Close

Results 1 to 15 of 15
  1. #1
    **DONOTDELETE**
    Guest

    Default Pheromone "half-life" on clothing and skin

    visit-red-300x50PNG
    I know the general consensus is that pheromones applied to the skin may last only a few hours, while applied to clothing can last for days and maybe weeks. However, the effective concentration of pheromones sprayed on clothing certainly isn\'t the same after many days. I\'ve sprayed cologne on a paper towel, and the scent was still there three days later but it was much weaker. So, if I were to spray an effective dose of pheromones in the morning to my shirt, how much of it would still be there 12 hours later when I party in the evening? If it\'s 80%, I wouldn\'t bother reapplying, but if it\'s less than 50%, I probably would.

    So, the real question is not how long can you still detect trace amounts of pheromones, but was is it\'s \"half-life\", in scientific terms. Half-life is the time it takes for the concentration to reach 1/2 of initial concentration. It\'d be nice to know this figure for skin and clothing application. Anyone know how to determine this? :-).

  2. #2
    **DONOTDELETE**
    Guest

    Default Re: Pheromone "half-life" on clothing and skin

    There is no good way. Clothes fabrics are diverse, and skin is protein and oil. The different pheros will partition into these different mediums at different rates and at differing levels of tenacity. Also, temperature and just airflow will effect the duration. I would suggest trying to find the partial pressures of the different pheros. This will tell you, more or less, their relative rates of loss. Not how long do they stay on you, but if you had equal amounts of a and b, which will float away faster. Unfortunately, the whole model is much to complex to get time values. I guess that means that these have to empirical experiments. . .

  3. #3
    PheroWizard oscar's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2001
    Posts
    2,503
    Rep Power
    8687

    Default Re: Pheromone "half-life" on clothing and skin

    truth,

    Unless you\'re a friend of Dr Dodd\'s, and have access to his electronic nose, the best measuring device for the purpose you mentioned is right there in the center of your face. Ballpark your estimates using your nose.

    While the half-lives of varying products are likely to widely differ, I\'ll estimate they\'ll all fall within the 3 to 5 hour range.
    After 12 hours I can\'t imagine pheros still being at 80% of original levels, even in the case of a clothing application.
    In any case, it makes sense to carry a mix for refreshing that contains less pheros than the initial dose.
    While you may want to add SOME more pheros, you\'ll also want to cover the residual aroma of the earlier applied ones. There aren\'t many (if there are ANY) fragrances that effectively outlast the mones.

    Oscar [img]images/icons/laugh.gif[/img]

  4. #4
    **DONOTDELETE**
    Guest

    Default Re: Pheromone "half-life" on clothing and skin

    Oscar,

    So, you think most of the pheros and even more of the fragrance is gone after 12 hours? With my nose, I can sort of estimate what the half life of the fragrance is, but it\'s tougher for the pheromone. At first, I don\'t smell the pheromones because the fragrance masks it. I can smell the pheromones later. If I went by my nose, I\'d be mislead to think that the concentration of pheromones was increasing!

  5. #5
    PheroWizard oscar's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2001
    Posts
    2,503
    Rep Power
    8687

    Default Re: Pheromone "half-life" on clothing and skin

    truth,

    But of course you would KNOW that, regardless of the information you were getting from an apparently reliable source (your nose), the phero levels WEREN\'T in fact increasing. That is, unless you happen to decide to work out while doing your olfactory phero half-life determination.

    So work without fragrance. Use the nose on the pheros alone, with no interfering factors that will throw off your conclusions.
    Even if you HAD the electronic nose, the data you\'d get in controlled conditions would be altered when the pheros are used in real world situations, with variances resulting from skin type, fabric type, physical activity, room temperature and ventilation, etc.
    Sometimes a ballpark number is the best you can get.

    Oscar [img]images/icons/wink.gif[/img]

  6. #6
    **DONOTDELETE**
    Guest

    Default Re: Pheromone "half-life" on clothing and skin

    So, for you super experienced people, what do you think that ball park half-life for pheromones is?

