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  1. #31
    Sadhu bjf's Avatar
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    Good post Friendly. As far as the

    "buildup issue" goes, I think people are turning it into an argument about whether buildup exists because we don't

    believe that there is an issue of over-diagnosing newbies or anyone with that problem.

    Normally it is, "try

    a different dose" or "look for little signs." People don't even tell guys or gals to try using another product

    for the most part, and only recommend something else when someone asks "I want to buy something else, what else is

    good?"

  2. #32
    Bodhi Satva CptKipling's Avatar
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    For newbies...

    Buildup

    could be happening if:
    • You initially had good, consistant reactions but after a period of use you

      noticed a significant drop off in reactions.
    • After a couple of days of heavy application with minimal results,

      you see better reactions in the next couple of days when you don't apply.
    • You primarily use -none

      products and find day to day reactions to be very inconsistant.
    • You don't wash application

      points well at the end of the day.
    To combat possible

    buildup:

    • Scrub application points after a days application (don't go crazy,

      perhaps use one of those exfoliating scrubber/sponge things.
    • Take breaks from applying high

      doses of pheros, so you are making sure you don' apply heavily everyday.
    • Stop using high

      doses everyday, and possibly limit "proper" doses to special occasions.

  3. #33
    Moderator belgareth's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Friendly1
    I am not

    telling anyone that buildup doesn't exist. I am expressing reasonable doubts about the all-too frequent conclusion

    that people are experiencing buildup.

    Your experience, mine, and the beginners' experiences aren't what you

    should be relying upon to help them determine if they have a buildup problem.

    What you should be relying upon is

    what they say about their pheromone use, their habits, and their activities. That is all that can be used to

    objectively determine if they are building up pheromone residues in their skins.
    It sure sounded like you

    were implying that it probably does not exist. I also recall very few (if any) cases where a new user was advised

    first thing that build up was a primary cause of no responses. OD is suggested and in the case of OD, the potential

    for any build up, if it does exist, is greater. As a cause for declining results, it is a potential variable that

    SHOULD be considered. Nobody here knows enough or has enough firm data to eliminate that as a possibility.

    More

    often than not, when a new user complains about no responses, people start asking questions about the user and their

    habits; age, build, physical condition, mones used and amounts. The more information available, the greater the

    likelihood of good results.
    To compel a man to subsidize with his taxes the propagation of ideas which he disbelieves and abhors is sinful and tyrannical.

    Thomas Jefferson

  4. #34
    Moderator belgareth's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Friendly1
    The "less is

    more" philosophy, combined with the issue of buildup, have led me to conclude a number of things I have not shared

    here.

    I think that buildup, as explained by Bruce and a couple of others, makes sense. I don't think it

    necessarily is a bad thing. I may change my mind on that.

    Buildup seems to substantively alter your pheromone

    signature, at least for an extended period of time if not permanently.

    How long does it take for a buildup to

    dissipate or otherwise revert to a normal level? Depends on amount of buildup and hygiene, right? There must be a

    plateau point where your body doesn't accrete any more pheromones, or it is only replacing older pheromones.



    So, if we assume that someone has built up a large residue, then that is similar to a strong application or OD.

    Over time, you could have the same pheromone signature through buildup that you can achieve with a heavy dose.


    Friendly:

    That is the track I have been following with my theory and experiments. As I said in

    another post, I believe some wash away, some convert and some remain for a while. Admittedly, numerous variables are

    still impossible to control but I have a lot of others controlled for a fairly large, stable target audience under

    controlled conditions. The net result is that it appears I can wear fewer mones on a daily basis to get

    approximately the same responses.

    One of the questions that still bothers me is the impact on my own pheromone

    excretions. Is it changing or has it changed as a result of wearing mones almost every day? That will have an effect

    on my signature. After the weather cools down some, I intend to stop using mones for a month to gauge the effect of

    mone use and build up on the same test group.

    The reality is that my tests still prove little but have been

    pretty interesting to me. However, the results are still primarily subjective.
    To compel a man to subsidize with his taxes the propagation of ideas which he disbelieves and abhors is sinful and tyrannical.

    Thomas Jefferson

  5. #35
    Bodhi Satva CptKipling's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by belgareth
    One of the

    questions that still bothers me is the impact on my own pheromone excretions. Is it changing or has it changed as a

    result of wearing mones almost every day? That will have an effect on my signature. After the weather cools down

    some, I intend to stop using mones for a month to gauge the effect of mone use and build up on the same test

    group.
    iirc, there is no feedback process that controls the amount of pheromones present on your skin (i.e

    when there is lots, preduction slows).

    However, it has been suggested that detection of sex pheromones causes an

    individual to react by secreting more of their own sex pheros.

    I'm not sure how those two points interact, I

    guess it's a case of deciding how we would differentiate between self-produced and foreign pheromones.

  6. #36
    Sadhu bjf's Avatar
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    Another thing is that many of these

    pheromones and cops are supposed to affect our hormones, which in turn affects our own pheromone output.

  7. #37
    Phero Dude DCW's Avatar
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    Cool

    Quote Originally Posted by bjf
    Another thing is that many

    of these pheromones and cops are supposed to affect our hormones, which in turn affects our own pheromone

    output.
    How so?


    DCW

  8. #38
    Sadhu bjf's Avatar
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    Many (or all) pheromones are

    converted metabolites of hormones....the higher a hormone level is, I would assume the more metabolites are

    produced

  9. #39
    Phero Pharaoh
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    Well, physical activity must

    have something to do with it, too. After all, our energy levels and sex-related hormone levels increase when we

    increase our activity. We also perspire more, and our natural pheromones are distributed through perspiration, are

    they not?

    I think I may have been responding to Laura at the club in part because she was cranking up her own

    natural volume. With as many people as go dancing in those clubs, the air must become saturated compared to another

    environment.

  10. #40
    Moderator belgareth's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Friendly1
    Well, physical

    activity must have something to do with it, too. After all, our energy levels and sex-related hormone levels

    increase when we increase our activity. We also perspire more, and our natural pheromones are distributed through

    perspiration, are they not?

    I think I may have been responding to Laura at the club in part because she was

    cranking up her own natural volume. With as many people as go dancing in those clubs, the air must become saturated

    compared to another environment.
    The first time I saw a really noticable reaction to mones was at the

    dojo. I was wearing TE and the mid 30's lady I was working with lost focus completely. We are at similar levels of

    experience and work together often. I had only been experimenting with mones a short while and had never worn them

    at the dojo. It was pretty late in the session and we were both sweaty. We've always been friends but since then

    she has been much more attentive to me. We work together almost any time we are not training lower level students.



    There are a lot of young guys there and I get some agression from them but the few times I've worn none it was

    worse.
    To compel a man to subsidize with his taxes the propagation of ideas which he disbelieves and abhors is sinful and tyrannical.

    Thomas Jefferson

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