Large News

[Bruce]

Folks,

When it rains it

pours. We have yet another men\'s product coming down the tube. Could be another month or so before we have it

in hand, but I have a couple of initial questions I want to run by you guys.

1. Contrary to previous procedure,

this product will be released simultaneously in scented and unscented form. Imagine if you will, that you are about

to purchase this product, which would you be most inclinded to grab first, the scented or unscented? Or would it

depend on what you saw on the website?

2. Would you like to see this product start out in primitive form as a

\"beta\" at a discounted price or have you been beta-ed to death by now after Pheros and Chikara???

Any

feedback appreciated. By the way, looks/smells like a great product so far; reminds me of my first standard mix

Primal and APC. Interesting pheromone recipe; sort of a suped up AE. Supposed to be in a nice box but I haven\'t

seen it yet. The product is being manufactured by a top maker of body-building supplements.

Never a dull

moment,
B

[franki]

Bruce, my credit cards get

maxed out by all these new products.. [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/ooo.gif[/img]

By the sound of it, this

product won\'t be as revolutionary as Chikara.

1 - I would pick the unscented

Question : With -beta do you

mean there is gonna be a questionaire like with WAGG and Chikara? If so, are the ingredients going to be secret

again??

[Mtnjim]

I probably would take the

unscented--like to \"roll-my-own\" if you know what I mean. If you are going to \"beta\" perhaps you could get

\"sample sized\" bottles and issue them for a \"real good price\"?
Is this in the AE/P-10 field, or is there

something new in it??

[ToBeOrNotToBe]

I would pick the

unscented one, unless anyone reported that it would be wise to choose the scented version.



</font><blockquote><font class=\"small\">Quote:</font><hr />
Interesting pheromone recipe; sort of a suped up

AE.

<hr /></blockquote><font class=\"post\">

Can you tell us anything else about it?

[Bruce]

Good questions and

feedback; thanks.

This product is in the AE class, and the contents will be 100% disclosed, you will be glad to

hear. At first I figured \"Well, back to back, Pheros and Chikara are going to be a couple of hard acts to

follow\", but there is something special to this new product (\"Perception\") in its own way. It has the same

pheros as AE, but the combo is different; heavier on the NOL and lighter on the NONE.

B

[bigdog]

The Pheromone Revolution

has kicked into high gear. A body building company now getting into the fray too. Hopefully the Federal Government

doesn\'t get toom much of a whiff and try to make an example of these products as they did ephedrine.

[einstein]

It seems I\'ve got

more curiosity than common sense. Beta or not, I\'ll probably be buying it.
I prefer to buy unscented. It

gives me more control, and I love being in complete control of how I smell. When its released, I would like to know

what the scented product smells like, to treat as a suggested cover scent.
I like beta at a discount rate. Fancy

packaging isn\'t as important as what\'s inside the bottle. Just as long as the bottle doesn\'t leak. I can

always transfer to a different bottle if this one is inconvenient.
It would be nice to know the phero composition

of this one, but if that\'s not released, I still trust Bruce to not sell a low quality product.
I am curious as

to the manufacturer, I guess a supplement mnufacture would have some experience in steroid synthesis.

Hope my

opinion helps,
B

[Unknownshadown20]

An unscented

version of AE would be nice, I just hope the price is lower to start off with.

[bjf]

An unscented in this case

should be somewhat scentless if it is lighter on the none and more on the NOL. AFA is pretty light smelling,

although I would suspect this would have some none smell. If it smells bad on its own and there was a scented

version, make sure its not some great unique scent. In other words make it a sandalwood or something that

universally combines with other scents.

Nothing clashing and make sure enough sandalwood is in

there.

BTW, this sounds a lot like AE/w, minus the horrible scent.

And beta all the way. Given that

there aren\'t any new mones, the ratio is all that is new and the 100 regulars or so have already spent over 100

bucks on the last two products, I don;t think a new product would be jumped all over at full price.

And I

would definitely try and do 5ml affordable bottles unless you are wanting to test the bottles too.

[dping28]

I would go with a

Unscented version, that way as I try out all these new cover scents I dont have to worry to much about the smells

clashing too bad. I understand unscented doesnt mean No smell but the least the better. a smaller beta version I

think would be nice, to give people an idea if its something they like. I too dont care much for the

bottle/packaging being fancy, infact I would prefer just a normal plain old bottle with an open top and maybe a

dropper. Just my 2 cents.

[ToBeOrNotToBe]

</font><blockquote><font class=\"small\">Quote:</font><hr />
It has the same pheros as AE, but the combo is

different; heavier on the NOL and lighter on the NONE.


<hr /></blockquote><font class=\"post\">



Wouldn\'t it make it similar to AE/w? Or does this new product have more pheromones per bottle?

What makes

it special?

[bigdog]

If this is the

company\'s initial stab into mones I\'ll pass for now. I have to see the product prove itself.

[Quorum]

</font><blockquote><font

class=\"small\">Quote:</font><hr />
An unscented version of AE would be nice, I just hope the price is lower to

start off with.

<hr /></blockquote><font class=\"post\">

I agree, I\'d rather see an unscented AE, as I

don\'t see much of a need for a different formula in terms of the mones. Why mess with success? Then again, it

doesn\'t matter much to me now, as I finally scraped up enough funds to order P10 this weekend, and should be

well-stocked for a LONG time [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

[Helsinki]

I would get unscented,

and I would really like to see smaller, more affordble beta samples. Maybe only 2, 3 weeks worth.
The ratio with

more NOL and less NONE is exactly what I\'ve been looking for. I\'ll probably get some, but I\'d for sure bite

on a small sample at first...

[TopDawg2050]

</font><blockquote><font class=\"small\">Quote:</font><hr />

The ratio with more NOL and less NONE is exactly

what I\'ve been looking for.

<hr /></blockquote><font class=\"post\">

Sounds good to me too, i like to use

SOE because of its -nol and -rone content -none doesnt seem to work well with me. Depending on what the scent was, i

would probably end up getting scented, im lazy. I would also like to see this product in a sample size, easier on

the budget and not that much of as loss if it doesnt work [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img] thanks

bruce! [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif[/img]

[jose]

I\'m passing on this also,

I spent too much money on my credit card and the last 2 new products I purchased should hold me until next year.

Unless I hit the lottery then it\'s a different story.

[koolking1]

Big news, huge news,

and now - large news. I\'m 53, drink beer, and smoke weed - I need something more definitive please, totally

confusing as to which is which!!!!

I have bought Pheros, Chikara, and AE recently. I\'m happy, really happy,

with this grouping and will be ordering more of each so I don\'t think I\'d consider getting the new stuff till

after reading several user posts on here. I\'d likely go for the scented version as I\'ve little sense of smell

anymore anyways.

[koolking1]

Big news, huge news,

and now - large news. I\'m 53, drink beer, and smoke weed - I need something more definitive please, totally

confusing as to which is which!!!!

I have bought Pheros, Chikara, and AE recently. I\'m happy, really happy,

with this grouping and will be ordering more of each so I don\'t think I\'d consider getting the new stuff till

after reading several user posts on here. I\'d likely go for the scented version as I\'ve little sense of smell

anymore anyways.

[DrSmellThis]

I\'m hoping for

\"throbbing news\" when I release the next batch of Pheros.

[img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

[CptKipling]

Should\'a been Uber

news [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]

What sort of price are we looking at?

I\'m very

pleased about the disclosure of the formula, it makes it a lot easier to use it with other products. I\'m not sure

about the water base though, I have always thought pheros wern\'t even water soluble

[img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/confused.gif[/img]

Great work though Bruce

[img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

[Holmes]

Bruce,

For me it would

be either/or. I\'d buy the scented one if it had a nice fragrance like Pheros or Chikara.


Holmes

[belgareth]

It\'s great to see

new products being released but I will probably not buy it for a while. With both Pheros and Chikara to experiment

with, it will just make things too complicated to fully undderstand the results if I added another.

[Chemo (BDC Concepts)]

</font><blockquote><font class=\"small\">Quote:</font><hr />
...I\'m not sure about the water base though, I

have always thought pheros wern\'t even water soluble

[img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/confused.gif[/img]


<hr /></blockquote><font class=\"post\">
Actually,

pheromones are not water soluble...they are steroidal molecules that are considered lipophilic. We invested a large

amount of time creating the proprietary water formula that is stable and effective.

We have applied for a patent

on our formula and cannot release the exact components until we receive issuance. However, we can release the

pheromone ratios and exact amounts of each!

Bobby

[DrSmellThis]

Bobby, how would you

describe the unique benefit of your new product?

[DrSmellThis]

</font><blockquote><font class=\"small\">Quote:</font><hr />
</font><blockquote><font

class=\"small\">Quote:</font><hr />
...I\'m not sure about the water base though, I have always thought pheros

wern\'t even water soluble [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/confused.gif[/img]


<hr /></blockquote><font

class=\"post\">
Actually, pheromones are not water soluble...they are steroidal molecules that are considered

lipophilic. We invested a large amount of time creating the proprietary water formula that is stable and

effective.

We have applied for a patent on our formula and cannot release the exact components until we receive

issuance. However, we can release the pheromone ratios and exact amounts of each!