  7. #7
    Phero Pharaoh a.k.a.'s Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2001
    Posts
    1,174
    Rep Power
    8563

    Default Re: Pheromone "half-life" on clothing and skin

    Here’s what works for me. Please note that I tend to be a phero minimalist. (Less is best.):

    I replenish APC, Pheromol Factor, and IR colognes every 4-6 hours. (Always applied to skin.)

    Primal, AE, & Jambat I seem to be effective until I work out or shower = up to 14 hours. (Always applied to skin.) AE seems to actually work better towards the end of the day.

    TE on skin seems to last about 6 hours. Then I replenish with a 25% diluted formula and a spritz of cologne. TE sprayed on shirts is effective until I wash them. (One or two days.)

    Hope that helps.

  8. #8
    Carpal Tunnel Whitehall's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2001
    Location
    Silicon Valley, California
    Posts
    2,642
    Rep Power
    8398

    Default Re: Pheromone "half-life" on clothing and skin

    Sorry to be such a stickler, but the notion of \"half-life\" is misapplied here. I\'m a nuclear engineer so work with formal radioactive half lives regularly. Radioactive decay and effective time for pheromones follow considerably different mathmatics. Radioactive decay is purely random and predictable while pheromone emissions is a complex evaporative effect.
    Your concern is how long will an effective minimal concentration be present within one\'s close personal space following application. I\'d think it follows a form of high initial emissions as the spray dissipates or the carrier solvent first evaporates. Mean time, the active liquids are being adsorbed and absorbed on clothing and skin and then are released at a fairly constant rate for some time, a plateau period. That time depends on skin and air temperatures (higher temp means higher emission rate), oil or alcohol base (oil should last longer and emit slower), and many other factors. At a certain point, the rate of emission and hence the local concentration falls off rapidly.
    Experience is the best guide although I would caution about using one\'s own sensation as a metric. I\'ve only used TE, an alcohol-based product and applied it to my skin and hair. I think a four hour reapplication rate is reasonable for my skin and maybe less for head hair (better air circulation). The effects would last somewhat longer if the target started cuddling really close to you and started to raise your skin temperature!
    Once on clothing, after you\'ve taken the garment off, it cools considerably and, if hung in a closet, has reduced air circulation. Wool holds the stuff longer than cotton, I\'ve noticed.

    I\'ve got NPA on order. It\'s oil based so I suppose (hope) it would last longer.

  9. #9
    **DONOTDELETE**
    Guest

    Default Re: Pheromone "half-life" on clothing and skin

    Yeah the AE in my opinion is between 12 and 14 hours certainly long enough to only reapply once or twice in a 24 hour period, different to nuclear decay. The edge yes 1 day on clothing is reasonable also depends on heat and sweating output of the person involved. Andro seems to be best after 3 days probably the higer concentration. What else well something like attraction is to soappy for me so best applied around the groin for intense looks. A little secret everyone apply along with the normal stuff attraction or other spray formulas around the groin area, this will get women peering down there and signal sex, just one of the pro secrets to getting bettter hits.

  10. #10
    **DONOTDELETE**
    Guest

    Default Re: Pheromone "half-life" on clothing and skin

    Whitehall the NPA isn\'t oil based.

  11. #11
    **DONOTDELETE**
    Guest

    Default Re: Pheromone "half-life" on clothing and skin

    Good clarification, Whitehall.

    I notice that when I\'m in my car and I have the air conditioner blowing on me, the pheromone smell builds up really fast! I guess the air increases the release rate, and then the mones get trapped in the car.

    From your explanation, it sounds like how long the mones last depend on the release rate. Wouldn\'t the release rate also affect how much mones reach the target? Mones last longer on clothing, but release is slower, so I\'d think a concentration of 0.02 mg on clothing would have less of an affect than 0.02 mg on skin. I see this is getting really complicated!

