View Full Version : Healthcare debate
belgareth
09-01-2009, 01:07 PM
Are you ready
for Canadian style Healthcare?
Nationalized healthcare has scared me from the begining. We hear a lot of
hyperbole about it and often Canada is pointed to as good healthcare. This video is an eye
opener.
http://www.youtube.com
/watch?v=q2jijuj1y… (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q2jijuj1ysw&NR=1&feature=fvwp)
Are you ready for this in the US?
Mtnjim
09-01-2009, 01:55 PM
People seem to think there is only
the Canadian health care model. There are actually four different models and we have every one of them in this
country. There is the Canadian model, there is the British model, there is the Bismark model (used in Germany,
France and several other European countries and Japan), and the cash model, mostly found in 3rd world countries and
the US.
Every one of those models are found in use in this country. Are you a Native American or military
retiree? You've got the British model. Are you over 65? You've got the Canadian model. When the government was
setting up Medicare, not only did they use the model, they even used the same name!
Does your company provide you
with health insurance? In that case you fall under the Bismark model. Finally, do you have to pay cash for your
care? In that case you fall into the cash model found mostly in 3rd world countries. The only problem is most
Americans can't pay for their care with a chicken like the 3rd worlders can. And if you have a great health
insurance plan, plan on joining these poor souls if you lose your job unless you are independently wealthy and can
afford the COBRA payments.
Another thing most people don't realize is that the first health insurance companies
were founded as non profit agencies, just like the Bismark model uses today. That's right, Blue Cross/Blue
Shield were originally not for profit!
And, I love the arguments. "We have the best medical care in the
world". Sorry, we're number 37, a bit behind Columbia and just ahead of Cuba. Then there is the argument "I don't
want some bureaucrat rationing my care". Sorry, got health insurance? If so, you've already got a corporate
bureaucrat rationing your care making sure your care doesn't cut into profits.
One other thing that should be
noted is that health care is written into the Constitution of the United States. Just recite the preamble,
I'm sure you'll find it in there.:think:
belgareth
09-01-2009, 05:34 PM
Jim,
There are a number of
points I could argue but the most glaring is the number 37. That is based on invalid data because every country
reports differently so there is no real yardstick to measure by. For example, life expectancy is determined much
more by lifestyle than healthcare. In this country we are lazy and have really poor diets. You've commented on that
yourself. Government managed healthcare isn't going to change that fact. Another example is that infant mortality
is determined in some countries based only on those that start as live, viable births where others are based on
known conceptions. Very hard to compare it that way. Third is that the vast majority of medical advances come out of
the US healthcare system. Obviously we must be doing something better than most other countries but that isn' taken
into account in those stats. Lastly is the fact that every country in the world sends their medical students here
for training. Why is that? So they can get poor training? That doesn't seem very reasonable, does it?
There is
a lot more to this debate than the questionable figures being quoted. However, my primary argument is that I do not
believe in or have any faith in our government or its ability to do anything right. They have proven themselves
incompetent every time. Prices will rise, benefits and quality will fall. The pattern is firmly established and
anybody who believes anything differently is kidding themselves. Ask yourself this, if the government has so much
knowledge about managing healthcare, why have they done nothing about teh skyrocketing prices in the past? Surely, a
little regulation would have made a huge difference ages ago. The government not only has passively sat by and
allowed this to happen, you could argue that the governments regulations are a major contributing factor in the
crises in the first place. Again, I see a pattern here, think of the dotcom bubble, which was allowed to occur
unchecked. Millions were badly hurt by that.
Also, please note that most of the government sponsored healthcare
systems in the world are either bankrupt or on the brink. Those are all great examples to follow.
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