View Full Version : Advice wanted for a strong, effective product
AzMike
11-09-2003, 03:25 PM
After 5 weeks and 22 field tests, I have a total of zero real hits.
/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/frown.gif Have been using small to moderate applications of TE/m, PPA/m,
and/or SOE gel packs during these tests.
I would still like to continue testing for a period of 6 months, and
would like to field test a couple other products. What can people recommend to me as the strongest, most effective
product for 50 dollars or less? Although I\'d like to purchase a couple more things, I\'d like to put a 50
dollar limit on any individual product, since it\'s quite possible the products will do nothing for me, and I will
then feel I\'m flushing the money down the toilet. So, I will not be testing PI, P10, or A1.
I would really,
really like to find a mone that does produce some results; I definitely do not want to come to the conclusion, 5
months from now, that these products are the equivalent of oil from long, legless reptiles. I would much rather be
able to state that some pheromones are effective and very worthwhile, and want to recommend them to everyone. So
please, let me know which under-50-dollar products have been the strongest, and most likely to produce at least some
reactions in people. I would like especially to hear from people who have used TE and/or PPA with little or no
results, but went on to find another product which worked well.
Thanks,
AzMike
Phantom
11-09-2003, 03:40 PM
Maybe you can be more descriptive on the amounts, appiciation points, coverscents and settings you have
been using these products. PPA/m is the only product from love-scent that did\'nt give me any results whatsoever
(i\'ve used every product except Edge Essentials) PPA/w is a different story.... that stuff is worth the
di\'nero...
Even if you can\'t afford a good coverscent, there\'s always \"Old Spice\" bodyspray\'s..
those things are great, i\'ve been getting endless compliments on the \"Pure Sport\" version... more than any
cologne i\'ve ever worn. Also it\'s great for covering TE/m.. 1 spray of TE/m to the chest and a generous amount
of Old Spice bodyspray and your literally a chick magnet. Don\'t Underestimate TE/m, I got laid the first time I
used it and i\'ve been hooked ever since.
Too bad you wont be able to explore the world of PI/m...
Phantom.
DrSmellThis
11-09-2003, 03:56 PM
WAGG.
Phantom
11-09-2003, 03:58 PM
AzMike, what kind of hits are you looking for?
jamesdeanmartin
11-09-2003, 04:08 PM
</font><blockquote><font class=\"small\">Quote:</font><hr />
I would really, really like
to find a mone that does produce some results; I definitely do not want to come to the conclusion, 5 months from
now, that these products are the equivalent of oil from long, legless reptiles. I would much rather be able to state
that some pheromones are effective and very worthwhile, and want to recommend them to everyone. So please, let me
know which under-50-dollar products have been the strongest, and most likely to produce at least some reactions in
people. I would like especially to hear from people who have used TE and/or PPA with little or no results, but went
on to find another product which worked well.
<hr /></blockquote><font class=\"post\">
This is kind of a
goofy argument. I\'m assuming you are frustrated and want to vent, but please understand if you aren\'t
noticing results that really has no impact overall on whether pheromones \"work\" or are snake oil. We all have a
vested interest in them working, so we all will look favorably on any evidence whatsoever that may help the cause.
In my experience, \"hits\" are more a sign of the person \"working\" than the mones working per se. I can
wear all the pheromones in the world and sit at home and I wont\' get any hits. If you aren\'t in situations
where you can succeed, there is little use in them. I don\'t know about your situation, but I often find people
who complain about \"things not working\" haven\'t changed anything else in their lives. Pheromones can be part
of the whole package in creating new strategies for success, but they aren\'t the only thing.
It is very hard
to judge how effective mones can be/are. Part of the problem is that this a niche market. Brad Pitt isn\'t looking
for the perfect pheromone. Guys/girls who are getting play all the time don\'t usually worry about these kinds of
things. So the universe of buyers tends to be people who have \"struck out\" in the past. And speaking as someone
who has struck out in the past, whether or not I had pheromones on would not change the outcome.
Don\'t ask
them to change everything, they can\'t and try and work on other aspects of repetoire to increase the chances for
hits.
AzMike
11-09-2003, 11:12 PM
</font><blockquote><font class=\"small\">Quote:</font><hr />
Maybe you can be more descriptive on
the amounts, appiciation points, coverscents and settings you have been using these products. PPA/m is the only
product from love-scent that did\'nt give me any results whatsoever (i\'ve used every product except Edge
Essentials) PPA/w is a different story.... that stuff is worth the di\'nero...
Phantom.
<hr
/></blockquote><font class=\"post\">
1. Amounts- have varied from 1 or 2 small dabs to 2 big sprays from the
Love-scent-supplied atomizer, where each spray appears to be quite a number of dabs. These are amounts I\'ve used
for PPA/m and TE/m. I would guesstimate this would be the equivalent of slightly less than one drop, up to 4-6
drops. For SOE, used 4 times total, I used between 1/3 and 1/6 of a gel pack each time. I never used SOE alone,
always in combination with TE/m.
2. Application points- almost always put some on side of neck, the so-called
\"pulse points\". Sometimes put some on top of chest, sometimes back of neck, a couple times behind ears.
Several times, before going to swing dance lessons, smeared a small dab between wrists. The wrist is often swung
around the woman\'s head (and nose) in this dancing.
3. Coverscents- with PPA/m, usually none, it has its own
distinct fragrance. With TE/m, supposedly Sandalwood, a few times no cover, several times Dolce & Gabbana,
recently several times Diesel Zero Plus. 4 times I added SOE to TE/m, and 3 of those times didn\'t add additional
cover, once I added D & G. The reason I say \"supposedly Sandalwood\" is, my bottle doesn\'t seem to have
any perfume-type fragrance I can smell at all. It just smells like a hospital. The bottle is labeled \"Fragranced
Pheromone Spray For Men\". But it\'s not a spray bottle, just a bottle with a lid. So if the spray part is
mis-labeled, the \"fragranced\" part might be too.
4. Settings- various. A few times on hikes with outdoor
clubs, a few times in group dinners in restaurants, twice at a singles mixer with a fair amount of alcohol served,
twice in a bar, once at a health club working out, once at a picnic with about 20 people (half women), a few times
on dinner dates with one woman, several times swing dancing. In the last setting, only a small number of people are
in their 20\'s, most are in their 30\'s, 40\'s, and 50\'s. In fact, just did field test #23 at a Sunday
evening dance, since my original post on this. Tonite did 2 small dabs of TE/m, and 2 sprays of DZP cologne. No
hits at all, and in fact, a younger woman there (about 30), who I had seen a half dozen times before, mentioned to
me that she had a boyfriend, for the first time tonite. Also, I had a few trips to the grocery store before or
after the settings listed above, with no reactions from any women in the stores.
AzMike
AzMike
11-09-2003, 11:19 PM
DrSmellThis:</font><blockquote><font class=\"small\">Quote:</font><hr />
WAGG.
<hr /></blockquote><font
class=\"post\">
Although I am looking for some women I know to get more \"chatty\", I am definitely looking
also for sexual hits. Would WAGG (without the -N) provide that?
AzMike
Irish
11-10-2003, 09:28 AM
I was a skeptic going in. But I got enough surprising results early on to investigate in earnest, to
see if there was a scientific basis.
Two things are quite certain in my mind based on respectable scientific
sources that I researched:
* A1 lights up the sexual area in women’s brains when they are exposed, even at
undetected and scent-covered levels.
* Androstenol changes the sex-hormone release rates in women’s brains.
Of
course there’s lots more emerging evidence, but these two recent well-documented facts convinced me it’s not
snakeoil.
The problem is that it’s an emerging field as it relates to human beings. So whatever you are using is
a bit of an experiment – it will be decades I think before the human phero language is well understood
scientifically.
The good part is you get to be an experimental pioneer, if you are so inclined.
I can tell
you that interactions have become much easier since I began to experiment, especially with women approaching me and
initiating conversations. I had expected failure and tried pheros on a whim, but the results really changed my
mind. And there’s enough science to validate my experience, that it’s not ‘all in my head’ or the result of some
changed attitude. But there’s been some rough spots along the road, especially with scent od’s. Such is the price
of exploration.
Anyway, I understand the budget issue. Work with what you already have, try small doses and use
social skills to maneuver close enough for the pheros to work in their soft-spoken way. I’m a huge fan of A1, but
it’s expensive (however it is probably a component of TE & NPA, even though the ingredients are officially
secret). The downside of TE/NPA is the smell, which much be managed closely. Androstenol can get things going with
less bad smell. But you probably already know all that…
I can honestly tell you that I have noticed a huge
increase in responses from women when I am close to them for some time (like sitting next to them or standing
close). They often flirt physically by taking my arm, touching thighs – you name it – and its come from women I
just met as well as ones I’ve known for years. I really must credit the pheros, cause in the previous decade before
pheros this probably happened to me only twice. Now it’s a fairly regular event. The trick for me seems to be a
light dose, and close physical proximity for a while . The longer they are near me and as conversation unfolds the
more overt their reaction becomes.