  12. #12
    **DONOTDELETE**
    Guest

    Default Re: Pheromone "half-life" on clothing and skin

    I sort of hinted that it was a bit complex. About your car, a return to general chem, I know everyone tried to forget that class, but it will explain it rather well. The idea of partial pressures is that for a given volume of gas (Air for instance) a solvent, or liquid will have a certain amount of itself in the gas phase. With an air conditioner, new air is constantly blowing by, so an equilibrium is never attained, and the pheros keep trying to establish an equilibrium. So they jum into the gas phase. As far as clothes, this is another facet of the same thing. The partial pressure that would be measured, (for instance pheros on your skin) will be different than if the pheros were in another solvent (Say cotton for instance, no it is not a solvent, but work with me) It has to do with the equilibriums and the partition coefficients. I guess all that time in chromatography class was useful.

  13. #13
    Phero Enthusiast
    Join Date
    Nov 2001
    Posts
    209
    Rep Power
    8173

    Default Re: Pheromone "half-life" on clothing and skin

    Whew! Walter, that was quite interesting. It\'s kind of a relief to see that my chem class wasn\'t a waste of time after all. [img]images/icons/laugh.gif[/img]

  14. #14
    **DONOTDELETE**
    Guest

    Default Re: Pheromone "half-life" on clothing and skin

    Walter, based on your comments, I\'m thinking along these lines:

    1. I shouldn\'t blow my air conditioner while driving alone to work because it\'ll blow away all the pheromones. Worse yet, if I have it on re-circ, I could OD and pass out behind the wheel!

    2. If I have a nice girl in my car, I might want to shut the windows and turn on the air conditioner until the right concentration is reached.

    3. An equal concentration of pheromones on clothing produces a smaller concentration in the air. However, the mones will last longer.

    Are these thoughts on the right track?

  15. #15
    **DONOTDELETE**
    Guest

    Default Re: Pheromone "half-life" on clothing and skin

    Well, I don?t want to nrrd out to much here. All of this is rather empirical. We have no real way to determine data. But, the physical properties are pretty solid. The idea of more air = larger loss of pheros is most likely true. But, how fast this actually occurs is unknown. I doubt you?d pass out, really 0.2 mg of pheros is pretty small, if they had that effect, I think more people would be posting about how to minimize head injuries. ? Now the pheros on the clothes will most likely wear off at a slower rate, but remember that temperature and airflow (That darn A/C) will also have a role in this. Most things are trying to get to Equilibrium, and by minor changes in your environment, Eq can be disrupted. In an odd sort of way, life is based on that principle. But, because the pheros like your clothes, they should last longer. They will still have a partial pressure, meaning they will be floating about you. It will be different than if you put them on your skin, but they are still there. The real trick is to determine if the levels floating around you are adequate for the desired effect. More fun and games to come, eh?

    Actually, being 19 in a chem class is a funny concept. I am a grad student, and most of the chem I need I learned in that class. Of course, no one ever explained why any of it was relevant, but then again I was 19, and probably would not have listened.

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Similar Threads

  1. (Re)Reopening Skin vs Hair vs Clothing case
    By TBiRD in forum Pheromone Discussion
    Replies: 15
    Last Post: 03-03-2003, 09:00 PM
  2. Survey: Skin, clothing, or both?
    By **DONOTDELETE** in forum Archives 1
    Replies: 12
    Last Post: 05-03-2002, 06:36 PM
  3. Spray vs. Direct application, Skin vs. Clothing
    By **DONOTDELETE** in forum Archives 1
    Replies: 14
    Last Post: 02-06-2002, 08:13 PM
  4. Pheros on skin, fragrance on clothing?
    By **DONOTDELETE** in forum Archives 1
    Replies: 12
    Last Post: 01-23-2002, 10:21 PM
  5. The Pheromone News, November, 2001
    By Bruce in forum Archives 1
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: 11-15-2001, 05:00 PM

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •