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  1. #1
    Phero Pharaoh
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    Exclamation I just want to slap you young guys

    visit-red-300x50PNG
    Bruce, forgive me for saying this. I know new guys come into the forums all the time. But I have to get this off

    my chest.

    I keep seeing posts from teenagers and guys in their early twenties. They have no confidence with

    women. That's typical. It's normal. It's okay.

    But you have to get the confidence SOME TIME, guys. And

    you won't find any magic powders either here or elsewhere that give you the confidence.

    You just have to go

    make mistakes and learn from them. The more you try, the easier it becomes. I am not saying go get used to

    rejection. I am saying, go to talk to girls you have never seen before. Just say "Hi". The ones who want to talk

    to you will let you know.

    Use the pheromones to help them open up. Use the good colognes to make yourselves

    more interesting.

    I have seen a lot of crap posted by young, inexperienced guys over the past couple of weeks.

    I have been there. I used to dream up these wacky schemes, too. They don't work.

    What works is simply walking

    up to a girl and saying, "Hi. What's your name?"

    I met my ex-wife that way. In fact, I met a lot of

    ex-girlfriends, friends, and whatevers that way. I meet a LOT of people that way.

    The ones you agonize over,

    the ones you want to be perfect for, the ones you fantasize about -- you're never going to do anything with them.

    Why? Because you put so much effort into planning the perfect come on you never give yourself a chance to just get

    to know her.

    Pheromones won't change you. They won't prevent you from making dumb mistakes. They MAY help

    mask the smaller mistakes. They MAY give you time to recover from momentary lapses of sanity.

    They WILL give

    you opportunities to practice meeting, talking with, and getting to know girls. That is what you need to do.



    Don't try to impress them. They really couldn't care less about how impressive you want to be.

    If you're a

    young guy, you are being evaluated by every young girl as a potential boyfriend (and eventually as a potential

    husband). Most of the time, you never make the cut and you don't even know it. If a girl has shown interest in

    you, she has already put you ahead of dozens of other guys.

    Use that knowledge to your advantage. Draw

    confidence from the fact that she DID choose to look at you, smile at you, say hello to you, touch you. Girls have

    to worry about attracting creeps and dangerous guys. They only do these things for the ones they are wiling to take

    the small risk of getting to know a little better.

    Learn to ignore the girls who don't send you these signals.

    They are NOT interested in you, and there is no system in the world that will change their minds for them.

    When

    a girl looks at you, smiles, says "Hi", touches you, she is telling you in her way, "I think you may be interesting.

    Please prove to me that my judgement is good."

    And how do you do that? By showing her that you are NOT

    self-obsessed, that you are NOT afraid to talk with her, and that you DO have some control over yourself, and that

    you ARE interested in her enough to want to get to know her.

    And now that I have said that, knowing that is what

    older guys used to tell me when I was young, I know none of you will listen to the advice or heed it. I didn't. I

    had to learn it for myself, the hard way.

    But, damn, I wish those old guys hadn't been so right.

  2. #2
    Journeyman Canucky Guy's Avatar
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    Hey, I'm 23 and I KNOW.

    I've made the mistakes, been with all the wrong women, etc. It's sad that the most attractive thing about a guy

    is confidence and 90% of guys don't have it. If they could make a product that would artificially boost a guy's

    self confidence, places like love-scent.com would be out of business...

    Oh wait, they do exist...at

    http://www.ferarriworld.com/. Good thing merchandise here is a little

    cheaper.

    I've said it before, and I'll say it again...women can smell apprehension, and the vibes it gives off

    are 10x more potent than a vat of mones. Primitively speaking, women look to men to be pillars of strength and

    security...so if you're insecure about yourself, how can a woman invest in that?
    WASSUP!!!!!

  3. #3
    Phero Dude
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    so you don't believe in the nlp

    and those player's guide stuff?

