which one to use -nol or -none?

[proteus]

I have a question for experienced phero users. I\'m going to dinner next week with an old and very good friend from college who I had a really strong attraction for ever since I\'ve known her. She\'s gorgeous but nothing ever happened coz she always saw me as a \"friend\" and guess just never felt any sparks with me. Now I want to be clear that I don\'t necessarily want to start dating her as I\'m seeing someone I met recently, HOWEVER I do want to see if I can stir things up a little images/icons/laugh.gif when I see this friend as I haven\'t see her in awhile, and I figure if the pheros do work maybe it might make things a little interesting images/icons/smile.gif . My quandry is this: My Yes/PF combo works great for me and so does JB#1 - so if I wanted to generate some sparks from her side which one of these would be better to use?? She\'s 27 yrs.old so I\'m thinking JB#1 might be better, but then I have noticed that younger ladies seem a little more intimated when I wear JB#1, whereas there doesn\'t seem to be any distinction between the reaction from younger and older ladies when I wear Yes/PF. But on the flip side Yes/PF makes the ladies very chatty/open with me, but I sense a more sexual undertone to their responses when I wear JB#1. So I\'ve been going back and forth on which to wear and thought I\'d ask you phero pros about this. Any advice on this would be much appreciated.

[**DONOTDELETE**]

what if you wore both?

[Whitehall]

Since you\'ve already broken the ice with the lady - she knows you and feels relatively safe, you might as well send the sex message via the NPA in JB#1. I wouldn\'t OD since she\'s not a sure thing but you do want to move beyond \"friend\" and NPA will help get that point across. So, what\'s she going to do, not be a \"friend\"? One way or the other, that\'s seems to be your goal.

Nothing ventured, nothing gained.

[proteus]

Thanks for the suggestion - that might be a way to go about it but wouldn\'t this be too much stuff together? JB#1 has the NPA/APC and then with Yes and PF I\'m worried that combing 4 phero products would be a bit much. I might try your suggestion though tomorrow when I go out and see what this cocktail produces images/icons/laugh.gif

[proteus]

Whitehall what you said makes sense so I think you\'re right that JB#1 might be the way to go. I will try both JB#1 and Yes/PF combined tomorrow but not hopeful about that as I think all this stuff would be too much for anyones nose to take, but still it\'d be fun to experiment with so why not. But for now I think I will plan on going with JB#1. As far as your question about what I want her to do, I guess the best way to put it is I want her to get a sense of what I\'ve had to put up with for years with all her teasing etc. She\'s always been VERY flirtatious with me but whenever I even began to try to see if things could develop beyond just a friendship she would back off, say she didn\'t see me that way etc. So I figure maybe the pheros could turn the tables for me a little and generate some heat, but now it\'ll be my turn to say no lets just be friends images/icons/smile.gif

[a.k.a.]

proteus,
With situations like yours, I always trust my instincts. Trying to second-guess women\'s reactions tends to undermine my confidence.

[Whitehall]

Whoa!

A Revenge Flirtation? Bad Karma, Dude!

Or, \"Do two wrongs make a right?\"

Or, \"Do unto others as you would they do unto you.\"

Also, it\'s a sign of weakness and lack of confidence in yourself.

[proteus]

well, don\'t see how it\'s a sign of weakness or lack of confidence in any way, but as for the bad karma maybe there is some truth to that images/icons/smile.gif. I\'ve been friends with her for about 9 yrs now and as far as female friends go she is my best pal and she considers me her best guy friend (perhaps her only guy friend). I think it\'s more like a small lesson I think I want her to learn, not out of spite, more that she understands what it\'s been like sometimes for me knowing her as she has done some things which are about the ultimate tease anyone can do to someone else (and I say this with a smile, as I love her always regardless). I wish I could explain some of the things but I feel it wouldn\'t be cool, but perhaps you get my drift if you\'ve ever been in a situation where a girl has \"flirted\" with you to an extreme degree....so she\'d pull some stunts images/icons/laugh.gif and then when I say lets cuts this bs and just allow things to happen between us, with a twinkle in her eye and a smile she\'d be like \"no, lets just be friends\". Anyway, I actually doubt the pheros will make a difference but I still want to use them, and if they effect her positively maybe we can finally have a \"talk\" about a lot of this stuff images/icons/smile.gifWe will remain friends regardless as we have been through a lot together and there\'s nothing that would ever destroy our friendship as it\'s too strong, but I think if JB#1 does it\'s magic, maybe a little of the dynamic will be changed for the better.

[oscar]

proteus,

If you want to use pheros to help you f&(k her, that\'s okay.
If you want to use pheros to help you f$(k her OVER, that\'s NOT okay.
If you want to use pheros to help you f&(k her OVER and OVER, that\'s okay too.

Oscar images/icons/wink.gif

[**DONOTDELETE**]

prot,
go ahead dude! i know where ur coming from. an ex recently admitted 2 me that girls really play games sometimes. it makes them feel good 2 know that they can make a guy fall over their feet.

wilde oscar,
i notice ur pulling some funny antics on ur recent posts! it must have been a good \"hit\" day for you huh!? images/icons/laugh.gif

[**DONOTDELETE**]

I\'d be careful w/ the -none products, you don\'t want to get the intimidation effect her, so use them in moderation...if they don\'t work you should really try SOE, she\'ll be more friendly/flirtatious and open w/ you. talking will be an ease and who knows, the friendlier/flirtier behavior could spark something deeper than friendship, it may cause her to see you in a different light

[ January 28, 2002: Message edited by: deepblue ]

[jvkohl]

Great philosophical commentary Wilde Oscar. Best of all, no jargon. Wish I could eliminate the jargon from my posts, and be more succinct--but here goes.

