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  1. #31
    Full Member wood elf's Avatar
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    visit-red-300x50PNG
    Quote Originally Posted by satyrboy
    I wish! No, my

    point was I got all the benefits and no drawback. My wife is not usually spontaneous about sex, and usually prefers

    the bedroom.
    No matter what anybody else says, too much none on some people is repulsive! I do not know

    what the reason is but can tell you from experience that it is true. It may be associated with your behavoir

    patterns or your natural signature but until we measure it we cannot be sure.

    The bedroom is nice too but there

    are so many other fun places. On a boat moving in time with the waves or outdoors under the stars.

  2. #32
    Kodachrome Forever! Gegogi's Avatar
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    "Remember highschool, the

    nerds? the bullied? What if one of them one day came to school in the coolest fuckin slick clothes, behaving like he

    was 'THE shit'. Would all the cool guys get upset? Probably, would they try to put him back in place?

    Probably."
    Sadly this is too true. I knew a girl in high school with an eagle-lke nose. She was

    attractive otherwise but everyone called her eagle beak just to be mean. Over the Summer she got a nose job, new car

    and wardrobe. Looked amazingly good but many still called her eagle beak and actually became meaner, trying to make

    her cry whenever possible.

    "No matter what anybody else says, too much none on some people is

    repulsive! I do not know what the reason is but can tell you from experience that it is true. It may be associated

    with your behavoir patterns or your natural signature but until we measure it we cannot be

    sure."
    True, but the point is you must experiment to find what works for you. Even if you could

    measure the amount of 'none if would be impossible to accurately factor in behavior, natural pheromones and the

    situation. I'm one of those that can wear a lot of 'none with no ill-effects. Probably a combination of my

    ethnicity (Korean), age (middle aged) and personality (ultra mellow). I've long suspected I produce little or no

    'none as I have little BO, almost no body hair and don't sweat much.
    "I'm just a dirty hornytoad" -Gegogi

  3. #33
    Full Member wood elf's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gegogi
    True, but the

    point is you must experiment to find what works for you. Even if you could measure the amount of 'none if would be

    impossible to accurately factor in behavior, natural pheromones and the situation. I'm one of those that can wear a

    lot of 'none with no ill-effects. Probably a combination of my ethnicity (Korean), age (middle aged) and

    personality (ultra mellow). I've long suspected I produce little or no 'none as I have little BO, almost no body

    hair and don't sweat much.
    We agree. Belgareth is about the same age as you, he cannot wear much none

    without it becoming obnoxious. He is of scandinavian descent, hairy as an old bear (acts like one sometimes too) and

    is casually aggressive. Please correct me if I am wrong but I thought there was some correlation between a person's

    natural attitude and their pheromone signature. If so, measuring a person's natural pheromone signature would be

    useful in describing supplemental pheromones appropriate to that person.

    Others on the forum have denied the

    concept of OD altogether and for them it may be true but for others it is not.

  4. #34
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    I was doing a bit of mixing

    yesterday (Managed to get the bottle of SOE open) and was mixing into an atomizer: SOE, p10, NPA and some Joop WAA.

    I spilled A LOT of NPA on myself. Wiped it off on my chest, legs, arms whereever. It was an amount not describable

    in "drops" This was on top of a fair amount of p10, 1/3 AE gel pack, 4 drops of NPA, a few rolls of SOE and some

    Joop WAA for cover.

    I thought I stunk, I used a bit more Joop WAA to cover and still thought I stunk.
    I

    didn't have time to shower before heading out with my wife.

    1) no OD symptoms. Again, people were polite and

    responsive.
    2) I got more looks than I ever normally do.
    3) I had earlier had an issue on the phone with a

    customer service rep at a store. I went to the store and asked for him. I got into his personal space, and

    pretended to strain at being polite yet pissed (actually I could really care less) he was VERY intimidated(I'm not

    an intimidating man)
    4) Wife was very responsive/interested.

    Maybe I should just take a -none bath daily.

  5. #35
    Relaxed seduceme's Avatar
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    Yeah I had on some NPA+chikara

    today. Actually I put on 2 dabs of NPA and yeah I could smell something(weird I couldnt before). Its like a very

    rank smell, acrid if you will.
    I covered it with 3 sprays of chikara and off I went.

    Yeah people did look

    more, and its weird but some were unusually more interested to interact than before. Its all good though i'll post

    back when I've figured this stuff out here.

  6. #36
    Moderator belgareth's Avatar
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    That's strange. I used three

    sprays of TE with about 6" of SoE when I went to visit a normally cool client and he blew up on me. His secretary

    was shocked so badly that she left the room and later called to apologise. He admitted a few days later that he had

    no idea what came over him and felt awful about it half an hour afterwards.

    There have been several other

    incidences but that one really caught my attention.
    To compel a man to subsidize with his taxes the propagation of ideas which he disbelieves and abhors is sinful and tyrannical.

    Thomas Jefferson

  7. #37
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    Gegogi: Thanks for

    mentioning body hair. That's a good point for consideration.

    Quote Originally Posted by wood elf
    We agree. Belgareth is about the

    same age as you, he cannot wear much none without it becoming obnoxious. He is of scandinavian descent, hairy as an

    old bear (acts like one sometimes too) and is casually aggressive. Please correct me if I am wrong but I thought

    there was some correlation between a person's natural attitude and their pheromone signature. If so, measuring a

    person's natural pheromone signature would be useful in describing supplemental pheromones appropriate to that

    person.

    Others on the forum have denied the concept of OD altogether and for them it may be true but for

    others it is not.
    See, I think that the "natural pheromone signature" thing is a misnomer. I think the

    variance in sensitivity to 'none isn't a matter of how much 'none your body produces--which, AFAIK, is

    miniscule--but rather is a matter of how easy you are at being perceived as intimidating. I think that there are

    just certain things about people--e.g., height, weight, muscle size, aggressiveness, gestures, voice volume,

    etc.--that cause people to be intimidated, and that 'none magnifies these characteristics dramatically in the eye

    of the beholder. If a person has these characteristics (like belgareth), then he has to be careful around 'none or

    his intimidating-ness will become overwhelming (i.e., what's called an overdose). If a person has a few of these

    characteristics, then it would take a lot more 'none before an intimidation overdose is reached. If a person has

    essentially none of these characteristics (like Gegogi), then it's probably going to be nigh impossible for this

    person to overdose--no matter how much 'none Steve Erkel and William Hung wear nobody is going to be frightened of

    them. If every 0.01mg 'none makes you twice as intimidating, and you naturally have an intimidation factor (like

    Erkel) of zero, then no matter how much 'none you use, you'll never be intimidating.

    Quote Originally Posted by satyrboy
    Maybe

    I should just take a -none bath daily.
    Whatever works, right?

  8. #38
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    I'm not sure, but I think I

    was just compared to Erkel.
    That sucks.
    Gregorri, I think you joined me in the slight!

  9. #39
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    Hey, Erkel's cool! You'd

    better not be dissing my boy Steve-Oh.

    I wasn't saying that you (and Gegogi) have Erkel-esque qualities,

    though. I was saying that you (and Gegogi) lack the qualities that both Erkel and Hung also lack. (Incidentally, I

    lack those qualities too. We're all in this together, you see. Maybe we should start a club for the have-nots?)

  10. #40
    Livin' the life of Riley
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    Jonathan, check this thread out,

    where Cpt. posts some numbers-

    http://pherolibrary.com/forum/showthread.php?t=13213

    Seems to

    me that even among the number crunchers there is great debate on natural concentrations.

    satyrboy- I have

    also found that the better a woman knows you (like a wife, for example), the less chance of an OD you will have with

    her (her knowing you're a good guy will override the 'fear factor'). Ofcourse, it also seems that the better a

    woman knows you, the more likely she is to notice a difference in your 'mone signature.


    Riley

  11. #41
    Kodachrome Forever! Gegogi's Avatar
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    But I'm a lot cuter than William

    Hung!