  4. #4
    Phero Dude
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    AMEN!!! Preach it brother.I went

    out to the grocery store tonight and practicaly threw myself at an attractive woman behind the deli counter...GOT

    SHOT DOWN IN FLAMES BIG TIME!!!
    But I had alot of fun doing it and she actualy laughed and thought I was funny

    and cute...even tho she is married (probably to a three hundred pound Marine who goes by the named KILLER.)I

    embarassed the hell out of my friend that was with me too.I had no chance at this woman and I knew going in that I

    had no chance...but as the motto of the S.A.S says...Who Dares,Wins!
    Work on boldly rushing in where angels fear

    to tread and you will find that woman have a realy good response to that.You dont have to be a jerk...just work on

    your interpersonal skills by being outgoing and friendly and work on not thinking about it but by just doing it! Get

    shot down!Who cares? In a sixty years when she is old and grey and cruising up and down the halls of a nursing home

    in her wheel chair she will think to herself..."I wonder what happend to that cute guy that was so funny?"
    Quit

    worrying about it and have fun...dont take things so seriously...it called one-itis...If I dont make it with this

    one there will never be another chance and I will die a virgin.Relax and enjoy life.I wish I had known that twenty

    years ago.

  5. #5
    Doctor of Scentology DrSmellThis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Friendly1
    Bruce,

    forgive me for saying this. I know new guys come into the forums all the time. But I have to get this off my

    chest.

    I keep seeing posts from teenagers and guys in their early twenties. They have no confidence with women.

    That's typical. It's normal. It's okay.

    But you have to get the confidence SOME TIME, guys. And you won't

    find any magic powders either here or elsewhere that give you the confidence.

    You just have to go make mistakes

    and learn from them. The more you try, the easier it becomes. I am not saying go get used to rejection. I am saying,

    go to talk to girls you have never seen before. Just say "Hi". The ones who want to talk to you will let you know.



    Use the pheromones to help them open up. Use the good colognes to make yourselves more interesting.

    I have

    seen a lot of crap posted by young, inexperienced guys over the past couple of weeks. I have been there. I used to

    dream up these wacky schemes, too. They don't work.

    What works is simply walking up to a girl and saying, "Hi.

    What's your name?"

    I met my ex-wife that way. In fact, I met a lot of ex-girlfriends, friends, and whatevers

    that way. I meet a LOT of people that way.

    The ones you agonize over, the ones you want to be perfect for, the

    ones you fantasize about -- you're never going to do anything with them. Why? Because you put so much effort into

    planning the perfect come on you never give yourself a chance to just get to know her.

    Pheromones won't change

    you. They won't prevent you from making dumb mistakes. They MAY help mask the smaller mistakes. They MAY give you

    time to recover from momentary lapses of sanity.

    They WILL give you opportunities to practice meeting, talking

    with, and getting to know girls. That is what you need to do.

    Don't try to impress them. They really couldn't

    care less about how impressive you want to be.

    If you're a young guy, you are being evaluated by every young

    girl as a potential boyfriend (and eventually as a potential husband). Most of the time, you never make the cut and

    you don't even know it. If a girl has shown interest in you, she has already put you ahead of dozens of other

    guys.

    Use that knowledge to your advantage. Draw confidence from the fact that she DID choose to look at you,

    smile at you, say hello to you, touch you. Girls have to worry about attracting creeps and dangerous guys. They only

    do these things for the ones they are wiling to take the small risk of getting to know a little better.

    Learn to

    ignore the girls who don't send you these signals. They are NOT interested in you, and there is no system in the

    world that will change their minds for them.

    When a girl looks at you, smiles, says "Hi", touches you, she is

    telling you in her way, "I think you may be interesting. Please prove to me that my judgement is good."

    And how

    do you do that? By showing her that you are NOT self-obsessed, that you are NOT afraid to talk with her, and that

    you DO have some control over yourself, and that you ARE interested in her enough to want to get to know her.



    And now that I have said that, knowing that is what older guys used to tell me when I was young, I know none of

    you will listen to the advice or heed it. I didn't. I had to learn it for myself, the hard way.

    But, damn, I

    wish those old guys hadn't been so right.
    This was a nice post.
    DrSmellThis (creator of P H E R O S)

  6. #6
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    Agree fully. Scan the

    places for girls who are interested in you and then approach.

  7. #7
    Full Member phinmone's Avatar
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    what friendly1 said, was correct

    (nice post by the way). it is very much about your attitude and how confident you appear. i'm 22 and i am gaining

    my confidence every day. those who shoot down the player's guides and other stuff, are wrong! there are some

    exercises and quides how to handle women. and they are good, if you find the right ones. i have had success with

    some of those, better than ever before! so they really work! confidence and attitude are very important things when

    it comes down to attracting women.

  8. #8
    Phero Enthusiast Snoopy's Avatar
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    Friendly1 has given me something

    deep to think about for the rest of the week. Thank you, I know that I'm probably one of the people you are talking

    about, and I've been trying my best to change the way I think.

  9. #9
    Phero Dude
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    Quote Originally Posted by Friendly1
    But, damn, I

    wish those old guys hadn't been so right.
    Dude, that may well be one of the best posts I've ever read

    on this board.. You've hit the nail on the head so hard there's now an indentation on the hammer.

    Sadly,

    experience is the best teacher, but she is a harsh mistress. I've only learned recently that simply injecting

    myself into a conversation taking place around me with some comment or another will at worst, make someone I'll

    never see again think I'm kinda creepy, and at best, become an opportunity to start a relationship of some form or

    another.

  10. #10
    Journeyman Canucky Guy's Avatar
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    It is better to be remembered

    poorly, then to be forgotten in the sands of time.
    WASSUP!!!!!

  11. #11
    Stranger some808guy's Avatar
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    Yep! I agree...
    Most of the

    times... we never really listen to good advice...

    then end up learning the hard way...
    as it has been im sure

    for millions of years... children will never learn from parents but will have experience as their greatest teacher

  12. #12
    Sadhu bjf's Avatar
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    There are more pictures of kittens in

    here than TM's bedroom!

  13. #13
    Man of La Pancha
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    I wrote a little something in

    my Memoirs on this...I call it "the post nobody wants to read" because it's the hard truth that people young and

    old don't want to hear. Everybody knows it; nobody likes it.

  14. #14
    Phero Enthusiast
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    Lightbulb You might try vocal training

    I

    know I have talked myself blue in the face about the value of actor's training in ANY social interaction. Every one

    of these how to get women books and courses is essentially a subset of actor's training.

    Here are two

    suggestions. If you have the motivation, time, and spare funds, take a class in comedy improvisation. Humor taks a

    lot of chops to do right, meaning to say that you're not desperately struggling to be funny or pull weak laughs out

    with dull tongs, rather that you have the intuition to be spontaneously funny. Humor is about the greatest social

    asset one could have. Make people laugh and they'll overlook almost anything else... well, up to a

    point.

    Second suggestion, highly important for a young man or woman who wants to get places in life, DO

    SOMETHING ABOUT YOUR VOICE, DUDE...

    The ironic thing is that we have mirrors everywhere and we preen

    ourselves constantly, shoot, put a mirror in a cage of chimpanzees and they will be fully absorbed with the

    mirror.

    A miniscule minority of civilian people, those not directly working in media or entertainment, listen

    to their own voices on a regular basis. We don't have too many "voice mirrors" around us to clue us in on how we

    come off to others when we speak.

    TOO MANY physically attractive young men and women have MEDIOCRE voices,

    some have horrible voices. You need , at minimum, a good recorder and a good microphone so you can replay your

    voice, and voice study materials, and then you have to work hard at it so you sound natural. If you have the

    opportunity, get a voice coach and take lessons for a couple of months. A good coach will identify your weaknesses

    and provide you with lessons to correct them.

    A good voice is NOT an artifical "deepened" or macho basso or

    try to come off like a heavy dude voice, it DOES have a balance of fundamental and overtones, smooth rhythm,

    sinuousness, musicality. Women hear a great voice and they'll go DIHL without a drop of pheromones.

    I did

    have the chance to observe why some men had repeatedly better results with women. Those with compelling voices could

    be somewhat less physically attractive, even a bit dicey in their general comportment, however their voice quality

    would break through the deflector shield more than what they were specifically saying.

  15. #15
    Phero Dude DCW's Avatar
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    Cool

    [QUOTE=surfs_up]
    TOO MANY

    physically attractive young men and women have MEDIOCRE voices, some have horrible voices.


    QUOTE]



    Like Olympic Gymnist Paul Hamm, I put him in the Mike Tyson category.
    Then again he's

    probably not looking to score with the chicks anyway.



    DCW

  16. #16
    Phero Enthusiast einstein's Avatar
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    Like Olympic Gymnist Paul

    Hamm, I put him in the Mike Tyson category.
    Then again he's probably not looking to score with the chicks

    anyway.
    I noticed that too. He's covered in muscles, but sounds like a jockey. I think a gold

    medal could pick up chicks though....

    I got an email last month advertising an improve your voice program by

    Arthur Joseph. I don't know much about it, but it says he's coached lots of hollywood celebs, including Sean

    Connery and Arnold Schwarzenegger, and Pierce Brosnan.

    Here's the link for it.

  17. #17
    Journeyman Canucky Guy's Avatar
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    Omg I worship you...I have

    been looking for something like this forever.
    WASSUP!!!!!

  18. #18
    Phero Enthusiast einstein's Avatar
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    Glad I could help. I was afraid

    it was kinda tacky post a link I couldn't personally endorse.

  19. #19
    Journeyman Canucky Guy's Avatar
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    I'll let you know how it

    works when it gets here
    WASSUP!!!!!

  20. #20
    Phero Pharaoh
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    There are some good references

    on voice exercises out there which don't cost hundreds of dollars. Try them before you start spending money on

    spam-driven programs. For example, in my Body Language

    thread in the Open Discussion forum
    , I mentioned the book I know what you're thinking by

    Lillian Glass. This excellent book briefly discusses what a person's voice says about their personality. I think

    Reading People by Jo-Ellen Dimitrius and Mark Mazzarella also discusses the voice a little bit. One

    of the books goes into detail about a young man who falsely lowered his voice. The author worked with him (after

    his girlfriend complained about how stupid he sounded) to find his natural "manly" tone.

    If you want to check

    out some of the expensive programs, first try the ones which let you sample their expertise through online articles,

    ezines, archives, and so forth. I would personally be very reluctant to try any product which relied solely on

    sales hype to sell its products. A really good voice teacher has nothing to hide.

    Here is an example of a site

    which offers a voice program for a fee but also offers a free ezine with archives you can browse:



    http://www.greatvoice.com/insidevoiceover.html



    Here is another site which offers free online exercises and such:



    http://www.vocalist.org.uk/voicetraining.html

    Try

    some searches for "free voice coaching", "free voice improvement", "free speaking tips", etc.

    AskMen offers 7

    tips for public speaking:



    http://askmen.com/money/successful/46_success.html



    Here are a couple of articles which provide tips on improving your voice:



    http://www.insiderreports.co

    m/storypage.asp_Q_ChanID_E_MR_A_StoryID_E_20000150




    http://www.spebsqsa.org/web/gro

    ups/public/documents/pages/pub_cb_00194.hcsp


    There is a lot of information out there (and some bad

    opinions, too). It takes time to find good resources, but you should be able to put together some decent guidelines

    to help you improve your voice without having to spend a lot of money. Try the free tips first. See what is

    involved. Any system worth the money you pay for it will require that you perform exercises and probably change

    your lifestyle a little bit.

    You could also visit a local Toastmasters group and ask the members for help with

    your voice (they may urge you to join the group, which would be good practice). Their Web site offers some free

    tips, too:

    http://www.toastmasters.org/

  21. #21
    Journeyman Canucky Guy's Avatar
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    You're just a veritable

    wealth of useful info, Friendly =P

    Thanks, I'll check out these links first then.
    WASSUP!!!!!

  22. #22
    Phero Enthusiast
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    Default suggest you find a real voice teacher

    Home study programs may be good as supplemental training. Voice teachers come in two flavors. There are

    the spoken voice teachers, who are closer to speech pathologists, often they specialize in accent elimination.

    Remember the great BRITISH actor, Cary Grant, whose real name was Archie Leach and grew up a poor working class

    Brit.... yeah, Archie had good voice teachers. He learned how to speak American, moved to California...

