REMOVE PHEROS - What importance does a well worked body play

[Watcher]

If one was to remove pheros from the equation, what does the importance of a very well worked out body and looking muscular but toned play in sexual attraction.
This is a hyperthetical question as well as a real life feedback.
Id like comments on those who do work out often using weights and supplements. Also comments on how women react to you other guys and also say before you worked out. Freqency of sexual events.
Also stories and comments from some of the females as well, on if they would sleep with a well built guy over mr skinny.

Also comments on anything else that comes to mind as well. Id like to have many people comment on this (this is just to try and either prove or disprove my point that good well bilut guys attract women without pheros and if you are using pheros how much the visual aspects comes into play)
Watcher.

[Watcher]

The link between muscular body types and phero response has been established as existing but does the visual also play a part as well. I myself work out but does it really make a difference i wonder.

[Watcher]

Bump wow usually these threads get a great response where is everyone.

[**DONOTDELETE**]

Well, I still workout very seriously though I don\'t compete in bodybuilding any longer. The only reason I competed at all was one of my ex- girlfriends wanted to see me compete, so I did. Though I did well, I really had or have no interest in that part of it as the \'sport\' of it to me is in the gym training.

Though I maybe built a good physique and strength over the years, I will be the first to say it doesn\'t mean shit to most women. They may like to look for second or so, but that\'s about it. Just take a look around and see how many out of shape guys are paired up with great women. I started training because I liked the look of muscularity, the feeling I got from being in good shape and needing added strength for the sports I played - not because I thought it would result in girlfriends. If I did I\'d say my training was a complete flop !

One past girlfriend of mine was into working out, so maybe a decent physique meant alittle more to her then most, but for most women I\'d bet it matters little. They might wish their boyfriend or husband didn\'t have the 40\" beer gut hanging all over the place but most wouldn\'t think of dumping him or turning a date down because of it.

[Watcher]

MMM thanks jim anyone else, any female responses as well would help. Everyone jump in here. But it does help to be fit ie improved performance etc.

[jose]

I agree with jim, I don\'t think it\'s that important to women. But there are also women that like a nice six pack on a guy. images/icons/tongue.gif
I keep myself shape with weights and bicycle riding. If a woman likes my body type it\'s just one check on a list of other things she\'s looking for. images/icons/laugh.gif images/icons/cool.gif

[**DONOTDELETE**]

Having been into bodybuilding for most of my young adult life as well, I can attest that it doesn\'t help in getting women. It has helped in attracting unwanted attention from gay guys though. =P.

Many guys believe that muscular bodies are important to girls because they project their own sexual desire of a good female body onto their belief in women\'s desire.

By the way, gay guys tend to stay very fit to attract other gay men. It\'s just like women\'s high motivation to stay fit to attract hetersexual men. No doubt, we\'re the superficial sex, whether gay or straight.

[Bruce]

Maybe I have pushed the working out thing too much, but at my age (52) a regular workout schedule (3-4 times/week) just keeps me looking fit. I am not likely to get huge at this point so I don\'t have any personal data on how that works. From observation I still tend to think you can get away with a lot more bulk than you would think if you go that extra mile towards being friendly, helpful, cheerful etc. And one more point in favor of muscles is that when I see a very frail guy with an amazingly beautiful woman (like Jim mentions) I often notice something a little neurotic about the relationship (ie: the woman is not willing to get out of the \"comfort zone\" she has with a guy who is eating out of her hand); not always, but you see it and there is often messing around on the side going on there too, so it is no always so cut and dried as: \"women like skinny guys\". I have been on both sides of the fence and kept my eyes open.

Jose,
Just from looking at your home page I get the feeling that you are the kind of guy that could really get some serious mileage out of a powerful phsysique. I don\'t know what you are like in real life, but you look like the kind of person who can really set folks at ease: big smile, affectionate etc.

IMO: Muscles are just a kind of power; same as intelligence, money, experience, skills, street smarts, connections etc etc. People (men and women) take a look (and smell) at you and uconsciously start sizing you up on those. BUT there is another rating you are going to get that is going to make a big big difference in how you score, whether its in romance or business. That rating is going to effectively put a plus or minus in front of your power rating. Depending on your social orientation the question might be:
\"Is this person...

good/evil
sane/insane
safe/dangerous
helpful/destructive

Maybe we could say there are 3 parts to your over all score.
1. the plus or minus at the front
2. a number \"1\" or \"0\" immediately following
3. a \"0\" for each of your strengths

#2 being whether you have your \"oars in the water\" (ie: have any effectiveness in your environment)

So if you come off as a \"decent\" person, have your gears engaged in the world and have a lot of skills, clout etc, you might get a:
+10000000
Or if you are an ass hole with lots of power and doing a lot of damage you might get a:
-1000000
Or you could be either a jerk or a nice guy with lots of unused \"potential\" and just get a lot of
000000000

So, what I am advocating is getting that \"+\" going at the front followed by a \"1\" in order to make the body building or college education or fat wallet do anything for you.