Anyway, try that. Make pheros a component of your conversation with women,
and see what happens. Try it with enough girls to see if you notice anything, or compare to reactions on days you
don’t use pheros. I’m like you – if I hadn’t noticed anything going on I wouldn’t have stuck with it. But I can
vouch for my own results, and hope you have similar experiences.
bigdog
11-10-2003, 11:17 AM
Great Post Irish. AZMike I suggest Alter Ego with all three mones. It\'s the first product I bought
and probably the most successful stand-alone. I\'ve got more sexual hits with it that way. Since I\'ve tried
mixing AE/NPA I\'ve OD each time. Too much aggression. When I\'ve added SOE or WAGG I get thought of as being
gay. It\'s definitely better to have the SOE/WAGG added though because the AE/NPA can be dangerous for me. One
girl at club claimed that I said that I wanted to f_ck her even though I had not talked or touched her. She went to
a bouncer claiming this and I got bounced. Also I have had women think I had said f_ck to them during conversation
even though I hadn\'t or exclaim \'f_ck\' out of the blue. I think the message they get from AE alone is less
intrusive and more are likely to react favorably. As if it\'s more of a \'I so want to get to know you\'
instead of the more blatantly intrusive \'I wanna f-ck you\' that occurs when near an OD.
I\'m gonna go
by the less is more theory and try AE again alone. Also NPA with cologne. Pheromones can be dangerous if too much is
used IMO. But if you do make sure to have SOE & WAGG.
AzMike
11-10-2003, 11:38 AM
</font><blockquote><font class=\"small\">Quote:</font><hr />
This is kind of a goofy argument. I\'m assuming
you are frustrated and want to vent, but please understand if you aren\'t noticing results that really has no
impact overall on whether pheromones \"work\" or are snake oil. We all have a vested interest in them working, so
we all will look favorably on any evidence whatsoever that may help the cause.
In my experience, \"hits\" are
more a sign of the person \"working\" than the mones working per se. I can wear all the pheromones in the world
and sit at home and I wont\' get any hits. If you aren\'t in situations where you can succeed, there is little
use in them. I don\'t know about your situation, but I often find people who complain about \"things not
working\" haven\'t changed anything else in their lives. Pheromones can be part of the whole package in creating
new strategies for success, but they aren\'t the only thing.
It is very hard to judge how effective mones can
be/are. Part of the problem is that this a niche market. Brad Pitt isn\'t looking for the perfect pheromone.
Guys/girls who are getting play all the time don\'t usually worry about these kinds of things. So the universe of
buyers tends to be people who have \"struck out\" in the past. And speaking as someone who has struck out in the
past, whether or not I had pheromones on would not change the outcome.
Don\'t ask them to change everything,
they can\'t and try and work on other aspects of repetoire to increase the chances for hits.
<hr
/></blockquote><font class=\"post\">
Ummm...first, I\'ve never used any pheromones when I planned to sit at
home, something I tend to do a couple nites per week. I have applied the mones prior to going out to situations
where I would be either with a large number of people, including many women, or in a couple cases, where I was on a
date with one woman. I don\'t believe in wasting any sort of product.
I don\'t have illusions about putting
on mones, and expecting them to do all the work. I am not expecting women to come up to me and start ripping my
clothes and her clothes off. However, I AM looking for subtle signs that would be out of the ordinary. One of
these would be increased eye contact. During the 23 times I\'ve used mones so far, I have noticed no women who
had a big increase in eye contact with me. No stares or anything. I have noticed one or two times what may have
been a rather slight increase, but these were women I was unfamiliar with.
In many settings, I have purposely,
but briefly, walked past a woman, so I would be within a foot or so of her for a second or 2. This was with a
moderate dose of PPA/m or TE/m on. This didn\'t turn any heads. In a dance situation, the woman is automatically
within range of you. In some other social settings, I might be standing 2-3 feet from a woman when conversing, but
might walk closer to her for a few seconds, so she might get a whiff.
I have struck out many times in the past
myself, but have had a number of home runs, certainly not as often as I\'d like, but these home runs were all
before I started using mones about 5 weeks ago. Speaking of strange arguments, I don\'t know why you\'d state
that pheromones would have no effect on the outcome. Doesn\'t exactly sound like a promotion of them. If they
would have NO EFFECT on the outcome, why would anybody buy them?
I don\'t expect to dab mones on, go to a
social function, sit on my butt, do nothing, and expect women to flock to me. But I would hope they would help
increase the chances of women acting favorably when I approach them. At the very least, I would hope to see
increased eye contact from SOME women.
AzMike
AzMike
11-10-2003, 11:57 AM
</font><blockquote><font class=\"small\">Quote:</font><hr />
Too bad you wont be able to explore the
world of PI/m...
Phantom.
<hr /></blockquote><font class=\"post\">
I do have the potential to become a
hard-core experimenter and tester, buying PI/m, A1, P10, even the chem sets. I just need to see some evidence that
the not-so-expensive mones work first. If I find a product or dosage that produces a fair number of hits for me, I
will be hooked. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif
</font><blockquote><font
class=\"small\">Quote:</font><hr />
AzMike, what kind of hits are you looking for?
Phantom.
<hr
/></blockquote><font class=\"post\">
I am looking for almost anything out of the ordinary. Increased eye
contact, flirty/touchy behavior, increased chattiness, etc. Like most of us, I am mainly looking for a product that
will produce sexual hits, rather than friendship hits. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smirk.gif But I am
keeping my eyes open for any behavior that seems outside the normal range of what I\'ve seen in the
past.
AzMike
Irish
11-10-2003, 01:18 PM
Since you mention a desire to get more eye contact, I’ll throw this out there for what it’s worth.
Irish’s Scheme for Pursuit Encounters:
I basically operate on the anthropological courtship scheme…courtship
operates through several stages before progressing to intercourse, and the order of the stages is important. The
first stage is the sending of presence and gender cues – all non-verbal. Eye contact is perhaps the most important,
although there are many gestures that are subconsciously processed. Next comes return signals of recognition and
permission to approach. Everything so far is non-verbal, and includes the eye contact you are looking for.
Next
the big hurdle: approach and speech, followed later by touching during the conversation. The moment builds rapidly
from here, with the couple seeking solitude for more intimate touch, kissing, and sex. Of course there’s little
advances and retreats throughout the process, and depending on how it goes the whole cycle can happen in one
encounter, or be spread out over many encounters. This is pretty basic stuff, but the idea of courtship occurring in
stages is what I’m getting at.
At what stage do pheros fit in? Well, at natural concentration levels on the human
skin, I think it would be when we were pretty close to the woman. Several years ago E. Miller made the point that
pheros are for close-in effect, not long distance signaling, and I tend to agree. Miller thinks the visual is for
long distance signals (eye contact, gestures, gender cues). If the theory of courtship stages is correct then the
visual would therefore be the primary sense in the early (longer-distance) stage of courtship. Only when the couple
had drawn closer together would the pheros begin to have significant impact (at distance smells are dispersed by the
wind, confused with other people’s and the environment, etc.) Visual cues are individual-specific at any distance;
smell cues are only individual-specific at close range in the ‘normal’ course of things.
Said all that to say
this: Signals like eye contact may be more significant in the early courtship encounter, when there is some physical
distance, and not designed to be facilitated by pheros. You don’t need pheros to catch a girl’s eye across the room:
people are quite sensitive to eye contact anyway. But in the later stages of an encounter, when you have drawn
physically close, then the pheros are exerting their influence. It makes sense to me, since only after you are close
would you be within ‘smelling range’ of an individual.
Loading up on commercial pheros to catch attention may be
counterproductive. The heavy dose could be repellent when you do eventually move in closer, and you may be getting
the courtship sequence out of order anyway by trying to increase eye contact with smell cues. Go ahead and catch her
eye contact up front, then move in for the phero effects as you begin to converse at close range.
In my
experience this holds. For me phero use tends to increase the sexiness of the conversation, the openness to touch
(giving and receiving)...the things associated with later courtship phases. I’ve had girls hanging on me and asking
why I smell good, what cologne I’m wearing, etc. That’s why I’m so big on not od-ing to the point where they will
be offended when they do get close. I use pheros to facilitate my conversation and touching moves, not really so
much to draw initial longer-distance attention. I can use my eyes for that anyway without smell cues.
Bernard
11-10-2003, 07:03 PM
</font><blockquote><font class=\"small\">Quote:</font><hr />
Said all that to say this: Signals
like eye contact may be more significant in the early courtship encounter, when there is some physical distance, and
not designed to be facilitated by pheros. You don’t need pheros to catch a girl’s eye across the room: people are
quite sensitive to eye contact anyway. But in the later stages of an encounter, when you have drawn physically
close, then the pheros are exerting their influence. It makes sense to me, since only after you are close would you
be within ‘smelling range’ of an individual.
Loading up on commercial pheros to catch attention may be
counterproductive. The heavy dose could be repellent when you do eventually move in closer, and you may be getting
the courtship sequence out of order anyway by trying to increase eye contact with smell cues. Go ahead and catch her
eye contact up front, then move in for the phero effects as you begin to converse at c
<hr /></blockquote><font
class=\"post\">
i just wonder if u are ugly , how would women make a eye contact with u. even u try to make
eye contact with her, if u dont have some x factor in ur physical part to catch her eyes, i dont think she would be
attracted / going to bother about u , isnt it? /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/crazy.gif
bernard:
That is why I got pheromones. I am butt ugly and it looks like someone smashed a bag
of marbles into my face, on a good day. In a perfect world, I would be able to get the visual attention and
invitation from women. However, since that is not something that happens, pheromones provide me and many others of
this forum with that edge to get your foot in the door.
Bernard
11-10-2003, 08:40 PM
then wha do u think between good looking feature that would mesmerize all the woment and more
naturalpheromone, which one is better? if only given 1 choice , which 1 do u want to have? personally i still feel
having better charming look would be more advantage than having natural more pheromone. i just do not know why i had
this thought!/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/crazy.gif
Slinger
11-10-2003, 09:51 PM
Bernard, looks don\'t mean quite as much to women as one might think. But thinking you\'re ugly on
the starting line is a formula for FAILURE! We all have to play the hand we\'re dealt, but you owe it to
yourself, if to no one else, to make the best of your life and the body you\'re given and to change the things you
can. Work out, eat healthy, take pride in your body, be friendly, and you\'ll become someone people WANT to hang
out with, add the proper pheros to the mix, and you may never melt the ice queens, but you\'ll find girls taking
interest in you that you might have thought were out of your league not too long ago, and now they wanna play in
YOUR league /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/cool.gif Trust me that is the way it works, and you truly have
to love yourself before anyone else will. Working out is a GOOD solid start and (as long as you\'re careful
/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif) can ONLY be a step in the right direction. You CANNOT lose
ANYTHING by working out. It makes your BODY look good, it makes you FEEL good, and people around you WILL notice
the multi-level changes in you.
Slinger
AzMike
11-11-2003, 01:04 AM
</font><blockquote><font class=\"small\">Quote:</font><hr />
I was a skeptic going in. But I got
enough surprising results early on to investigate in earnest, to see if there was a scientific basis.
I can tell
you that interactions have become much easier since I began to experiment, especially with women approaching me and
initiating conversations. I had expected failure and tried pheros on a whim, but the results really changed my
mind. And there’s enough science to validate my experience, that it’s not ‘all in my head’ or the result of some
changed attitude. But there’s been some rough spots along the road, especially with scent od’s. Such is the price
of exploration.
I can honestly tell you that I have noticed a huge increase in responses from women when I am
close to them for some time (like sitting next to them or standing close). They often flirt physically by taking my
arm, touching thighs – you name it – and its come from women I just met as well as ones I’ve known for years. I
really must credit the pheros, cause in the previous decade before pheros this probably happened to me only twice.
Now it’s a fairly regular event. The trick for me seems to be a light dose, and close physical proximity for a while
. The longer they are near me and as conversation unfolds the more overt their reaction becomes.
Anyway, try
that. Make pheros a component of your conversation with women, and see what happens. Try it with enough girls to
see if you notice anything, or compare to reactions on days you don’t use pheros. I’m like you – if I hadn’t noticed
anything going on I wouldn’t have stuck with it. But I can vouch for my own results, and hope you have similar
experiences.
<hr /></blockquote><font class=\"post\">
Thanks for your informative, encouraging, and
thoughtful post, Irish. I\'ve had very little in the way of women approaching me and initiating conversations
with me since I started using pheros around Oct 1, once in a great while they do, which is just about the same as
before Oct 1. And I\'ve noticed no increase in women flirting physically by taking my arm, touching thighs,
etc.
I didn\'t expect to do any field tests at all Monday. But on a whim, decided to hit the health club after
work today. I get the impression from some posters here that I should try light doses more, so I intend to do that
more when I go somewhere where there\'s many people I know. BUT, I know very few people at the health club, so I
decided to do the opposite. I gave myself 4 sprays of TE/m, and 3 sprays of DZP cologne, to see if a big dose would
make a difference. I did feel that some women may have looked at me more than normal, but not a big increase. No
women seemed repelled by me, and I didn\'t notice any glares from any males in the club. One unusual thing was I
was on a calf-exercising machine, and a male next to me started up a conversation about how he was hoping to buy a
machine like the one he was working on, but it was 500 dollars, way too expensive.
It is unusual for any stranger
in this health club to start a conversation with me, and this seemed especially strange since I was using a -none
only product, with no -nol or -rone. If this had been a woman, I would have considered it to be a bonafide hit, but
not a male. ANY woman who acts unusually toward me, will be a hit, regardless of whether she\'s a beauty queen,
or looks like Frankenstein. But not guys.
On leaving the club, I walked by a woman who was on a hike I was on in
mid-October, and we stopped and chatted for a few minutes. I didn\'t expect to see someone I knew like that, but
this happens once in a while. She didn\'t seem more friendly or flirty than normal, but also didn\'t seem less
friendly, or repelled by me, in spite of my big TE application. She was standing 18-24 inches away, for about 3
minutes.
AzMike
AzMike
11-11-2003, 01:16 AM
</font><blockquote><font class=\"small\">Quote:</font><hr />
Great Post Irish. AZMike I suggest
Alter Ego with all three mones. It\'s the first product I bought and probably the most successful stand-alone.
I\'ve got more sexual hits with it that way. Since I\'ve tried mixing AE/NPA I\'ve OD each time. Too much
aggression. When I\'ve added SOE or WAGG I get thought of as being gay. It\'s definitely better to have the
SOE/WAGG added though because the AE/NPA can be dangerous for me. One girl at club claimed that I said that I wanted
to f_ck her even though I had not talked or touched her. She went to a bouncer claiming this and I got bounced. Also
I have had women think I had said f_ck to them during conversation even though I hadn\'t or exclaim \'f_ck\'
out of the blue. I think the message they get from AE alone is less intrusive and more are likely to react
favorably. As if it\'s more of a \'I so want to get to know you\' instead of the more blatantly intrusive
\'I wanna f-ck you\' that occurs when near an OD.
I\'m gonna go by the less is more theory and try AE again
alone. Also NPA with cologne. Pheromones can be dangerous if too much is used IMO. But if you do make sure to have
SOE & WAGG.
<hr /></blockquote><font class=\"post\">
Thanks bigdog. I actually considered Alter Ego as
my initial purchase, and its a good candidate for my next one. I haven\'t gotten any negative reactions from
anybody yet, while using mones. I don\'t want to get bounced from a club, but no one- female or male- has acted
in a negatively-aggressive manner toward me yet, even with 2, 3, or even 4 sprays of TE/m.
I wonder if your body
type will affect if you get these negative reactions. I am in great cardiovascular shape, I hike up big mountains
every few weeks. But I am thin and not really muscular. I work out at the gym, and actually have decent upper-body
strength, but don\'t seem to have the genetic makeup to get much in the way of visible muscles. I wonder if some
guys who get these bad reactions /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mad.gif with mone ODing, have more of a
\"big bear\" body type. A \"mesomorph\" if you will.
AzMike
Supposedly we use visual cues to figure out someones pheromoens signature.
I think with the big
guys, they are interpreted as having a lot of none, and when they use sytnhetic pheromones that are largely none,
targets get both the implied visual reaction and the reaction from there actual pheromone signature, and it has
threat written all over it. It (the visual aspect) either legitimizes the feelings that the none gives the targets,
or could be more like having a double-dose of none.
Yes they definitely are more likely to have those bad
experiences ODing, even if their natural none + synthetic none equals the exact same total as mine.
</font><blockquote><font class=\"small\">Quote:</font><hr />
Bernard, looks don\'t mean quite as
much to women as one might think. But thinking you\'re ugly on the starting line is a formula for FAILURE! We
all have to play the hand we\'re dealt, but you owe it to yourself, if to no one else, to make the best of your
life and the body you\'re given and to change the things you can. Work out, eat healthy, take pride in your body,
be friendly, and you\'ll become someone people WANT to hang out with, add the proper pheros to the mix, and you
may never melt the ice queens, but you\'ll find girls taking interest in you that you might have thought were out
of your league not too long ago, and now they wanna play in YOUR league
/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/cool.gif Trust me that is the way it works, and you truly have to love
yourself before anyone else will. Working out is a GOOD solid start and (as long as you\'re careful
/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif) can ONLY be a step in the right direction. You CANNOT lose
ANYTHING by working out. It makes your BODY look good, it makes you FEEL good, and people around you WILL notice
the multi-level changes in you.
Slinger
<hr /></blockquote><font class=\"post\">
Also, there\'s
such a thing as ugly-sexy. Bogart, Tommy Lee Jones, Tom Berenger. Then there are guys like Tom Sellick and Brad Pitt
who are classically attractive, but don\'t have much sex appeal. In guys, looks don\'t often have a lot to do
with sex appeal. It\'s presence that matters.
bigdog
11-11-2003, 07:57 AM
AZMike-I am fairly stocky and muscular. That could contribute to the bouncer issues for I\'ve heard
they tend to go after guys that are perceived similar to themselves. I do believe OD contributed and alcohol can
somewhat too. I don\'t think I\'ve been too aggressive but yet I have seemed to be more confident & perhaps
cocky since using pheros. As Irish mentioned it is wise to watch carefully for cues. I\'ve learned to better watch
for that now. A girl that works at the club I was bounced from also figured out I wear pheros as she keeps telling
me she knows I buy off the internet. That doesn\'t help for she surely told others. The manager welcomes me back
for I have friends that frequent there. Yet I think it\'s right for me to avoid the place for now.
I
mentioned before that too much none kind of gives out the \'I wanna F_ck you\' vibe. While I think AE gives out
the more \'I\'m really digging you and wanna get to know you\' vibe. I first bought AE and used alone and the
best results with it alone. Combos have not worked well for me so far. Lately I have been overutilizing nol which
has given me alot fo social hits. Yet I have been perceived strangely enough by some as gay. I\'m not gonna use
SOE or WAGG with AE that much for that reason. I\'m just gonna stick to AE alone or NPA/cologne for now. AE has
enough nol & rone IMO.
JohnnyM
11-11-2003, 10:56 AM
</font><blockquote><font class=\"small\">Quote:</font><hr />
Next the big hurdle: approach and
speech, followed later by touching during the conversation. The moment builds rapidly from here, with the couple
seeking solitude for more intimate touch, kissing, and sex. Of course there’s little advances and retreats
throughout the process, and depending on how it goes the whole cycle can happen in one encounter, or be spread out
over many encounters. This is pretty basic stuff, but the idea of courtship occurring in stages is what I’m getting
at.
<hr /></blockquote><font class=\"post\">
Not to get away from the topic of this thread, but I really
liked Irish\'s post. This is one area that I\'d like to learn more about, the \"approach and speech\".
I tend to agree that in order for the \'mones to work you must be in close proximity to the other person.
Having had two long-term relationships in a row I have not been on the dating scene for over 12 years and I\'m now
back on the prowl if you will. But I\'d like to get some advice on how to go from a smile from across the room to
approaching the person and striking up a conversation. Am I worrying too much about it? Should I just walk up and
say, “Hi!\"? Hehe... What gives you the clue that a woman is attracted, if even only slightly, to you from across
the room?
-- Johnny
</font><blockquote><font class=\"small\">Quote:</font><hr />
</font><blockquote><font
class=\"small\">Quote:</font><hr />
Next the big hurdle: approach and speech, followed later by touching during
the conversation. The moment builds rapidly from here, with the couple seeking solitude for more intimate touch,
kissing, and sex. Of course there’s little advances and retreats throughout the process, and depending on how it
goes the whole cycle can happen in one encounter, or be spread out over many encounters. This is pretty basic stuff,
but the idea of courtship occurring in stages is what I’m getting at.
<hr /></blockquote><font
class=\"post\">
Not to get away from the topic of this thread, but I really liked Irish\'s post. This is one
area that I\'d like to learn more about, the \"approach and speech\".
I tend to agree that in order for the
\'mones to work you must be in close proximity to the other person. Having had two long-term relationships in a
row I have not been on the dating scene for over 12 years and I\'m now back on the prowl if you will. But I\'d
like to get some advice on how to go from a smile from across the room to approaching the person and striking up a
conversation. Am I worrying too much about it? Should I just walk up and say, “Hi!\"? Hehe... What gives you the
clue that a woman is attracted, if even only slightly, to you from across the room?
-- Johnny
<hr
/></blockquote><font class=\"post\">
Eye contact is a biggy. Does she subtly \"check you out,\" then look
away quickly, if you notice? Does she meet your eyes for one or two seconds, and then look someplace else?
franki
11-11-2003, 11:16 AM
</font><blockquote><font class=\"small\">Quote:</font><hr />
Does she subtly \"check you out,\"
then look away quickly, if you notice? Does she meet your eyes for one or two seconds, and then look someplace else?
<hr /></blockquote><font class=\"post\">
I have this all the time. I heard it makes a difference when
she looks away to the ground after it or looks at something else. What is better?
/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/confused.gif
Sexyredhead
11-11-2003, 11:18 AM
It\'s not so much that she looks at you and looks away, but if she looks at you, then
looks down and away. That\'s a sign of interest.
i didn\'t know looks at something else was bad. Looking at the ground is submitting I thnk. Is
looking to the side not also a sign of a good thing? And what happens if they look at you for about 15 seconds like
they want to kill you? That happened to me the other night.
Sexyredhead
11-11-2003, 11:26 AM
</font><blockquote><font class=\"small\">Quote:</font><hr />
i didn\'t know looks at something
else was bad. Looking at the ground is submitting I thnk. Is looking to the side not also a sign of a good thing?
And what happens if they look at you for about 15 seconds like they want to kill you? That happened to me the other
night.
<hr /></blockquote><font class=\"post\">
Generally if they look at you, then look off to the side
before dropping their gaze, the woman isn\'t interested in you. She may be wondering where you got that hat.
/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif Guys, on the other hand, don\'t generally look down, but away,
then come back. But watch--is she looking away AND down? That\'s still down.
/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif
If she looks at you for 15 seconds like she wants to kill you,
maybe she\'s had a few too many and you look like her ex-bf, the lousy cheating bastard! Anyway, I\'d probably
stay away from anybody giving me hostile glares from across the room.
/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/tongue.gif
cuddlebear
11-11-2003, 11:55 AM
So down and away simultaneously is the key? Worth a try ... I will watch for that in the future.
I\'m so glad we have females here /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif
i think she meant down and then away OR down and away.
to the sde, you should be fine to, they may
notice you but haven\'t made the judgement to submit, which is what looking down signals. But it is hard to go
and break up a conversation either way, if she is with her friends, if she doesn\'t hold eye contact long enough
for you to smile.
I have found some pheromone doses they can always smile back, while others they are too
paralyzed to return the gesture or even look away.
JohnnyM
11-11-2003, 12:02 PM
</font><blockquote><font class=\"small\">Quote:</font><hr />
If she looks at you for 15 seconds like
she wants to kill you, maybe she\'s had a few too many and you look like her ex-bf, the lousy cheating
bastard!
<hr /></blockquote><font class=\"post\">
Hahaha! Okay, this is all fascinating to me. Is this a
proven behavior? Eye contact (maybe a smile) and then looking down and away? So rolling of the eyes and mouthing
\"bug off!\" is a definite not a good sign? ROFL - Just kidding. I mean, some things are clear as day, but for me
the BIGGEST hurdle is just getting past the eye contact to actually approaching the woman. I guess I\'m just sort
of shy about walking up to a woman I\'ve never met and striking up the conversation. That is where I need to work
on things. I just want a definite sign before I take that chance I guess. Sort of embarrassing for a 35 year old man
to be shy about approaching women, eh?
</font><blockquote><font class=\"small\">Quote:</font><hr />
</font><blockquote><font
class=\"small\">Quote:</font><hr />
If she looks at you for 15 seconds like she wants to kill you, maybe she\'s
had a few too many and you look like her ex-bf, the lousy cheating bastard!
<hr /></blockquote><font
class=\"post\">
Hahaha! Okay, this is all fascinating to me. Is this a proven behavior? Eye contact (maybe a
smile) and then looking down and away? So rolling of the eyes and mouthing \"bug off!\" is a definite not a good
sign? ROFL - Just kidding. I mean, some things are clear as day, but for me the BIGGEST hurdle is just getting past
the eye contact to actually approaching the woman. I guess I\'m just sort of shy about walking up to a woman
I\'ve never met and striking up the conversation. That is where I need to work on things. I just want a definite
sign before I take that chance I guess. Sort of embarrassing for a 35 year old man to be shy about approaching
women, eh?
<hr /></blockquote><font class=\"post\">
NOT embarassing to be shy. Men are more vulnerable to
rejection, than women. All women have to do is... expect approaches, then accept or reject.
.. and, if she looks, then looks away.. then looks BACK when she thinks you won\'t notice... you have
her attention.
Or, you may have spinach on your teeth. <G>
Pancho1188
11-11-2003, 12:18 PM
</font><blockquote><font class=\"small\">Quote:</font><hr />
All women have to do is... expect
approaches, then accept or reject.
<hr /></blockquote><font class=\"post\">
And for this, women should
never whine about anything ever again... /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif J/K.
Kari --
Question. I\'ve always thought women were far more vunerable.... which is why I
thought they have trouble making the first move, among other reasons.
I.E. If a single man rejects a woman,
it is more often than not because he isn\'t physically turned on by her. We are a lot less choosy about who and
how many sexual partners to pursue, making a gizzilion sperm a minute as we do.
Women on the other hand, can
be rejecting because of looks, personality (which a man doesn\'t have to take personally when the woman doesn\'t
know him well) or she\'s just not in the right state of mind at the time, etc. Seems to me we have very little at
stake, considering it could be a anyone of a number of personal or inpersonal reasons for the rejection, and we
will never know which one it is.