I propose that 75% of a woman\'s tease is due to hormonal programming. Only when she\'s ovulating is she truly interested in sex for the sake of reproduction (biology). That means that for 3 weeks out of each month, she\'s programmed to tease--she can take it or leave it. But when she\'s ovulating she\'s not only inclined to take it, but also to pursue it. That\'s why we get mixed messages--a woman\'s menstrual cycle dictates her sexual behavior. All this confuses men because we don\'t have anything close to such cyclic hormone changes. Our tonically high testosterone levels keep us in pursuit at all times.

All this means that though you are in pursuit and add pheromones to increase your odds of success, true success is more likely to be achieved at around the same time she\'s ovulating, which just happens to be when her olfactory acuity and specificity (sense of smell) is most tuned in to pheromones.

What this means to \"proteus\" is that her response is liable to depend upon her menstrual cycle phase (and also whether she\'s on the pill). If she is ovulating, you\'ll be better off to go easy on the pheromones. If not, you can use a more potent boost.

How can you tell whether she\'s ovulating? Get her to discuss hormonal ups and downs, perhaps. Or maybe just watch for additional cues of added interest on her part--\"proceptive\" behaviors are what they are called--meaning she\'s looking to get laid.

All of us would do well to read books/articles by Tim Perper or Monica Moore on body language, since it corresponds well with menstrual cycle phase, and susceptibility to masculine pheromones.

[**DONOTDELETE**]

But if you want to go after someone who has teased and followed through in the past then go right ahead and chase pheromones at right dosage and go fuck em if they are interested and responseive or it could just be a revenge flirtation in which the aim is to get the interest and returned flirting but leave it at that etc etc.

[proteus]

Thanks for all the feedback y\'all and appreciate it. Well, I went to dinner with my friend yesterday and ended up deciding to phero bomb her with JB#1, Yes and PF. I won\'t go into many details as you never know, she might be a member of this board hey?? images/icons/smile.gif Anyway, we had a great time and man, was she flipping her hair like crazy, her legs constantly making contact with mine under the table, telling me how much I understand her etcetc. images/icons/laugh.gif So to sum up, the pheros definitely affected her , and she kept asking if we could get together again soon and I was like well, sure lets do this again sometime when we have time. Course she has flirted with me before, but this is the first time where she definitely seemed to not be in teasing mode - a difficult distinction to get across but there was definitely a difference in tone if you get my drift. Anyways, if anything further develops I may post about it.

[Whitehall]

Teasing is about power.

A young, fertile, genetically superior woman definitely has power - she\'s got something we guys want and she can give it or keep it or just make you jump. Teasing is a way of exercising that power and making it stronger. As women age that power declines.

A man\'s power varies but will often INCREASE with age and fortune. Exogenous pheromones are a way to increase or levelize those powers.

With power comes responsibility. A hot babe who abuses her power is just as irresponsible as a man who stimulates a woman\'s lust with pheromones with no intent of follow-through.

Do two wrongs make a right?

[ January 31, 2002: Message edited by: Whitehall ]

[proteus]

Well Whitehall, I\'m not going to get drawn into a metaphysical discussion over phero use. You have the right to express your opinion, but don\'t make the assumption that your moral judgements/assertions are the \"truth\" - your morality may or may not be mine, and while I understand the point your making from your perspective, it is your perspective and so be it. I did what I did, have no problems with it, and honestly could care less if anyone has a problem with it. I found what you had to say somewhat patronizing but then I have the right to my opinion as you do to yours. Anyway...

[**DONOTDELETE**]

nice one proteus! very well said! images/icons/wink.gif

[Whitehall]

Mr. Proteus,

You asked for guidance.

You got it but you didn\'t like it.

Then you bitched about getting guidance.

It fits.

[Whitehall]

Hey, we\'re not talking about committing one of the Seven Deadlies here, (obviously NOT Lust)...

but even Machiavelli recognized the moral principle that with power comes responsibility.

That is one universal verity - I don\'t see how moral relativism can negate it.

Neither can one dismiss the Golden Rule - \"Do unto others...\" Every moral system devised by mankind recognizes that one (except perhaps Nihilism.)

And, no, I\'m not some Bible-thumping, Christian right-wing type, far from it.

I\'ve just learned the hard way. Guess your turn is coming up.

[proteus]

Whitehall, if you read my initial post I asked for feedback as to which phero to use
-nol or -none. Nowhere in my post did I ask for moral judgements/lessons from you or anyone, but as I said I respect your right to say what have on your mind and so be it. I won\'t be saying more on this thread as I feel I\'ve said all I needed to and believe sometimes the less said the better. Peace!

[**DONOTDELETE**]

::sigh:: This thread is going nowhere now. Talk about something relevant. Like, my cat\'s breath smells like cat food.

Proteus, what are you going to do? Or, did the dinner already happen?

[Whitehall]

OK, I admit, I can be pompous and pedantic. But my advice was offered with YOUR long term best interests in heart. Enough said.