity but also chance. Fact is if this were the case every parent would/could be sexually abusing their child
as the opportunity to do so is there. I think you might have chosen the wrong word to begin with or just chose a
poor word in trying to convey the meaning you were trying too. I don’t know. I read a lot of your posts and do
respect your angle on things as you are a professional in the field of biology and pheromone technology, but in this
instance I do not agree with what you said. No hard feelings.
You want me to summarize what I have learnt in
regards to incest? Most of my research with regard to incest was its root cause, and why the Legal system treats
such crimes as serious offences, .i.e. the psychological repercussions of this crime to the victim and to society at
large. I gained both a psychiatric and sociological point of view of why these crimes take place, and a profile of
an offender and of course the Legislative (Law) facet of this subject. From a psychological perspective, which I
gather is what you mean when asking me what I have learnt from incest. Its this, Incest is socially conditioned, on
the surface these actions have root in culture, whether they are deemed crimes by the society or not depends upon
the culture and society we are talking about, incest in Ancient Egypt was common place, and brothers and sisters
would marry each other without any social restraint, in fact they were encouraged. Incest was common in some
cultures and was frowned upon in others, however in most modern societies in today’s world it’s a very big taboo
with serious consequences to the people partaking in it. I am talking about incest of a consenting nature here
between two adults. Whether one root cause is the so called ophidian complex as dictated by Freud or the philosophy
of power that is conveyed by Foucault is up to debate, but both have been proven to be valid and of high influence
at least within the realm of Law and Legislature. However, incest of a minor is a totally different “kettle of
fish”, and its predatory nature and its dire effects on the victim both short term and long term warrant serious
consideration and attention, as compared to the latter (two consenting adults). Through my studies, I have
discovered Incest takes place mainly due to the physiological nature of the offender and his or her past plays a
large role, it’s a case of cause and effect, the cause must be present for the effect to exist, and nowhere did we
step on the subject of scent or chemical secretions to justify an offender’s actions. It was not even mentioned as
hearsay. And I can tell you from a Legal perspective, there have been no precedents that I know of that an offender
of incest has defended him/herself successfully in a court of Law, on the basis that he/she had malice to carry out
the act because of biology, pheromones or opportunity. Your stance is Strict biology I assume, however understanding
the offenders of these crimes you will come to the understanding that it’s a crime of psychology, sad fact is, most
offenders of incest have been sexually abused themselves. And this does cross the genetic blue print, as victims who
became offenders themselves were abused by say the church clergy etc… and later in adulthood sexually molested their
own children. What im saying here is all researched.
Might post more on this subject, and get into more
detail with greater input from different academics, but its late and want to sleep!
As you can
understand, this is just one small area of Law, and in court a Lawyer has so much on his plate that he must rely on
professional advice from specialists in this field, most are psychiatrists at hand that have examined the offender
and give their account and assessment, and the Legislation that deals with these offences have been drafted within
this context to accommodate these professionals and of course to reflect the society they are supposed to represent.
Interesting subject, when I feel up to it, I will look through my mountain of books and reverb the
psychology of incest. As you probably understand, Law is very detailed and what you have to cram into one small
cranium is often overwhelming, you’re always going back and forth.
In the 19th and first half of the
20th century Hawaii it was common for descendants of American missionaries to intermarry (cousins, not siblings). It
kept the wealth in the family and the bloodline pure. They say it also lead to some really dumb rich kids and
widespread genetic defects in these families. The companies and trusts founded by the Congregationalist missionary
descendants still have a choke hold on land holdings in Hawaii in the 21th century.
Everything started to
change when they let brown folk vote...
Gegogi, without going into the
reasons for this, there is a big problem in incest related crimes within some pacific countries, hawaii, somoa,
tonga, fiji, solomon islands and even affluent New Zealand. The law enforecement in these countries barrring Hawaii
and New Zealand, are poor, therefore we do not know the extent to how out of hand this problem has become.
Traditionally incest in these countries was "thought" to strengthen the genetics and keep the blood line, siblings
would marry each other, only to discover a high degree of mortality rates and birth defects. I Guess Charles Darwins
thoery of evolution didnt serve these people right!
I personally believe, that half castes, meaning, half
say Irish and half say Asian, or any number of combinations, are the most attractive people. There is a very simple
reason to this, behind the asthetics. Thier genetics are so diverse that, they posses a higher rate of survival, and
looked upon as attractive.
I have always found it interesting that people born of two
different backgrounds - Japanese and American, in one case, and Whie and Black in another I observed, should so
consistently be more attractive than people of one or the other. Very interesting idea on the attractiveness of
diversity.
I was writing a more detailed reply
that got lost when I looked for the following quote from someone invoved in forensic science who review my
book:
"There have been instances in which allegations of sexual abuse have included someone's perception of
odor. A foster mother claimed to know parents had sexually abused their one-year-old child because, when the child
was returned from being at a church supper with the parents, the foster mother insisted he "smelled of sex." In the
Kelly Michaels case, the prosecution's expert testified that an aversion to tuna fish was a sign of sexual abuse
since a woman's genitals were said to smell like tuna. When interrogated, children may make comments about how
things such as semen smelled. If such questions arise, this book is one of the few sources of knowledge about odor
that brings together the scientific data in a cogent, and reasonable manner. It is also fun to read and offers a
wide range of interesting facts that will be new to most people."
Reviewed by Ralph Underwager, Institute for
Psychological Therapies.
--------------------------
Bronzie,
I appreciate the time you spent putting
together information on the legal issues. Perhaps "opportunistic" was not correct, legally. However, from a
biological perspective, the term is as good as any I can think of. There are clearly biologically driven unconscious
affective reactions associated with olfactory/pheromonal input that contribute to such crimes. I will leave it to
you and others to determine how much weight is given to biology, as our legal system -- at least in the U.S.A. --
still lies waiting to deal with issues of "My genes made me do it" or "It was the pills I was taking, or didn't
take."
Society, as a whole, continues to
downplay the role of olfaction and pheromones. I think it will be many years, if ever, before legislation is geared
to our more animalistic human nature, which must be legally constrained. However, the legal constraints continue to
seem somewhat ineffective, as evidenced by our current system of crime and
punishment.
JVK
Both incest and homosexuality
were viewed as relatively normal in many polynesia cultures. In fact, sex in general was free flowing. Hawaiians
didn't have to worry about VD until the arrival of white men. Believe me, the missionaries had a hell of a time
trying stop eons of cultural practice. Another oddity, true to this day, is many Hawaiians--both male and
female--appear androgynous. Often I'm not sure if natives are male or female and I normally don't have a problem
with that!
I wouldwouldn't be much fun coming
home with a girl who had extra equipment. Other than that who cares. I went to a H&M in barcelona and they do not
explicidly seperate mens clothing from womens clothing. You will almost never see that in the USA. We are very
concerned about gender roles.
24 year old, good looking, white guy SOE+NPA works like a charm
Chikara no results nice scent
Pherlure cant wear it; strong scent headache
AA314 good stuff
NPA girls get frisky, stinks
A7 almost as good as NPA
SOE legit
Is Don Ho still spitting out kids, I hear that the Son of Gun has a bunch out of wedlock.
Bob Marley is no slouch either last count was 15 maybe more.
DCW
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