Bruce

[**DONOTDELETE**]

Watcher,

10 years ago I was in very muscular shape. Never had a problem getting very nice looking women. Big ripped bicepts and all that. Last year after a long-term breakup and almost 10 years older, I was fat/out of shape. I couldn\'t get a date for anything. Since last year I\'ve lost weight(about 35 pounds) and toned up again. The muscles are coming back and it\'s definitely helped the dating. I\'m in agreement with whoever started the minimalist stuff. I\'m down to one atomizer spray of 50%phero/50%cologne in the morning and no recharges during the day. I like the results. I like the way the phero/cologne ages during the day. But back to your question, undoubtedly being in shape and muscular helps...unless your wallet is real fat, in which case doesn\'t really seem to matter what you look like. I find gold digging a repulsive character trait in many women, but where I live it seems to be the norm. So to somewhat compete I am getting in very good shape.

[Whitehall]

My two cents,

I\'m about Bruce\'s age and I too workout two to four times a week. I\'ve put on some real muscle the last two years with weights and 4-androstenediol but now I consider workouts part of the higher maintenance schedule needed at my age - kinda like keeping a classic XK-E in tune. I\'m generally a classic pre-NBA white-guy basketball type - 6\'1\" 200 lb.

Two big advantages to being in shape. One is the extra energy and vitality you have. Second is \"walking like a man\" - shoulders back and square, head up, proud to face the world. Both show the world you\'re ready to deal with what comes along - women like that. Like Friday, a sweet young girl at work (early 20\'s) asked me to shake the candy machine to loosen her licorice rather than either of the other guys standing round at the time. (I know - \"Big Deal!\" but you had to be there.)

In my workout, I reached a point where I didn\'t want to get bigger - I stopped at Apollo or \"David\" by Michaelanglo - go beyond that and you risk scarring women,

[Watcher]

Ok but it helps getting access to some of the better lookers, heck i have no probs but it does help though to be fit and have a fair bulk of muscles im not talking professional body builder just very good looking in the psychique department.

[**DONOTDELETE**]

Funny that we have so many phero user, scientist, bodybuilder types on the forum!

[Watcher]

Yeah it is pretty funny but i was never a body builder type till i started using pheros got the self confidence up and just keep looking for more \"edges\" in the game of life.
Keep up the good work truth.

[a.k.a.]

No doubt women love to look at muscular men, but here’s what I’ve observed...

I work with a number of guys that work out with weights. The best IMO is a guy about my age (mid forties), I’d say 5’11”, that looks like a greek statue. Just the right amount of bulk to look strong and manly, perfect definition, perfect proportion... And to top it off he’s got classic roman features, piercing blue eyes and a head of thick, curly, salt & pepper hair. He’s nice, sociable, and reasonably intelligent. But he doesn’t get one tenth of the attention that I get (5’8”, slim build, cockeyed features, receding hairline and PHEROMONES).

Then there’s another guy (mid twenties, 6’, cockeyed features) who obviously lifts a lot of weights but doesn’t seem to have any art or discipline to his approach. He’s got a big chest, average back, big biceps, average forearms, slim waist, little definition, and it seems as if his entire lower body is underdeveloped. This guy gets a lot of attention, women flirt with him all the time, and he gives a great first impression (that he manages to blow with his immature, explosive personality).

I have a lot of respect for guys that have the discipline to go through a serious body building program, but my impression is that it doesn’t do much for an old guy’s sex appeal. As for the young guy... Is it his bulky biceps that women are drawn to? Or is it the natural pheromones that he’s producing?

There’s a fourth guy (mid twenties, 6’2”, average build, kind of funny looking, very intelligent) that comes off as the classic “bad boy”: sideburns, tattoos, stubbles on his face, sometimes bags under his eyes. He flirts incessantly and can sometimes be downright crude. His (unspoken, totally disrespectful) attitude with women is like, “Yeah, I know you want to be f#@*@d like a randy little slut. But what are you going to do for ME?”

Women talk about him as if they wouldn’t give him the time of day. But they always do, and much more: cooking for him, baby-sitting his dogs, covering for him when he’s late, and I’ve heard rumors of BJ’s on the job.

