View Full Version : Women Can Smell a Man's Intentions
belgareth
03-13-2009, 03:50 AM
Women Can Smell a Man's Intentions
By Melinda
Wenner (melinda.wenner@gmail.com), Special to LiveScience
posted: 09 January 2009 10:20 am ET
The twinkle in his eye,
his swagger, that sexy smile — all are clear signs he's
in the mood (http://www.livescience.com/strangenews/080610-bikini-effect.html).
And, at least subconsciously, a woman can also tell by the scent of his sweat, according to new research.
Scientists have long debated whether humans, like animals, use
chemical signals called
pheromones (http://www.livescience.com/health/041104_sex_and_smell.html) to
communicate sexual
interest (http://www.livescience.com/humanbiology/060118_armpit_odor.html) to potential mates. Problem is, the effects of pheromones are thought to be subconscious
— meaning that if we do communicate using them, we sure don't know it. It's also hard to know what these
pheromones might be and how we sense them, so researchers understand little about them.
But if human pheromones
are going to be anywhere, they're going to be in sweat, right? Denise Chen, a psychologist at Rice University in
Houston, and her colleagues devised an experiment to compare how women respond to different forms of
male sweat (http://www.livescience.com/health/060621_sweaty_cities.html) —
sweat produced in everyday situations versus that produced when a man is turned on.
The researchers speculated
that if humans do produce and respond to sweat pheromones, then a woman should respond to a guy's sexual sweat
differently than she does to his normal sweat.
Chen and her colleagues asked 20 heterosexual guys to stop wearing
deodorant and scented products for a few days. Then they told the men to put small pads in their armpits as they
watched pornographic videos and became aroused (the researchers confirmed, using electrodes, that the images did the
job). Later, the guys were asked to exchange those pads for fresh pads to collect the sweat they produced when they
weren't aroused.
Then the researchers recruited 19 brave women to smell the men's pads while undergoing brain
scans.
The investigators used functional magnetic resonance imaging (fMRI), a technique that reveals the brain
regions a person is using at any given time — even if their brain activity is subconscious.
Sure enough, the
women's brains responded very differently depending on which sweat they sniffed. (And no, none of them passed out.)
The sexual sweat, but not the normal sweat, activated the right orbitofrontal cortex and the right fusiform cortex,
brain areas that help us recognize emotions and perceive things, respectively. Both regions are in the right
hemisphere, which is generally involved in smell, social response, and emotion.
The findings bolster the idea that
humans do communicate via
subconscious chemical
signals (http://www.livescience.com/humanbiology/060118_armpit_odor.html), notes Chen in her study, which was published in the Dec. 31 issue of the Journal of
Neuroscience.
Our sexual intentions, in other words, may be a lot clearer than we ever intended them to be.
That crush you have on your co-worker? She may already know — at least subconsciously.
chicago
03-14-2009, 01:19 AM
Dr. insect Chen has no clue
whats going on in the real world. Anything will cause activity in the brain. People like her are to busy labeling
things. They have no clue whats going on in the real world.
Just like the pick-up artist scams. Billion dollar
industry scam. Few guys i know spend thousands of dollars learning cocky and funny routines and attended seminar's.
They wasted their money. :frustrate
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belgareth
03-14-2009, 05:43 AM
That's a rather narrow
interpretation of peer reviewed scientific research. Comparing it to the tripe in the PUA community is much like
comparing a paper airplane to a supersonic jet, there is no real comparison. Are you aware that different portions
of the brain light up for different reasons? It has become specific enough that computers reading brain scans can
come very close to determining a person's thoughts and memories?
You do, of course, have the right to view
research in any fashion you like but such a statement seems pretty ignorant. I will agree with yo about PUA seminars
though.
chicago
03-14-2009, 10:58 AM
Tonite I'm going out to a nite
club. I'm taking my laptop with me. I'm gonna walk up to girls and connect to the laptop to their brains and check
out brain activity.:rofl:
________
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belgareth
03-14-2009, 11:19 AM
I'm just wondering where you
are going to get the scanning and imagery equipment. Kinda large and cumbersom to carry in your pocket.
chicago
03-14-2009, 01:21 PM
:type: Thats it. Hot chicks for
everyone. Dr.chen figured it out.