    I have the face of a priest. My mother called me "little budda." For some reason I appear totally

    non-threatening (I'm actually a wolf in sheep's clothing). Thus, people easily trust me and want to confess all

    their sins and inner most secrets. I really don't care to hear about it most of the time. However, the benefit is

    most women trust me right away. Once they get to know me, they often accuse me of somehow tricking or bewitching

    them.
    "I'm just a dirty hornytoad" -Gegogi

  12. #42
    Full Member wood elf's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jonathan
    Gegogi:

    Thanks for mentioning body hair. That's a good point for consideration.


    See, I think that the "natural

    pheromone signature" thing is a misnomer. I think the variance in sensitivity to 'none isn't a matter of how much

    'none your body produces--which, AFAIK, is miniscule--but rather is a matter of how easy you are at being perceived

    as intimidating. I think that there are just certain things about people--e.g., height, weight, muscle size,

    aggressiveness, gestures, voice volume, etc.--that cause people to be intimidated, and that 'none magnifies these

    characteristics dramatically in the eye of the beholder. If a person has these characteristics (like belgareth),

    then he has to be careful around 'none or his intimidating-ness will become overwhelming (i.e., what's called an

    overdose). If a person has a few of these characteristics, then it would take a lot more 'none before an

    intimidation overdose is reached. If a person has essentially none of these characteristics (like Gegogi), then

    it's probably going to be nigh impossible for this person to overdose--no matter how much 'none Steve Erkel and

    William Hung wear nobody is going to be frightened of them. If every 0.01mg 'none makes you twice as intimidating,

    and you naturally have an intimidation factor (like Erkel) of zero, then no matter how much 'none you use, you'll

    never be intimidating.

    Whatever works, right?
    I think you are wrong. This morning I am on my way to

    class and do not have time to rebutte. When I return this afternoon I will explain myself better. In short, your

    theory does not take into account innumerable real world experiences by many forum members over several years but

    seems to be just theory. My own experiences are not even close to what you describe. Have you worn synthetic

    pheromones and what are your results? I do not find a single hit report by you.

    W. Elf

  13. #43
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    Riley: Thanks for the

    link. Quite helpful.

    Quote Originally Posted by wood elf
    I think you are wrong.
    Disagreement is always welcome.


    Quote Originally Posted by wood elf
    In short, your theory does not take into account innumerable real world experiences by many forum

    members over several years but seems to be just theory.
    From my readings (this thread included), I've come

    under the impression that some people OD on 'none with seemingly infinitessimal amounts, whereas others--myself

    included--can swim in the stuff without a typical OD response. The "personal pheromone signature" explanation has

    seemed lacking to me, especially since the difference in the maximum usable dose for the two types of people appears

    to be several times the total skin 'none content for even the most alpha of males. I've been trying to come up

    with an explanation for this phenomenon, and the above was the best I could come up with.

    After re-reading my

    post, though, I think I understand where you're coming from. I used the word "intimidating", and 'none alone is

    definitely pretty intimidating. I think what I meant to say was that 'none alone is not frightening, and

    people will only be frightened (according to my revised theory) if 'none is coupled with certain behavioral or

    physical characteristics. Example: I've noticed several times that when I wear a lot of 'none, people will

    suddenly become very quiet when I walk up to them, or otherwise stop talking when my scent/'mones reach their nose.

    On one particular occasion, I was wearing about 7 (!) drops of NPA, most of which was on my head and hair, and the

    remainder of which was on my palms and the insides of my wrists. I was talking with two guys and a girl in a bar in

    a little circle. The conversation seemed to be going normally enough, except that everyone seemed to be paying much

    more attention to me than normal. At one point, though, there were two of us talking in two little

    sub-conversations, and about two seconds after I made an open-palms hand gesture to accent a point (remember where I

    had the NPA applied), I noticed the other speaker's face go blank as he stopped midsentence, letting his jaw hang

    open in a bemused daze, then say, quietly, stutteringly, and with a sheepish smile, "I totally just forgot what I

    was saying." He didn't seem afraid of me or to have any negative feelings toward me at all, though: he was just

    ... bemused and braindead. After we talked a little more, he seemed to relax a little bit, but he continued to be

    much more shy and subservient after getting that whiff. I've noticed this type of phenomenon several times when

    wearing 'none, and I have yet to get a frightened or aggressive response from anyone. That, plus the experience of

    Gegogi and satyrboy above, is what prompted me to write the theory above. Basically, it's just a logical extension

    of the Clint Eastwood/Lone Wolf effect: it's the William Hung/Steve Erkel effect. (Or whatever. I'm not

    particularly good at choosing pop-culture poster children.)