    Then

    there are singing teachers, who should teach you two things, voice production AND ear training... I mean, HOW are

    you going to know what to do if you can't distinguish between tones ?

    A good teacher must have a good ear.

    He or she will find YOUR "center tone" and then play it on a keyboard or piano.

    You'll learn to hum your

    center tone, not as easy as it seems , to make a good pure hmmmmmmmmmmm tone, then the teacher starts moving around

    the keyboard, finding the limit of you natural range, then gradually moves you above it and below it, you slowly

    learn HOW to gracefully make micro-pitch changes with your voice.

    Now, friends, I will tell you, gratis, one

    of the all time most powerful vocal seduction tools... one that those "how to" courses probably don't have a clue

    about...

    It is hard to do UNLESS you have a good teacher who can gradually teach you how.

    Here it

    is... a sexless voice, the never get laid voice, lacks controlled micro pitch variation, a voice that takes you

    places, connects with people on an emotional level, is rich in micro tonal variation. What this means is fine, but

    meaningfully controlled larynx modulations that give a voice musicality. When women have that in their voices, guys

    melt when they hear it. When women hear it they feel a powerful unconscious tug "YES!!! GIVE ME YOUR

    SEED!!!!"....

    I think this is due to an evolutionary fact that a loose, flexible , strong voice apparatus

    somehow indicates superior health and superior genetics whereras a flat dry voice gives of a tattered plumage

    signal...

    For that reason you should be cautious about depending on one size fits all voice courses on the

    internet.

  23. #23
    Phero Enthusiast phersurf's Avatar
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    The seduction system I recently

    bought, Non Verbal Sexual Cuing, emphasises how important the voice is. He has several exercises to improve

    resonance, tempo and pausing. He also has you speak into a portable recorder so you can hear you own voice and

    improve it.

  24. #24
    Phero Enthusiast
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    Wink it sounds like a healthy start

    pay close attention to the *critical* detail in what I wrote above... micro tonal variation. The other factors you

    spoke of in the course, resonance, tempo are important. They are like the exterior structure of your voice, you have

    to work on them too.

    Micro-tonality is the interior structure of your voice. You do have to put the exterior

    pieces in place before you can focus in on micro tone.

    I appreciate that it is hard to do unless you practice

    one of the voice arts, from singing to commercial voice over... a beautiful woman I know was a professional singer

    who wanted to restart her career. Told me that she allowed herself TWO YEARS of practice before she was back "in

    voice" and ready to perform.

    Assuming you want to connect with women instead of becoming a singer you don't

    need that much training. You will need some. I would make a concerted effort within your budget, buy a full fledged

    home study voice course, a book or two, maybe ten hours of voice coaching if there's a teacher in the

    area.

    You'll know you have found "it" when other people show increased interest when you talk... I am

    convinced that there is an "auditory pheromone" that is fundamentally hypnotic. When most people hear it they enter

    into an alpha state. One woman told me that she had a hard time being around me as whenever I spoke she found

    herself entering a light hypnotic trance. Now I kid her by using my Mickey Mouse voice when I'm around

    her.

    Imagine what happens when you mix this with a good phero hit

  25. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Friendly1
    Use the pheromones

    to help them open up. Use the good colognes to make yourselves more interesting.

    I have seen a lot of crap

    posted by young, inexperienced guys over the past couple of weeks. I have been there. I used to dream up these wacky

    schemes, too. They don't work.

    What works is simply walking up to a girl and saying, "Hi. What's your name?"



    I met my ex-wife that way. In fact, I met a lot of ex-girlfriends, friends, and whatevers that way. I meet a LOT

    of people that way.


    Pheromones won't change you. They won't prevent you from making dumb mistakes. They MAY

    help mask the smaller mistakes. They MAY give you time to recover from momentary lapses of sanity.

    Don't try to

    impress them. They really couldn't care less about how impressive you want to be.

    If you're a young guy, you

    are being evaluated by every young girl as a potential boyfriend (and eventually as a potential husband). Most of

    the time, you never make the cut and you don't even know it. If a girl has shown interest in you, she has already

    put you ahead of dozens of other guys.