________
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Live (http://www.girlcamfriend.com/webcam/latin-girls/)
idesign
03-14-2009, 01:43 PM
Dr. insect
Chen has no clue whats going on in the real world. Anything will cause activity in the brain. People like her are to
busy labeling things. They have no clue whats going on in the real world.
Just like the pick-up artist scams.
Billion dollar industry scam. Few guys i know spend thousands of dollars learning cocky and funny routines and
attended seminar's. They wasted their money. :frustrate
Its just this kind of research that has produced
synthetic pheromones to begin with, allowing you to have your "real world" fun. Don't bite the hand that feeds
you. :)
DrSmellThis
03-14-2009, 02:01 PM
Dr.
insect Chen has no clue whats going on in the real world. Anything will cause activity in the brain. People like her
are to busy labeling things. They have no clue whats going on in the real world. :frustrateI'm getting
deja vu. Didn't I just correct somebody on this exact same flaw in reasoning? The point is not that there is
brain activity, the point is that there were very specific kinds of brain activity, in specific, well known areas of
the brain.
If you are saying there is some problem somewhere with the interpretation of the results, I might
agree with you. It was probably the journalist rather than, Dr. Chen, who concluded from that, that "a woman can
smell a man's intentions". You can't quite make that scientific leap, from the little I read that Bel posted.
But what you can tell seems very substantive still. That is, a woman smelling your spent sexual hormones from
watching porn will likely become somewhat more perceptive or attentive toward your emotions as well. C'mon,
Chicago. With anything scientific you have to think through it carefully, not just proclaim it gospel or total
crap. :welcome:
chicago
03-14-2009, 02:21 PM
:type: Dr.smell, what do you
think is pure attraction,???
Why some guys with or with out pheromones can get chicks. ???
Dr. smell sometimes
you have to loose you self to find your self. think about
that:welcome:
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belgareth
03-14-2009, 04:30 PM
Do you mean "Without added
artificial pheromones"? And have you considered the training we all have had all our lives in how to respond to
certain types that normally have a given signature? It isn't nearly so simple as you'd like to believe.
idesign
03-14-2009, 04:38 PM
Why some
guys with or with out pheromones can get chicks. ???
It seems to me that's exactly what Dr. Chen is
trying to figure out with her research, to our benefit. :cheers:
As an aside, "Dr. smell" seems rather
derogatory and disrespectful. A simple DST or Doc will suffice if you don't want to spell out DrSmellThis. Sorry
for being an etiquette cop. :rant: Its part of my "signature". :)
Tonite I'm
going out to a nite club. I'm taking my laptop with me. I'm gonna walk up to girls and connect to the laptop to
their brains and check out brain activity.:rofl:
I'm just wondering where you
are going to get the scanning and imagery equipment. Kinda large and cumbersom to carry in your pocket.
"Is that a computer and imaging/scannig equipment in your pocket or are you just happy to see me?"
Hey, maybe
it would make a fine PUA "prop/gimmick." As long as you don't trip over the cables...
\o/
Nick666
03-16-2009, 12:14 AM
Men can smell a woman's
intentions... ? :think:
belgareth
03-16-2009, 05:05 AM
Men can
smell a woman's intentions... ? :think:
I wouldn't be surprised. We are still animals despite our vrey
thin layer of 'Civilization'
kgk4569
03-16-2009, 09:01 AM
Well Chicago Lets do it this
way:
1. The brain is made up of "lobes"
2. impulses cause lobes to have electrical and chemical activity.
3.
this activity can be monitored, and recorded with various instruments.
4. through trial and error scientists have
documeted the function of many different parts of the brain, and identify them as "lobes".
So what Dr. Chen is
doing is basicly studying if the different sweats cause the lobes to change from their "normal" state, what lobes
these are, and what reaction is caused by these changes.
her research seems sound.
as for your assertation
that some guys can get women without "mones". That is a lie. you are always producing pheromones, unless you have
some genetic anomaly. We, in applying these products, highlight certain pheromones, bringing them to the forefront.
This is much like make up and clothes highlight certain physical characteristics.