    Quote Originally Posted by wood elf
    My own experiences are not even

    close to what you describe. Have you worn synthetic pheromones and what are your results? I do not find a single hit

    report by you.
    That's because I haven't posted any except in the context of replies to others'

    posts. I've been meaning to give a proper de-lurking for a while now, but I always seem to get sidetracked by

    something someone else says and stay up until 3am replying to that every time I try. =\. One of these days.

  14. #44
    Full Member wood elf's Avatar
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    The first reason I think you are wrong is your assumption about ease of being intimidating. My only

    experience is with and around Belgareth. He is not intimidating to look at. He is 5' 8" tall which is only average,

    he is muscular but it is more like a cat than something else. The loose clothes he likes to wear usually conceal it

    well enough. Most of the time he is laughing or smiling and he always speaks in a soft voice. I do not need to see

    him to be bothered by too much androstenone. Belgareth has walked up behind me wearing too much and I feel it. It

    makes me nervous and waspish; he might use another, stronger word. Certain times of the month I am more sensitive to

    it than others. When he is not wearing synthetic pheromones or is wearing ones with no or little androstenone I am

    comfortable and like to be close to him. I often have friends visiting and they react to it the same way as I.

    I

    say he is casually aggressive because he is never rude or arrogant. Once he decides to do something he will get it

    done but is always polite in how he deals with anybody. Little children love him most of the time, whether he is

    wearing synthetic pheromones or not. That may be because he is very fond of little children and will always take

    time to smile and speak to a child. When he wears too much androstenone even his granddaughter, who adores him,

    avoids him.

    Some other questions that you make me wish to ask. How do you account for all the experienced users

    that have reported ODs? Did they all imagine it and you are the only one who can see all their errors? It seems

    unlikely.

    There is good reason to believe that humans respond to the small amount of androstenone produced,

    which indicates a certain level of sensitivity to low levels of the molecule. See the comments in the women’s forum

    about how a man smells for one small example. Most mammals that are able to detect small amounts of light or sound

    or scent are easily overloaded. That can often result in pain but probably does not in every case. Even pain can

    overload our ability to perceive it. I think it is likely that beyond a certain level additional pheromones will not

    be a benefit but a waste of money even if most people do not have a repulsion reaction. The organ detecting the

    pheromones will not be able to perceive an increased quantity.

    There have been many studies quoted and linked on

    this forum regarding pheromone detection. There is speculation that pheromones may not be detected by the VNO or

    that not all pheromones are detected by the same organ. If that is the case we can assume that despite massive

    amounts of one pheromone being detected by a given organ may have no effect on the perception of another pheromone

    by a different organ and possibly a different part of the brain. On this site people discuss the use of only a

    handful of pheromones, what about the hundreds of others that are a normal part of each human's scent? They likely

    have an effect as well and should be considered as part of the normal pheromone signature of the individual instead

    of being discounted. One possible alternative is that certain people produce one or more of another (as yet

    unidentified?) pheromone that moderates the response to androstenone and others are lacking that pheromone.

    To

    sum up what I am seeing, you write well but you are glossing over or not aware of some facts and are making

    unwarranted assumptions. That is fine if that is what you wish to do but you are stating your view as fact and could

    be misleading other inexperienced users. I cannot speak for anybody else but Belgareth is a good, careful observer

    and even before he told me of his synthetic pheromone use I saw the same reactions he does. OD reactions happen to

    some people more easily than to others. I cannot explain why but have seen it firsthand multiple times under

    conditions that could not be a reaction to physical presence or by people who know him well and are not intimidated

    by him.

    There is likely to be more to this than you are covering with your explanation and the things not

    explained could be causing others to not have as good of results or even fail in their use of pheromones.

    W.

    Elf

  15. #45
    Doctor of Scentology DrSmellThis's Avatar
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    We need to get Sue in here,

    Koolking!
    DrSmellThis (creator of P H E R O S)

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