Bobby

<hr

/></blockquote><font class=\"post\">

Maybe you cannot comment much on this without giving away your secrets,

Bobby, but pheromones are typically synthesized in an alcohol medium, which is then diluted with water. As long as

the pheromones stay dissolved there would be nothing stopping one from evaporating off the alcohol (or at least some

of it), over the course of a few days, and adding back enough water to keep fluid levels constant. If they did not

stay in solution, then presumably one would have to add something like a detergent to make the water an unfriendly

place for phero precipitation to occur. Having a suspension is also a possibility, which brings a possible role for

glycerine or bovine collagen (e.g., gelatin) to mind. (The same thing could be tried with oil and the ethanol

solution. I\'m not sure how Primal does it). The product Edge is already 50% water to ethanol.

[Chemo (BDC Concepts)]

</font><blockquote><font class=\"small\">Quote:</font><hr />
Bobby, how would you describe the unique benefit of

your new product?

<hr /></blockquote><font class=\"post\">
Good question!

First, we have combined 3

pheromones in one convenient unit. I will defer the discussion of the pheromone ratio to my VP (who is still

waiting for his account to be activated). He has done extensive research into this area and his input will be more

detailed than my offering.

Second, the unique water based formula will allow for more ease of experimentation.

We have found that the water based forumula intensifies the pheromone smell. This observation is purely subjective

but as an example, take an oil based unscented product with the same basic ratios as our formula. If you compared

the intensity of the pheromone smell you will no doubt conclude that ours will be much stronger. This will lead

most to reduce the application amount and thus the unit will last much longer. Of course, this equates to higher

per unit value since it will last twice as long! As an alternative, if one found that even 1 squirt were still too

strong then they could simply dilute the unit with plain water (of course, distilled water is preferred here). Once

again, if they diluted the unit in half they would in essence have twice the volume at the same price...still an

outstanding value!

So, why does our product have more intense aromatic qualities? Simple: we do not use known

penetration enhancers for the solvent. I\'ll explore this topic more later but we have some interesting

conclusions that I\'m sure the membership here will enjoy [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]

The

main unique feature of Perception is the versatility in which it can be utilized. In the future we will use this

fact to introduce products that have true value. For instance, we have found that the absolute solubility

(saturation point) of pheromones in our formula is 62.7 mg/mL. Do you want a concentrate that is truly concetrated?

We can offer you a solution to the problem that is still water based...more on this later.

Keep the questions

coming!

Bobby

[Chemo (BDC Concepts)]

</font><blockquote><font class=\"small\">Quote:</font><hr />

Maybe you cannot comment much on this without

giving away your secrets, Bobby, but pheromones are typically synthesized in an alcohol medium, which is then

diluted with water. As long as the pheromones stay dissolved there would be nothing stopping one from evaporating

off the alcohol (or at least some of it), over the course of a few days, and adding back enough water to keep fluid

levels constant. If they did not stay in solution, then presumably one would have to add something like a detergent

to make the water an unfriendly place for phero precipitation to occur. Having a suspension is also a possibility,

which brings a possible role for glycerine or bovine collagen (e.g., gelatin) to mind. (The same thing could be

tried with oil and the ethanol solution. I\'m not sure how Primal does it). The product Edge is already 50% water

to ethanol.

<hr /></blockquote><font class=\"post\">
The only thing I can let out now is that it is a

proprietary polymer that we designed specifically for this application. We felt that typical or off the shelf

emulsifiers / detergents would add too much viscosity to make the atomizer practicable. So was born PSWB-5

(Pheromone Stabilizing Water Base - formula 5) polymer which is currently being reviewed for patent. So how

effective is the polymer? The formula is 99% water v/v [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]

Bobby

[Chemo (BDC Concepts)]

Maybe we

could get Bruce to jump in here and offer his feedback on the unscented (and scented) version.

What do you say

Bruce? [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

Bobby

[bigdog]

It seems so similar to

other products we have been used (AE/AE/w). I would like to know if Bobby is familiar with these and how his is

different. Also if any trial tests have been conducted and what the results were.

[CptKipling]

</font><blockquote><font class=\"small\">Quote:</font><hr />
</font><blockquote><font

class=\"small\">Quote:</font><hr />
...I\'m not sure about the water base though, I have always thought pheros

wern\'t even water soluble [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/confused.gif[/img]


<hr /></blockquote><font

class=\"post\">
Actually, pheromones are not water soluble...they are steroidal molecules that are considered

lipophilic. We invested a large amount of time creating the proprietary water formula that is stable and

effective.

We have applied for a patent on our formula and cannot release the exact components until we receive

issuance. However, we can release the pheromone ratios and exact amounts of each!

Bobby

<hr

/></blockquote><font class=\"post\">

Thanks Bobby [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]