So, I’d say there are many good reasons for weight training: health, stress reduction, pride, attention, discipline, performance in other sports... But it just doesn’t seem that big a factor in sex.

PS One more thing about that old body builder. He looks great and is obviously quite strong. But one day I was in his office when he dropped a pen and it rolled under his desk. Instead of picking it up, he just looked at it with a pained expression on his face. I squatted down, reached under the desk and grabbed it for him.
“Thanks.” He said. “I’m not as limber as I used to be.”
“What a shame.” I thought. And, sure enough, a couple of weeks later his back went out as he was getting out of the car. He lost several days of work, had to go on medication, and if his physiotherapy doesn’t work out he may need surgery.

So what’s the point of having a great body if you can’t use it?

I’ve been practicing yoga for 30 years. I’ve been playing tennis since high school, touch football, rollerblade, bike, ski, recently learned how to snowboard, practice aikido (where I average at least 20 hard falls every day) and I’ve never been injured. Never.

A firm body may help old guys LOOK younger. But a limber body lets old guys ACT younger. And more.

Once a car back-ended me while I was riding my bike. My bike got trashed. I was badly scraped. But I still walked away: nothing broken, nothing sprained, nothing torn.

I suck at basketball. But during my late twenties I had a lot of friends that were into it, so I always ended up being the guy that got picked last. As time went on, several guys got injured, several got fat, and now all that’s left is a sort of geriatric league that I’m embarrassed to play in. Their size is no longer an advantage in blocking my shots, their stride is no longer an advantage in running down the court... It’s sad. I still suck against the young guys, but at least I have the freedom to play if I want to, and I don’t have to be afraid of taking a few spills.

On the tennis courts, I can still give guys half my age a run for their money.

Here in the states, Yoga is finally starting to gain the popularity it deserves. You don’t need a lot of equipment. It doesn’t take much time. It’s not repetitive. It leaves you feeling great. There are endless health benefits. Maybe it won’t get you any girls, but it will make your whole life (including your sex life) a lot more enjoyable.

[**DONOTDELETE**]

Wow, a.k.a.! Have you seen the movie, Unbreakable?! Maybe you are the chosen one. :-).

[a.k.a.]

Funny. But I actually got my inspiration from the old “Kung Fu” series. This guy would wander around the Old West living of herbs, meditating in the lotus position, and getting flashbacks. He’d act all gentle and spaced out, but he’d inevitably kick about ten people’s butts per show.

Then there’d be little snippets of Eastern Wisdom like, “The Willow weathers the storm by bending its branches, whereas the Great Oak comes crashing down.” (Or something like that.)

[Nutt]

just in case wather dosent see, and \'cause I think He\'ll like the place, you may want to check out http://forum.bodybuilding.com (\"http://forum.bodybuilding.com\") for lots of reviews, advice etc: on weight training supplements. I dont thin the actual store is that good though.

[**DONOTDELETE**]

So pheromones might be far more effective than a super body.

At least that is my conclusion from this thread. images/icons/laugh.gif

[Watcher]

We on the other hand of the best of everything because we generate the best information including pheros that further assist us in going up higher as alpha males etc.

Remember if you are dumb - use NLP and other accelerated learning techniques like speed reading mega memory and mind mapping.

Body building or at least weight training and cardiovascular/yoga etc for fitness.

NLP for conversation and reading of body language lingustics etc.

Pheros for being mr sex turn on.

Anything else anyone wants to add - oh this forum for all the best information.

[camusflage]

Sure, I\'ll throw one out, but this one is actually useful.. MBTI, or Myers Briggs Type Indicators. There are sixteen Jungian personality types, each with subtly different traits. Introverted/extraverted, or where you get your energy from. Sensing/intuitive, the type of information you pay attention to. Thinking/feeling, how you make decisions. Judging/perceiving, or how you live your life. Knowing them, how to pick up on them, and most importantly, how to reach out to each of them, is something that\'s terribly useful. _The_Art_of_Speedreading_People_ is a decent intro to MBTI, but is most useful in its explanation of how to apply it.

[Watcher]

I actually meant speedreading as in speedreading written material especially useful for reading through all the posts on this forum for one. But you are right about the other type of personality speedreading it is all even better in its application in reallife sitautions.

*Note do not listen to any of this advice working out is dangerous to youre health and is of absolutley no use in pulling women as is the application and uses of pheromones (ignore all information on this forum we all bullshit through our noses just to get you to buy our products.

- Now we will see if anyone takes the above seriuosly. images/icons/laugh.gif images/icons/laugh.gif images/icons/laugh.gif images/icons/laugh.gif