    Use that knowledge to your advantage. Draw confidence from the fact that

    she DID choose to look at you, smile at you, say hello to you, touch you. Girls have to worry about attracting

    creeps and dangerous guys. They only do these things for the ones they are wiling to take the small risk of getting

    to know a little better.

    Learn to ignore the girls who don't send you these signals. They are NOT interested in

    you, and there is no system in the world that will change their minds for them.

    When a girl looks at you,

    smiles, says "Hi", touches you, she is telling you in her way, "I think you may be interesting. Please prove to me

    that my judgement is good."
    Hello friendly1,

    you could not have said that better!!! A really great

    post !!!
    I know at the beginning of dealing with pheromones everybody (even me a year ago) would like to hear "Hey,

    put this product on and all girls won't be able to resist you!" , although you know that's nonsense.
    You really

    bring the hole matter to the point: Pheromones are no magic bullet!
    This post should be a duty for every newbie.

    Perhaps it may discourage them at the beginning
    but what is more important, it puts their expectations to a

    reallistic level. Only if you expext too much, you can disappointed!

    Best regards

    Ingo
    Last edited by Indigo; 08-31-2004 at 01:51 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Canucky

    Guy
    Primitively speaking, women look to men to be pillars of strength and security...so if you're insecure about

    yourself, how can a woman invest in that?
    There is great truth in those words.

  27. #27
    Moderator belgareth's Avatar
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    Friendly,

    That's one of

    the best posts I've seen here. The only advice I would add is to just go have fun. Be fun and talk to people, enjoy

    yourself and don't take it seriously. Somebody, I don't remember whho, once said that life is too important to be

    taken seriously. In the seduction game it's more true than ever.
    To compel a man to subsidize with his taxes the propagation of ideas which he disbelieves and abhors is sinful and tyrannical.

    Thomas Jefferson

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    hear hear! i know full well

    that whatever i'm wearing if i go out moody or lacking confidence it ain't happening.

    alas for the younger

    male confidence only comes with success, so they need to reach that critical mass.

    simply being nice to girls

    and getting compliments helps........

    wtf am i talking about?

  29. #29
    Bad Motha Holmes's Avatar
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    If a guy's a cocksucker in his life, when he dies, he don't become a saint. - Morris Levy, Hitmen

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  30. #30
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    Default now in my second month of hard ass vocal training

    obviously, this is not an interest or an option for everyone. It is part of my

    semi-professional life (face it, theater arts are not known for their income producing reliability, enjoyable as

    they may be for other reasons, if you score big, more power to you, if you don't, well, don't quit your day

    job)

    My teacher has been recording my voice with each training session, where we work with microphones as

    one would in a soundbooth. After two months of committed work, I literally cannot recognize my own voice. The bass

    registers and the overtone structures have opened up to the point where it makes my old "naive" voice sound thin and

    wimpy, and frankly,
    none too sexual.

    This is the functional equivalent of major plastic surgery in the

    realm of voice production. The beauty of it is that it is healthy, increasing lung capacity and breath coordination,

    lower cost by far, and works so well that it is damned scary.

    People just want to hang around me and listen

    to me talk regardless of the value of what I am saying. Women seem to relax and go into a light daze. Even macho

    black guys check it out... like, where you comin' from, man ?

    There is a strange feeling of responsibility

    I have, in a way I am radically more self conscious of how my voice affects people, a slight change in inflection

    can create a positive feeling and lift another person up, a totally unintentional tonal shift can really wound

    someone, I honestly never had this communicative power, and I feel like an uncoordinated teenager having to relearn

    how to interact socially. I must now stop myself before I speak and think about how this thing I am about to say

    will be interpreted. I know that if I say something even slightly stupid or thoughless, its stupidity will be

    magnified tenfold.

    As you may be thinking, when you change your "social power" you must take responsibility

    for chaning your whole self, you values, your ethics, the meanings behind what you say. Being socially invisible,

    being a nonentity, lets you get away with a lot of mediocrity, and the bad habits accumulate.

    I honestly

    can say that I never dreamed of this outcome, both how liberating it would turn out to be, or the new demands it

    would impose. Such is life.

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