Women on the other hand can usually figure it out (looks), and I would think
it is difficult to make the first move when you are always knowing what personal thing you are being judged
on.
See what I am saying? Why do you think that men are more vulnerable?
cuddlebear
11-11-2003, 12:50 PM
Men are more likely to take rejection personally, the male ego thing ...
Women know if one guy
doesn\'t dig on them, that there are a thousand other horny fish in the sea ...
Never thought that was very
fair myself ...
</font><blockquote><font class=\"small\">Quote:</font><hr />
Kari --
Question. I\'ve always
thought women were far more vunerable.... which is why I thought they have trouble making the first move, among
other reasons.
I.E. If a single man rejects a woman, it is more often than not because he isn\'t physically
turned on by her. We are a lot less choosy about who and how many sexual partners to pursue, making a gizzilion
sperm a minute as we do.
Women on the other hand, can be rejecting because of looks, personality (which a man
doesn\'t have to take personally when the woman doesn\'t know him well) or she\'s just not in the right state
of mind at the time, etc. Seems to me we have very little at stake, considering it could be a anyone of a number
of personal or inpersonal reasons for the rejection, and we will never know which one it is.
Women on the other
hand can usually figure it out (looks), and I would think it is difficult to make the first move when you are always
knowing what personal thing you are being judged on.
See what I am saying? Why do you think that men are more
vulnerable?
<hr /></blockquote><font class=\"post\">
I\'m not sure that women have difficulty
making the first DIRECT move, as much as many of us prefer to be approached, so that we can appear to do the
selecting. I say \"appear,\" because we have often managed to make the first indirect move-- subtly indicating
interest through looks, banter, innuendo, or body language. If the man doesn\'t pick up on the signals, we assume
he isn\'t interested. Because the move was indirect, the lady hasn\'t risked her ego.
Most women can quickly
assess which men are likely to be receptive (it\'s in the eyes), and can limit their \"signals\" to those.
Also, because men are less choosy, thanks to testosterone, women get approached a lot. So, it\'s easy to sit
back and choose. The lady doesn\'t have to make the first direct move, unless she chooses to be the aggressor
(which can also be fun). <g>
I think some men are more sensitive than they appear to be, and can be
momentarily a little bruised by a rejection-- or a few rejections-- even if there is no emotional involvement. I
think some men may not consider all the factors involved in eliciting a womans interest (as you have), and may think
that her rejection reflects solely on his lack of attractiveness. In short-- I think that some men expect women to
think like they do.
A woman gets valdiation of her attractiveness just from the approaches, even if the man
doesn\'t interest her.
There are, of course, guys like the late TV actor, Hugh O\'Brian. He used to walk up
to women and say, \"I\'m Hugh O\'Brian, wanna f**K?\" He might get rejected 50 time, he used to say, But,
he\'d ask 51 times. So, he always got laid. <g>
I hope I\'ve explained myself clearly. If I haven\'t
please let me know-- it\'s been a rough day.
Thanks! K.
I am sorry if it a rough day.
I think I understand what you are saying. I thought you meant men
are more vunerable making the first move than women. From what I read, you seem to be saying men are more vunerable
in the scene because they have to do the soliciting, women do the choosing (which is a position of power as opposed
to vunerability).
You are definitely right, some men have there egos bruised because they don\'t realize how
the process is different for women than men.
And I love the indirect signals. Send me a sign! Too bad so many
women tend to be shy and don\'t use them! Plus maybe they don\'t want to send signinals to guys who miht turn
out to be pigs. Maybe the pigs ruin it for us all.
I am sorry if it a rough day.
-- Thanks! The gym, after work, will smooth it out.
I think I
understand what you are saying. I thought you meant men are more vunerable making the first move than women. From
what I read, you seem to be saying men are more vunerable in the scene because they have to do the soliciting, women
do the choosing (which is a position of power as opposed to vunerability).
-- Exactly! Men have to put their egos
on the line. Women just have to signal, then wait and see whether he bites.
You are definitely right, some men
have there egos bruised because they don\'t realize how the process is different for women than men.
-- You
have a rare understanding of the process. I hate to see a guy get a little bruised, because he doesn\'t understand
that womens\' criteria are more complicated-- or at least, different.
And I love the indirect signals. Send
me a sign! Too bad so many women tend to be shy and don\'t use them! Plus maybe they don\'t want to send
signinals to guys who miht turn out to be pigs. Maybe the pigs ruin it for us all.
-- I think you\'re right.
Many ladies find it scary. Though, it needn\'t be. If he turns out to be a pig, she can beat a retreat.
-- Re:
signals: there was a TV movie called \"Sex and Mrs. X\" starring Jackie Bissett. In one scene, she demonstrated
casting a subtle, but alluring look over the rim of her wine glass.
</font><blockquote><font class=\"small\">Quote:</font><hr />
Men are more likely to take rejection
personally, the male ego thing ...
Women know if one guy doesn\'t dig on them, that there are a thousand other
horny fish in the sea ...
Never thought that was very fair myself ...
<hr /></blockquote><font
class=\"post\">
If you read all of the holy books, of all of the religions, you will never find the word
\"fair\" in any of them. <g>
Irish
11-11-2003, 01:58 PM
In mammals including primates (which we are), and in numerous direct studies of human courtship, the
basic pattern is the same. There are exchanged signals of gender and recognition. Next the female sends an overt
signal of some kind (‘proceptive behavior’), which incites the male to ‘approach’. Then the female exhibits
‘receptive behavior’ to his advance. The next generation is ensured…
Aside from the scientific lingo, it’s
all pretty simple when it plays out. We are basically unaware of all this signaling at the time (unless we’ve
studied it and concentrate), and the signals are processed unconsciously. The biggest detriment to a smooth
courtship is neurotic focus on ourselves and our own fragile egos – our big forebrain gets in the way and we stumble
over it on the way to our dreamgirl. The remedy is to put on your best ‘gameface’ in advance (grooming, clothes,
pheros, etc.) and then forget about that and yourself. Focus on the girl, instead of how you are coming across –
she’ll sense and appreciate that attention.
I like to keep things simple. Catch a girl’s glance a few times,
smile a little, see how she responds. If it is at all positive just walk up introduce yourself and start a casual
conversation. Any topic is fine - especially commenting on what\'s going on around you. The idea is that now you
are talking - not that you are a brilliant conversationalist. If it doesn’t click after a few minutes or she seems
annoyed just smile and beg off with a “Nice talking to ya!”, and move on. Anyone can engage in a simple casual
conversation with no danger to their ego. If the conversation starts to develop into something more - great! If not,
no harm done.
Hell sometimes we act like we’re trying to communicate with an alien species…they’re just women
after all. They’re programmed to respond to men just like men are programmed to chase them. Just follow the basic
pattern and try not to overthink the proceedings. Focus outwardly instead of inwardly.
Being able to
recognize positive encouraging signals will help you avoid rejection when you approach - you\'ll have an idea if
she wants you to approach , and you can pass her by if she\'s signaling dislike. But even if you get it wrong
you\'re not going to die, and most of the time you can exit gracefully from a rejection if you have decent
manners.
</font><blockquote><font class=\"small\">Quote:</font><hr />
In mammals including primates (which we
are), and in numerous direct studies of human courtship, the basic pattern is the same. There are exchanged signals
of gender and recognition. Next the female sends an overt signal of some kind (‘proceptive behavior’), which incites
the male to ‘approach’. Then the female exhibits ‘receptive behavior’ to his advance. The next generation is
ensured…
Aside from the scientific lingo, it’s all pretty simple when it plays out. We are basically unaware of
all this signaling at the time (unless we’ve studied it and concentrate), and the signals are processed
unconsciously. The biggest detriment to a smooth courtship is neurotic focus on ourselves and our own fragile egos –
our big forebrain gets in the way and we stumble over it on the way to our dreamgirl. The remedy is to put on your
best ‘gameface’ in advance (grooming, clothes, pheros, etc.) and then forget about that and yourself. Focus on the
girl, instead of how you are coming across – she’ll sense and appreciate that attention.
I like to keep things
simple. Catch a girl’s glance a few times, smile a little, see how she responds. If it is at all positive just walk
up introduce yourself and start a casual conversation. Any topic is fine - especially commenting on what\'s going
on around you. The idea is that now you are talking - not that you are a brilliant conversationalist. If it doesn’t
click after a few minutes or she seems annoyed just smile and beg off with a “Nice talking to ya!”, and move on.
Anyone can engage in a simple casual conversation with no danger to their ego. If the conversation starts to develop
into something more - great! If not, no harm done.
Hell sometimes we act like we’re trying to communicate with an
alien species…they’re just women after all. They’re programmed to respond to men just like men are programmed to
chase them. Just follow the basic pattern and try not to overthink the proceedings. Focus outwardly instead of
inwardly.