There are alot of other
things that go into attraction. And in no way id Dr. Chen claiming that pheromones aer the end all be all of
attraction.
chicago
03-16-2009, 10:42 AM
:type: kgk4569 : you are
absolutely right.
________
Lovely Wendie99 (http://www.lovelywendie99.com/)
DrSmellThis
03-16-2009, 01:08 PM
It seems
to me that's exactly what Dr. Chen is trying to figure out with her research, to our benefit. :cheers:
As an
aside, "Dr. smell" seems rather derogatory and disrespectful. A simple DST or Doc will suffice if you don't want
to spell out DrSmellThis. Sorry for being an etiquette cop. :rant: Its part of my "signature". :)I
didn't read any disrespect from the youngster, but etiquette is almost always wise. :cheers:
idesign
03-16-2009, 04:32 PM
Yeah Doc, and you're quite
capable of taking care of yourself, I just bristle sometimes at certain manners of address.
No offense meant to
chicago.
Beers on the house! oops, sorry Bruce... beers on me!
DrSmellThis
03-16-2009, 06:36 PM
I really do appreciate your
efforts to maintain certain standards for discussion.
I can talk trash as well as the next guy, but talking trash
is something you do just for fun when it is prudent and safe to do so.
Man I would love to cut loose sometimes
and fling some monkey poop. But then I'd be in deep doo doo with idesign! It is far better for us to control
ourselves and discipline ourselves to discuss by the rules. :)
Thank you for helping to moderate the forum in
that way.
chicago
03-16-2009, 08:42 PM
:type: Dr.SmellThis:hammer:
Dr.SmellThis
________
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idesign
03-16-2009, 10:56 PM
Well Doc, don't be so quick to
thank me, I just flung some poop on another thread, but it was in Open Discussion, and it wasn't real poop, just
political discussion poop, which doesn't count. :)
chicago, how do you come up with these great graphics?
Pretty cool stuff! Hey! are you a blonde curly headed girl in real life? No wonder you're so popular! Cute dress
btw... and funny post
:rofl:
kgk4569
03-17-2009, 05:03 AM
yeah a good poop flinging is
sometimes what is needed.
the other day on this tech forum that I hang out on one of the regular members has
been a bit trollish lately. He made a stupid comment about how MS only puts out new OSs to take money from people. I
totally pwned him, it was fun. he even admitted that he was royally pwned.
belgareth
03-17-2009, 08:58 AM
Speaking of moderation, can we
take this back to the topic?
tim929
04-11-2009, 08:22 PM
Topic? you want to be on topic?
There goes the neighborhood.....
There have been a number of experiments of this type conducted using everything
from printed oppinion forms filled out by the participants to MRIs and I wouldnt be supprised if somebody tried
doing disections befor and after the experiment. The one thing that has been fairly consistent is that men and women
realy do respond to the opposite sex differently under conditions involving sweat and arousal. The hard work isnt
figuring out that it works...the hard part has been figuring out how to enhance responses from the opposite sex to
our individual advantage.
Thats where we come in.......
belgareth
04-12-2009, 05:10 AM
Topic? you
want to be on topic? There goes the neighborhood.....
There have been a number of experiments of this type
conducted using everything from printed oppinion forms filled out by the participants to MRIs and I wouldnt be
supprised if somebody tried doing disections befor and after the experiment. The one thing that has been fairly
consistent is that men and women realy do respond to the opposite sex differently under conditions involving sweat
and arousal. The hard work isnt figuring out that it works...the hard part has been figuring out how to enhance
responses from the opposite sex to our individual advantage.
Thats where we come in.......
Ah...well!
You know how it is. Got to do something to justify my incredibly high salary.
Hey Tim! Long time. Good to see
you around.
It surprises me the number of people who still stand firm on the idea that heromones do not work. A
lot of people think the whole thing belongs in the same catagory as bigfoot and UFOs. I'm not complaining. It gives
us fruitcakes a leg up in society.
idesign
04-12-2009, 07:26 AM
High salary? Damn! I've got
to talk to Bruce...