Being able to recognize positive encouraging signals will help you avoid rejection when you approach -
you\'ll have an idea if she wants you to approach , and you can pass her by if she\'s signaling dislike. But
even if you get it wrong you\'re not going to die, and most of the time you can exit gracefully from a rejection
if you have decent manners.
<hr /></blockquote><font class=\"post\">
The first paragraph shows that we
really haven\'t been out of the tress, all that long. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif
bigdog
11-11-2003, 02:36 PM
Very insightful posts Kari & Irish. Most men do not look for or pick up on the right cues. Even if
they do many will fail to act on them anyway. The lines also fail once a followup is initiated. Especially in a bar
scenario where people tend to not act as themselves and are out to deviously impress.
</font><blockquote><font class=\"small\">Quote:</font><hr />
Very insightful posts Kari & Irish.
Most men do not look for or pick up on the right cues. Even if they do many will fail to act on them anyway. The
lines also fail once a followup is initiated. Especially in a bar scenario where people tend to not act as
themselves and are out to deviously impress.
<hr /></blockquote><font class=\"post\">
But.. a man who
DOES pick up on the cues... especially the less obvious ones.... can get VERY lucky!
bigdog
11-11-2003, 02:57 PM
Kari-Have you ever been affected by another\'s mones and in waht way did you react?
</font><blockquote><font class=\"small\">Quote:</font><hr />
Kari-Have you ever been affected by
another\'s mones and in waht way did you react?
<hr /></blockquote><font class=\"post\">
I think so. I
have a friend who doesn\'t wear mones. But, he REALLY puts out the sexual vibes. It\'s almost palpable. I think
he generates a lot of natural mones. He isn\'t that good looking. He also isn\'t my type. We have nothing in
common. But, I often want to nibble his neck, and I hug him a lot. He\'s involved, so I can\'t flirt \"with
intent.\" But, I notice that women turn to look at him, on the street.
He only affects me, if I am in fairly
close proximity.
Sacogoo
11-11-2003, 03:59 PM
Johnny writes:
</font><blockquote><font class=\"small\">Quote:</font><hr />
But I\'d like to
get some advice on how to go from a smile from across the room to approaching the person and striking up a
conversation. Am I worrying too much about it? Should I just walk up and say, &#8220;Hi!\"? Hehe... What gives
you the clue that a woman is attracted, if even only slightly, to you from across the room?
<hr
/></blockquote><font class=\"post\">
An initial very short eye contact, followed by repeated short eye contact.
Find an excuse to walk by \"target\" and eye contact with a small but sincere smile. Followed up with a very
short, but meaningful positive comment (\"those are the sexiest boots I\'ve ever seen\"), which will let you
know if you can go on from there.
Crap, who knows what really works. I had a girl start making out with me and
go down the front of my pants because I grabbed her and took her along when I was making a surge to the front row of
the stage at a Poison/Ratt concert. (BTW - we were making out in the front row during the concert.) (And no,
I\'m not going to explain what I was doing at a Poison/Ratt concert in the first place. Screw you - they were
cool in the late eighties.)
</font><blockquote><font class=\"small\">Quote:</font><hr />
Sort of
embarrassing for a 35 year old man to be shy about approaching women, eh?
<hr /></blockquote><font
class=\"post\">
Not really. You\'re still the same person you were 15 years ago, and you were probably shy
then. I\'m shy. Seriously. If it wasn\'t for girls asking me out from 14 to 24, I probably wouldn\'t have
gone out at all. However, I\'ve found out that just opening up and initiating the contact and conversation, you
can get a lot more accomplished than hoping and waiting for somebody else to do it instead. Life is short, and
being reserved and hoping that somebody else makes the first move makes it all that much shorter.
Besides -
what\'s the worst that could happen? She says no? Well then, you are still at the same place that you were if
you did nothing at all. And, perhaps, just maybe, if you actually initiate the contact/conversation, etc., you
might actually find that things work out for the best.
You\'ll never know unless you try.
Sacogoo
11-11-2003, 04:18 PM
Kari writes:
</font><blockquote><font class=\"small\">Quote:</font><hr />
If the man doesn\'t
pick up on the signals, we assume he isn\'t interested.
<hr /></blockquote><font class=\"post\">
Wrong!
Assume the man is drunk or stupid or oblivious, but don\'t assume that he isn\'t interested. Every guy (at
least every guy I know, including myself) likes to be hit on by women, and subtle doesn\'t usually get it with us.
Most of us require the frying pan to the head to get that information in. (Don\'t think that \"Can I buy you a
drink?\" is a strong approach - most guys will just think \"Sweet! A free drink! I wonder why she bought me a
drink. I only wish that I had the balls to talk to her.\")
All guys are interested, especially if the woman is
even remotely attractive. Married guys. Single guys. Partially dead guys. We\'re just stupid, and don\'t
want to offend you, or are scared of rejection or whatever. We\'re still interested. Hell, every time I walk out
the door I\'m saddened that I don\'t get hit on, and then wonder why every woman is so unaccessible. Frigid
bunch of uptight bitches! Why can\'t I get laid? C\'MON! And then we just can\'t believe that the girl we
had our eyes on all night ends up going home with some heavy browed neanderthal. I can\'t believe that she went
home with that ape when I could have loved her forever with all my heart. (Sure, we were too chicken to even go up
to her or look at her all night, but goddamn if we weren\'t interested. Not interested?! I\'d have given my
left nut to have been with her tonight!)
That\'s most guys in a nutshell. With the exception of the dopey
meatheads who are either too stupid to ponder and deal with the possible subconcious complications subsequent to the
rejection, or have nothing to lose as they have already figured out from numerous rejections that life goes on, so
they might as well take a shot at the hot chick.
However, once a normal guy does initiate conversation with the
\"hot chick\", watch how many of the chicken sh_t mediocrity then go diving in in an attempt at contact. (It\'s
like baseball. A pitcher is just throwing bb\'s and nobody can touch him, then your 8th position guy rocks a
double and then everybody thinks that they can hit the guy. Girls and like a curveball. Nobody thinks that they
can hit it, but as soon as somebody does, everybody wants to, and thinks that they can, hit that stuff.)
cuddlebear
11-11-2003, 04:36 PM
I second this post. An uninterested male? Not likely ...
Icarus
11-11-2003, 04:55 PM
goood post!
Sexyredhead
11-11-2003, 04:57 PM
</font><blockquote><font class=\"small\">Quote:</font><hr />
An uninterested male? Not likely ...
<hr /></blockquote><font class=\"post\">
I don\'t mean to offend any of the guys posting, but...you
know, I see you guys saying all this, and then I think back to all the posts where I see guys complain about fat or
ugly women hitting on them, and wanting to know how they can get them to stop.
Just an observation.
Pancho1188
11-11-2003, 05:14 PM
Yeah, and women complain about ugly, uninteresting guys or jerks hitting on them all of the time when
all they really want is a \'nice guy\'... Go figure.
I still say we need a definite system to get the
go-ahead to flirt with someone. Something like the \'hotornot\' system where you both click \'yes\' if
you\'re interested and then attempt conversation. If I were a TV network, I\'d start a show where they made
definite verbal signals on whether a guy/girl was interested. For instance, if you were interested, you\'d say
\"Hi,\" but if you weren\'t you\'d say, \"Hey, there.\" That way you could let someone know where you stand
without saying anything out of the ordinary. This, of course, would never work, but it\'s nice to dream. This
goes along the lines of my \'ring\' idea where if you\'re married you have the ring on the left ring finger,
if you have a bf or are interested in someone you put a ring on your right ring finger, and if you want some action
you have no rings. That way no one looking for action will bother flirting with you if you have the ring. Great
system, absolutely no relation to what\'s really possible and no capability of instituting it globally.
/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/tongue.gif A man can dream, dammit!!!
/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif
Icarus
11-11-2003, 05:15 PM
</font><blockquote><font class=\"small\">Quote:</font><hr />
I don\'t mean to offend any of
the guys posting, but...you know, I see you guys saying all this, and then I think back to all the posts where I see
guys complain about fat or ugly women hitting on them, and wanting to know how they can get them to stop.
<hr /></blockquote><font class=\"post\">
A very good point.
This fence is rather uncomfortable.
DrSmellThis
11-11-2003, 06:11 PM
I think those kinds of posts stick out like a sore thumb, but usually us guys have our thumbs, and
heads, stuck safely up our asses. You have to know how to give a clear signal. This is a fundamental skill of
womanhood, in my O. On the other hand, our job is to learn to recognize clear signals. This is where evolution comes
in.
EXIT63
11-11-2003, 06:12 PM
</font><blockquote><font class=\"small\">Quote:</font><hr />
So down and away simultaneously is
the key? Worth a try ... I will watch for that in the future. I\'m so glad we have females here
<hr
/></blockquote><font class=\"post\">
Also works when urinating.
/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif
DrSmellThis
11-11-2003, 06:33 PM
</font><blockquote><font class=\"small\">Quote:</font><hr />
There are, of course, guys like the
late TV actor, Hugh O\'Brian. He used to walk up to women and say, \"I\'m Hugh O\'Brian, wanna f**K?\" He
might get rejected 50 time, he used to say, But, he\'d ask 51 times. So, he always got laid. <g>
<hr
/></blockquote><font class=\"post\">
I used to do that, but it never worked. Eventually they all found out my
name isn\'t Hugh O\'Brian.