I was never much interested in the "science of attraction" until I found these Mone thingys,
and find the science pretty interesting but not all that useful. I think behavior is too complex and unpredictable
from setting to setting to be able to nail down some kind of formula for success. Knowing that Stimulus A triggers
Response B in Location C in Brain D only tells us what we know from experience. Knowing how an internal combustion
engine works does not make me a better driver.
Pheromones definitely work, and will "jump-start" a situation, but
you're still left with what you can do afterwards to manage the response, as Tim said.
Dos centavos
Very
interesting research, to know the (why) and (How) in the brains ..
But do we want to really know ?
With
social science being advanced, if that type of brain activities research would produce the conclusive results, with
'guaranteed' implements, products, to trigger exact and guaranteed results ... it won't be days til it is all
'on the market', products for sale left and right ...
Then where would that take us ? - no initiative,
spontaneousity, excitement, experimentations, successes and failures.
Would humans then evolve and find other
methods of selections ?
Hope we get close, but not close enough to our detriment
jumprunner
04-15-2009, 08:23 PM
:type:
Dr.smell, what do you think is pure attraction,???
Why some guys with or with out pheromones can get chicks. ???
Dr. smell sometimes you have to loose you self to find your self. think about that:welcome:
Allright hold it!!!! I think we are getting a bit off track here.
People have just GOT to stop assuming that
phermones pick up chicks, and understand what a phermone is.
Mood altering, or behavior altering substances. Not
attractants or aphrodisiacs. You want to alter someone's mood, get them to be more talkative, so you can have an
easier time chatting her up and picking her up.
I think it is why so many people are skeptical about
phermones...everyone is way too into thinking they are there as attractants or aphrodisiacs when in reality, they
are just substances that alter mood, or better yet influence mood.
I have found in myself that cognitive
thinking can override any mood altering effects from a phermone, so wearing Androstenol and telling someone to 'get
fucked' is not going to get them in a good mood, wearing it and smiling, saying hi, starting up a conversation has
a high probablility of getting someone in a good mood. Unless something else is bugging them.
I have found that,
they can alter mood, but they dont get you the chicks. You still have to do that, phermones can just help
significantly at setting the mood.
jumprunner
04-15-2009, 08:29 PM
Well
Chicago Lets do it this way:
1. The brain is made up of "lobes"
2. impulses cause lobes to have electrical and
chemical activity.
3. this activity can be monitored, and recorded with various instruments.
4. through trial and
error scientists have documeted the function of many different parts of the brain, and identify them as "lobes".
So what Dr. Chen is doing is basicly studying if the different sweats cause the lobes to change from their
"normal" state, what lobes these are, and what reaction is caused by these changes.
her research seems sound.
as for your assertation that some guys can get women without "mones". That is a lie. you are always producing
pheromones, unless you have some genetic anomaly. We, in applying these products, highlight certain pheromones,
bringing them to the forefront. This is much like make up and clothes highlight certain physical characteristics.
There are alot of other things that go into attraction. And in no way id Dr. Chen claiming that pheromones aer the
end all be all of attraction.
I dont know about this, I think Chicago might be right in that yea,
guys can get chicks without phermones, but I wouldnt say 'some guys', I would say any guy who looks decent and
knows how to chat up a girl and say the right things can get the girl without phermones.
So that is persuation,
and phermones can magnify, or intensly magify that persuation, make you a lot more persuasive.
Can you keep up
the perfect line? Sure, but for how long? Like how many chicks do you have to go through before you finally pick one
up? It can get to be exhausting if you have to work too hard, I like making things easier on myself. That way you
can get more girls.
jumprunner
04-15-2009, 08:32 PM
High
salary? Damn! I've got to talk to Bruce...
I was never much interested in the "science of attraction" until I
found these Mone thingys, and find the science pretty interesting but not all that useful. I think behavior is too
complex and unpredictable from setting to setting to be able to nail down some kind of formula for success. Knowing
that Stimulus A triggers Response B in Location C in Brain D only tells us what we know from experience. Knowing how
an internal combustion engine works does not make me a better driver.
Pheromones definitely work, and will
"jump-start" a situation, but you're still left with what you can do afterwards to manage the response, as Tim
said.
Dos centavos
When it comes to sex, people are about as complicated as it can get. Youve got
fetishes, things that turn certain people on or off, its not like an animal...when one gets in the heat it has sex
with whatever happens to be available. Phermones can defineitly be used to control sexual behavior of an animal, but
people arent that simple and they always have the choice based on what thier preferences are.
kgk4569
04-16-2009, 05:11 AM
I dont
know about this, I think Chicago might be right in that yea, guys can get chicks without phermones, but I wouldnt
say 'some guys', I would say any guy who looks decent and knows how to chat up a girl and say the right things can
get the girl without phermones.
So that is persuation, and phermones can magnify, or intensly magify that
persuation, make you a lot more persuasive.
Can you keep up the perfect line? Sure, but for how long? Like how
many chicks do you have to go through before you finally pick one up? It can get to be exhausting if you have to
work too hard, I like making things easier on myself. That way you can get more girls. Without additional
mones yes. But your body is always producing pheromones, so it's virtually impossible to have no mones at all.
Actually as I understand it,
pheromones don't necessarily "alter" behavior, especially in us "higher forms" who also use concious thought. They
are just a form of chemical communication between organisms.
They might "influence" behavior, but the "altering"
part is up to the brain. And although pheromones may "communicate" with the more "primitive" parts of the brain (eg
brain stem as some call it), the end behavior still must be "filtered" through the semi-concious mid-brain and more
or less fully conscious upper-brain (if we also assume the "triune" brain theory).
Which of course, like has
been said, means it comes down to still having to *act* on or dig out and encourage whatever feelings may be being
evoked by the actions of the pheromones on the body/brain.
Just my thoughts fer what they is worth.
:think:
Irish
04-17-2009, 11:43 AM
This study adds to some previous
work, that demonstrated people can tell the difference between “normal” sweat and sweat produced under fearful
states. Dogs aren’t the only animals that can “smell” fear, people can too. Now this study says sweat produced under
arousal can also be distinguished, unconsciously anyway. This should be very interesting to anyone who pores over
this forum, because it lends credence to the idea that pheromones exist naturally in humans, and have true,
measurable effects. Pertaining to sex.
Various studies have shown brain and hormone effects from exposure to
sweat and other human pheromones. Some off the top of my head include: increased excitement and euphoria, increased
focus and attention, increased attractiveness (British studies), increased activity in the sexual areas of the
brain, effects that only occur in the opposite sex, effects that only register in the presence of the opposite sex,
switched results in homosexuals, nervous system activity changes, changes in hormone release and rates, changes to
women’s menstrual cycles, and on and on.
And I’m not talking about a few cranks out there writing in a blog,
These are peer reviewed scientists at major universities writing in respected scientific journals. The growing body
of work makes it clear that pheromones do exist in humans and affect our state of being and behavior – it’s clear to
anyone open minded who reads the studies (I was originally a skeptic, but was willing to be won over if I could find
solid evidence. And boy, did I ever!). The existence of human pheromones shouldn’t surprise anyone either, since the
non-human animal kingdom (and plants too!) operate heavily on pheromonal signals.
Really the remaining
questions aren’t about the existence of human pheromones. What remains to be understood is the specifics of the
messages we are transmitting. Science is working steadily to decode the messages and effects contained in human
pheromones. And some of us are out there doing our own non-scientific “research”, dosing up with extra pheromones
and watching for results!
missteekai
04-26-2009, 08:15 AM
So if a guy would not
naturally be attracted to you (that is without the artificial -Mones), exactly what influence would the -mones have
on him/how effectively could they change his opinion? -I know you cannot be 'exact' with this, that there are so
many other factors involved. :)
'Mones are applied because they
can lead to sexual interest. It is believed that they are detected by the VNO (Vomeronasal Organ) in the nose. This
is a separate thing from a sense of smell. There is a direct link to the brain of chemical messages I believe.
They work for some people on some occasions - how 'effective' also depends which 'mone product
applied, your body heat, skin exposure .... They are well worth experimenting with & for fun.
I used 1/2
'The Edge/men' gel pack (TE/m) on my neck & a girl sitting next to me ended her conversation with me by saying
'Is there anything else you would like ?'
I replied that I always like to look at the menu before I make my
selection :)
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