Sacogoo
11-11-2003, 08:03 PM
Sexy writes:
</font><blockquote><font class=\"small\">Quote:</font><hr />
I don\'t mean to
offend any of the guys posting, but...you know, I see you guys saying all this, and then I think back to all the
posts where I see guys complain about fat or ugly women hitting on them, and wanting to know how they can get them
to stop.
<hr /></blockquote><font class=\"post\">
Not this guy. Crap, I\'ll take any attention that I
can get. Yeah, I might be a borderline egomaniac (and as I get older I know that compliments are going to be harder
to find regardless if they come from hotties or fatties), but letting fat ugly chicks hit on me once got me a good
friend that resulted in a couple years in a luxury box at the KC Chiefs games and horse riding whenever I wanted to
saddle up.
(By the way, fat and ugly is all in the eyes of the beholder. I mean, Kari said Brad Pitt wasn\'t
sexy. I mean, really. Brad Pitt not sexy? Have you seen that guys bod? That\'s a 40 year old bod BTW. Sexy as
hell. I\'d consider having sex with him he\'s so sexy (although I\'d have the ground rule that I would not be
the recipient, if you know what I mean. A hot chick with a strap on is one thing, a guy is completely different.
(Speaking from a hetero point of view.) Some people might prefer plump to a rock hard sexy, supple, volumptuous,
passionate, exotic, flexible body.)
Bernard
11-12-2003, 12:12 AM
</font><blockquote><font class=\"small\">Quote:</font><hr />
Also, there\'s such a thing as
ugly-sexy. Bogart, Tommy Lee Jones, Tom Berenger. Then there are guys like Tom Sellick and Brad Pitt who are
classically attractive, but don\'t have much sex appeal. In guys, looks don\'t often have a lot to do with sex
appeal. It\'s presence that matters.
--------------------
\"Sex appeal is 50% what you have and 50% what
people think you have.\"-- Sophia Loren
Post Extras:
<hr /></blockquote><font class=\"post\">
</font><blockquote><font class=\"small\">Quote:</font><hr />
and, if she looks, then looks away.. then looks
BACK when she thinks you won\'t notice... you have her attention.
<hr /></blockquote><font class=\"post\">
</font><blockquote><font class=\"small\">Quote:</font><hr />
the way, fat and ugly is all in the eyes of
the beholder. I mean, Kari said Brad Pitt wasn\'t sexy. I mean, really. Brad Pitt not sexy? Have you seen that
guys bod? That\'s a 40 year old bod BTW. Sexy as hell. I\'d consider having sex with him he\'s so sexy
(although I\'d have the ground rule that I would not be the recipient, if you know what I mean. A hot chick with a
strap on is one thing, a guy is completely different. (Speaking from a hetero point of view.) Some people might
prefer plump to a rock hard sexy, supple, volumptuous, passionate, exotic, flexible body.)
<hr
/></blockquote><font class=\"post\">
that\'s why i say thta u must at least have that x factor because u
can catch someone eye. if u are not attractive in away or another physically, u would unlikely hold her eye
contact! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/crazy.gif
</font><blockquote><font class=\"small\">Quote:</font><hr />
Yeah, and women complain about ugly,
uninteresting guys or jerks hitting on them all of the time when all they really want is a \'nice guy\'... Go
figure.
I still say we need a definite system to get the go-ahead to flirt with someone. Something like the
\'hotornot\' system where you both click \'yes\' if you\'re interested and then attempt conversation. If
I were a TV network, I\'d start a show where they made definite verbal signals on whether a guy/girl was
interested. For instance, if you were interested, you\'d say \"Hi,\" but if you weren\'t you\'d say,
\"Hey, there.\" That way you could let someone know where you stand without saying anything out of the ordinary.
This, of course, would never work, but it\'s nice to dream. This goes along the lines of my \'ring\' idea
where if you\'re married you have the ring on the left ring finger, if you have a bf or are interested in someone
you put a ring on your right ring finger, and if you want some action you have no rings. That way no one looking
for action will bother flirting with you if you have the ring. Great system, absolutely no relation to what\'s
really possible and no capability of instituting it globally. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/tongue.gif A
man can dream, dammit!!! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif
/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif
<hr /></blockquote><font class=\"post\">
Speaking of
signals... there\'s a course for women called the \"Art of Exotic Dancing\"-- taught by an ex-stripper. One of
the primary lessons is how to enter a room, and use eye contact to create a presence. The class is on vid, and also
tours the country. Being an ex-dancer, I fond it to be of value.
AzMike
11-12-2003, 11:45 PM
</font><blockquote><font class=\"small\">Quote:</font><hr />
Sexy writes:
</font><blockquote><font
class=\"small\">Quote:</font><hr />
I don\'t mean to offend any of the guys posting, but...you know, I see you
guys saying all this, and then I think back to all the posts where I see guys complain about fat or ugly women
hitting on them, and wanting to know how they can get them to stop.
<hr /></blockquote><font class=\"post\">
Not this guy. Crap, I\'ll take any attention that I can get. Yeah, I might be a borderline egomaniac (and as
I get older I know that compliments are going to be harder to find regardless if they come from hotties or fatties),
but letting fat ugly chicks hit on me once got me a good friend that resulted in a couple years in a luxury box at
the KC Chiefs games and horse riding whenever I wanted to saddle up.
<hr /></blockquote><font
class=\"post\">
I agree with Sacogoo\'s attitude. I haven\'t had a fat or ugly woman hitting on me with
mones on yet. I see the potential for this to be a problem; but, you can always control how far an interaction goes
with anybody. You could end up with unexpected perks (like a luxury box). If someone hits on you that you don\'t
find attractive at all, you can be polite, but don\'t have to go home with them, or even spend much time with
them. If it were me, I would just record it as a hit, and move on to another person.
Now listening to: \"Kid
Charlemaign\" by Steely Dan. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif
AzMike
AzMike
11-12-2003, 11:58 PM
</font><blockquote><font class=\"small\">Quote:</font><hr />
All guys are interested, especially if
the woman is even remotely attractive. Married guys. Single guys. Partially dead guys. We\'re just stupid, and
don\'t want to offend you, or are scared of rejection or whatever. We\'re still interested. Hell, every time I
walk out the door I\'m saddened that I don\'t get hit on, and then wonder why every woman is so unaccessible.
Frigid bunch of uptight bitches! Why can\'t I get laid? C\'MON! And then we just can\'t believe that the
girl we had our eyes on all night ends up going home with some heavy browed neanderthal. I can\'t believe that
she went home with that ape when I could have loved her forever with all my heart. (Sure, we were too chicken to
even go up to her or look at her all night, but goddamn if we weren\'t interested. Not interested?! I\'d have
given my left nut to have been with her tonight!)
<hr /></blockquote><font class=\"post\">
The majority of
women prefer a heavy browed neanderthal to an intelligent guy. Brawn usually wins out over brains, when women judge
guys. If you are built like a big ape, you will be quite popular with women, pheromones or no pheromones.
Now
listening to: \"Eagles Fly\" by Sammy Hagar.
AzMike
Icarus
11-13-2003, 01:45 AM
</font><blockquote><font class=\"small\">Quote:</font><hr />
If you are built like a big ape
<hr /></blockquote><font class=\"post\">
Do you mean in good shape, or just big?
On my years upon this
planet, I have witnessed those who looked most simian in nature be confident yet ultimatly thwarted in the dating
arena. Perhaps they don\'t look evolved enough.
It\'s the perma-banana hanging out the mouth that does it.
Watcher
11-13-2003, 01:52 AM
Pheromones are usefull but by working out you need a broadbased look ie legs, arms, cardio, areboic,
strength training. Remember some women prefer the skinny but fit look, others like fat guys, others like the upper
body worked look, others prefer a flat stomach but the rest of the body can be flabby. One look wont attract all
women but being fit is usefull but so is being smart, being funny and having $$$$$.
Younger women go for the
sweet talker or mature well built look but as they go past 25 they look for providers and stable types. (good
looking ones anyway as they start nesting if they havent got kids already)
</font><blockquote><font class=\"small\">Quote:</font><hr />
Pheromones are usefull but by working
out you need a broadbased look ie legs, arms, cardio, areboic, strength training. Remember some women prefer the
skinny but fit look, others like fat guys, others like the upper body worked look, others prefer a flat stomach but
the rest of the body can be flabby. One look wont attract all women but being fit is usefull but so is being smart,
being funny and having $$$$$.
Younger women go for the sweet talker or mature well built look but as they go past
25 they look for providers and stable types. (good looking ones anyway as they start nesting if they havent got kids
already)
<hr /></blockquote><font class=\"post\">
I dunno. I like fit guys, visually (not necessarily
\"big\"). But, I end up WANTING sensitive, intelligent types. I think it\'s dangerous to generalize, because
people have such varied tastes.
BTW-- One of the most successful men I know, with women, is 6\'2\" and 300
pounds. He\'s VERY suave, intelligent, glib, and sensitive. A MAJOR charmer, but not a superficial one. Women
FLOCK to him. They like to be around him because he\'s such a great companion. He inspires warm feelings of
confidence, which then becomes sexual interest.
I will LOOK at a guy with a gorgeous bod, with superficial
interest. But, if he turns out to be a dork, when he opens his mouth, it really kills the good visual impression. He
may be eye candy, but I won\'t take him home.
AzMike
11-14-2003, 10:52 AM
</font><blockquote><font class=\"small\">Quote:</font><hr />
</font><blockquote><font
class=\"small\">Quote:</font><hr />
If you are built like a big ape
<hr /></blockquote><font
class=\"post\">
Do you mean in good shape, or just big?
On my years upon this planet, I have witnessed
those who looked most simian in nature be confident yet ultimatly thwarted in the dating arena. Perhaps they
don\'t look evolved enough.
It\'s the perma-banana hanging out the mouth that does it.
<hr
/></blockquote><font class=\"post\">
I think women most prefer a guy who is big and muscular. However, I think a
fair number like guys who are just plain big, regardless of whether that\'s fat or muscle. There\'s exceptions
to every rule, but I think the majority of ladies prefer a \"big\" guy (big overall).
Judging by the abundance
of emails I get for VPRX pills, there\'s quite a perception that women like big guys (big in a particular area).
/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smirk.gif
Yes, there are 300 pound guys who are quite popular with women,
but hardly any 150 pound guys. I\'d like to see Kari or somebody else talk about such a guy. Some thin guys are
moderately successful with women, but its very rare that they are regarded as real \"hotties\". To have women
really flock to you, you have to be at least 175 pounds.
I do believe personality and charm has a lot to do with
it, and you can do well with women if you put enough effort into that. However, the bigger guys do have an edge
over thin guys, particularly in initial encounters. In particular, I think the big guys have a lot more women
taking the initiative with them, approaching them and striking up a conversation, offering phone numbers without
even being asked, etc. For us thin guys, this is very rare. We can sometimes have pretty good results with women,
but WE have to take the initiative almost 100 percent of the time.
AzMike
Holmes
11-14-2003, 11:10 AM
Good post, Mike.
</font><blockquote><font class=\"small\">Quote:</font><hr />
BTW-- One of the most
successful men I know, with women, is 6\'2\" and 300 pounds. He\'s VERY suave, intelligent, glib, and
sensitive. A MAJOR charmer, but not a superficial one. Women FLOCK to him. They like to be around him because
he\'s such a great companion. He inspires warm feelings of confidence...
<hr /></blockquote><font
class=\"post\">
...because they know he could pummel the sh!t out of anyone for them at a moment\'s notice.
Holmes
Sacogoo
11-14-2003, 11:30 AM
Holmes writes:
</font><blockquote><font class=\"small\">Quote:</font><hr />
...because they know
he could pummel the sh!t out of anyone for them at a moment\'s notice.
<hr /></blockquote><font
class=\"post\">
I\'d kick his ass.
Preference is jsut that, preference. Most men prfer certain physical charteristics, but find others hot. I mean,
I get turned on by flat chest boobs. I don\'t mind a thicker boy type. Sure I have a preference, but it is not a
rule of thumb.
Lok at all the rock stars. Do women think twice about mick jagger beiing thin? No.
And even
if you have to take the initiative, that is part of the joy of being a man. the perogative to have a little fun
/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif
Holmes
11-14-2003, 12:13 PM
bjf,
I agree. However,
</font><blockquote><font class=\"small\">Quote:</font><hr />
Lok at all the rock
stars. Do women think twice about mick jagger beiing thin? No.
<hr /></blockquote><font
class=\"post\">
That\'s because he\'s a rock star.
Which is to say that what you\'re involved in
doing with your life (and therefore how much power, charisma, and influence you have) can be as important a
determining factor as your physical stature. i.e., who would really find Woody Allen to be as \"sexy\" on his own?
In the case of old Mick, though...something tells me that he was born believing that he was The Man and that it
wouldn\'t have taken fronting the biggest rock \'n\' roll band on Earth to convince him. (Which, of course,
resurrects issues related to another proven attractant: confidence...)
/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif
Holmes
Yep. I agree. He\'s a rock star. I didn\'t want to get into, well he\'s got that fame thing and wild rock
star, etc, but women will look at some guys who look like aliens (not all of course) as sexy. Why do you think so
many women describe sexy is \"an attitude, a state of mind\"
I never used to understand that at all.
I
am not saying there aren\'t disadvantages to being skinny, etc, but the bottom line is the world is your oyster.
I am skinny. The only times where I was and wasn\'t taking seriously was how I approached.
It is extremely
obvious whether a man is in woman\'s league based on all of this. They can just read how comfortable and
confident he is, and if that is there, they will assume this guy is on my level, and therefore take you seriously.
Holmes
11-14-2003, 12:49 PM
True enough.
And with regard to \"rock stars,\" remember that many had that \"aura\" around them long
before anyone gave a crap who they were. (Which supports your point.) I\'m reminded of that Madonna story
someone related wherein they saw her on the street in an ordinary white T-shirt and jeans way before anyone knew of
her, but there was just something about her (that aura of confidence?) that would make anyone want to wear a white
T-Shirt and jeans just to be like her...
Anyway...good thoughts bjf--and encouraging for those of us who
aren\'t Suge Knight-ian in stature and proportions.
Holmes
holmes....great minds think a like!! I was going to point out in my previous thread, do you think it is any
coincidience that mick jagger became a rock star? Same with bill clinton as president, and madonna, and so on.
They have it inside of them. We all don\'t have those personas, but I figure us men have it pretty good
considering we are far more likely to be judged for what we have on the inside than women are. They can get a
pretty raw deal sometimes.
AzMike
11-16-2003, 04:06 PM
Returning this thread to the original reason for my post, I am trying to determine one or two additional products
to buy in the future. Some have posted that NPA has worked well; BUT I see that it is also made by LaCroy Chemical.
So, do people here think that it has the same secret ingredients as TE? Is it basically a more concentrated
version of TE, that definitely needs cologne as a cover?
I still have considerable testing to do, and my bottle
of TE will last until probably next spring. I can\'t make any real firm conclusions on it yet. But, tentatively,
after about 15 tests, it has been essentially snake oil for those 15 tests, at light to moderate doses. It
hasn\'t generated any real hits yet, no significant reactions from any women. So, if NPA has a very similar
formulation as TE, I would probably want to avoid buying NPA.
In recent days, I have been careful to shower and
scrub the neck, chest, and wrists thoroughly, prior to re-application of TE, to try to prevent \"buildup\". I
will continue in this mode during the next week or two, and report any hits this may cause.
AzMike
Sacogoo
11-16-2003, 09:22 PM
AzMike,
What \'mones are you currently using? From my own personal experience, Alter-Ego has yet
to produce anything when I use it, but I\'ve had major reactions to other pheromone products. Maybe The Edge just
isn\'t copacetic with your body chemistry. There is a 30 day guarantee on the product. Perhaps you should think
about exchanging it for another pheromone product.
AzMike
11-17-2003, 11:45 AM
</font><blockquote><font class=\"small\">Quote:</font><hr />
Returning this thread to the original reason for my
post, I am trying to determine one or two additional products to buy in the future. Some have posted that NPA has
worked well; BUT I see that it is also made by LaCroy Chemical. So, do people here think that it has the same
secret ingredients as TE? Is it basically a more concentrated version of TE, that definitely needs cologne as a
cover?
<hr /></blockquote><font class=\"post\">
Well, I was looking at Who\'s Online, and just by chance,
someone else was looking at a thread called TE vs NPA,
at:
http://www.ser
ver2.love-scent.com/ubbthreads/showflat.php?Board=UBB5&Number=99758 (\"http://www.server2.love-scent.com/ubbthreads/showflat.php?Board=UBB5&Number=99758\")
which pretty much answers my question
above. Newbies should look at this thread.
AzMike
AzMike
11-17-2003, 11:53 AM
</font><blockquote><font class=\"small\">Quote:</font><hr />
AzMike,
What \'mones are you currently using?
From my own personal experience, Alter-Ego has yet to produce anything when I use it, but I\'ve had major
reactions to other pheromone products. Maybe The Edge just isn\'t copacetic with your body chemistry. There is a
30 day guarantee on the product. Perhaps you should think about exchanging it for another pheromone product.
<hr /></blockquote><font class=\"post\">
I have mostly used just TE during the past 2 weeks, with CK Truth,
DZP, or Dolce Gabbana as a cover. I did use some SOE back at the begining of November, about 1/4 gel pack each
time, and that didn\'t change anything. I\'ve also used PPA/m about 10 times back in October.
AzMike
Powered by vBulletin® Version 4.2.2 Copyright © 2024 vBulletin Solutions, Inc. All rights reserved.