Can you seduce people with pheromones even against their will?

[dunbar]

Is this possible? That the pheromones have such a strong effect on people that you could

seduce them against their will? Wouldn't this almost be something like rape? When you manipulate a person this way?

Where is the difference between using pheromones and seducing a woman and putting drugs into her drink?
Or do

pheromones not work this way?

[live4themusic]

Sorry, are you asking if

we can rape people? If you have sex with someone against their will, that's rape.

Or are you asking if our

pheromone use can impair a person's judgement to the point where they should not be legally entitled to make

personal decisions regarding sex? If that's what you mean, then I haven't seen anyone affected that much by

pheromones, but that doesn't mean it can't happen.

[dunbar]

I am asking wether pheromones can

seduce a person to the point that she would have sex with you against her own will because this would basically be

rape. It would be the same as putting someone on drugs and then raping the person,imo.
Let's say your gf breaks up

with you and you put on the nones and seduce her knowing that she would never have had sex with you under normal

circumstances then this is basically rape or at least abuse. I just ask myself if this is possible.

[live4themusic]

Hold up, even if you give

someone drugs or alcohol, they can still willfully have sex with you (maybe it is easier to forcefully rape them

also, but that is not what I'm talking about) The ethical question that arises is whether they're decision to have

sex with you is based on judgement so impaired that they should not be considered to be capable of giving such

consent (much like a child would be considered)

Now it is true that pheromones appeal to the primitive, or

reptilian, brain, and that this brain is sometimes in competition with the logical brain. However, I have done many

drugs and know that no pheromone I have experimented with so far (at least in realistic dosages, maybe it's

different when you get into 5000mcg+) have affected me or anyone around me to the same extent that drugs do. For

example, a high dose of Androstenol MAY have the same intensity of effect on some people that a single beer would,

but I doubt it's even that much, and I doubt people can be affected too much by the pheromones.

Now an

interesting question is whether or not there is a "multiplier effect" between pheromones and drugs. I have yet to

experience this, but I have read many hit reports of phero users who have had drunk people pretty much jump their

bones. On the other hand, drunk people often get this way without pheromones. If you're good-looking, dress nice,

carry yourself properly and at a bar, there's a good chance a drunk girl will try to sleep with you regardless of

whether you have game or good pheromones. So the question is whether or not pheromones influence people to the point

that it could tip them over the edge from thinking rationally to thinking irrationally.

I still don't think so,

but there's really no way to find out at this point.

If someone is completely sane, sober, and mentally

refreshed (a.k.a. not running on no sleep for a few days), then your pheromone use is not going to influence them to

sleep with you in a way that you could not also influence them through other methods (dressing nice, saying the

right things, looking good, etc.)

Pheromones are just one part of a package. Basically consider it like raising

your level of attractiveness by 1 point.

[live4themusic]

Let's say

your gf breaks up with you and you put on the nones and seduce her knowing that she would never have had sex with

you under normal circumstances then this is basically rape or at least abuse. I just ask myself if this is

possible.
In a situation where your gf breaks up with you, without a doubt the best thing to do to get her

to have sex with you again is to let her see you with another girl you are having sex with who is hotter, cooler,

and smarter than her (assuming she didn't break up with you cause you cheated on her, and hence she is the 'hurt'

one in the relationship, not you)

So to say putting on pheromones would make her have sex with you against her

will is like saying that letting her see you with another girl causes her to have sex with you against her will. In

both situations, you are having to do something to raise her perceived value of you to get her to sleep with you

again. This doesn't mean she's acting against her will.

[maxo-texas]

All things are possible-

perhaps in the 5 billion people out there someone is that sensative to phermones.

But it's not likely in the

real world. Otherwise you would see a lot of men and women able to successfully use it now.

If you are into

evolution- you have to assume something selected against phermones working that well in humans. Possibly the fact

that so many other factors matter to whether your child will grow up and be able to reproduce.

[platinumfox]

Is this

possible? That the pheromones have such a strong effect on people that you could seduce them against their will?

Wouldn't this almost be something like rape? When you manipulate a person this way? Where is the difference between

using pheromones and seducing a woman and putting drugs into her drink?
Or do pheromones not work this

way?You are giving mones waaaay too much power.Mones makes you more attractive how can you compare that to

slipping a drug into someones drink?Humans naturally give off pheromones anyway even if it doesnt come from a

container.

I say getting a girl drunk and taking advantage of her is more like rape than using mones.Some

women get just as turned on from regular colognes would you consider that "near rape" as well?

You can't

make a person do something against their will even if you hypnotize them I know.So there is no way mones could force

a woman to take off all her clothes and have sex.The thought might cross her mind with mones but thats about it.

[Muscle4Hire]

Let me just say that the

emotional responses a woman develops and remembers about you are WAY much more important that pheros. The mones can

get the ball rolling in the right direction. So for instance, if you piss off a woman because you had sex with her

best friend and then lied about it, you can wear 5 bottles of LT and WAGG... it won't do a damn thing. What will

happen is the pheros will tug at her saying "hey, he's a good guy, trust him" but her emotions will overide them

and say "those thoughts are bullshit, don't make sense... here's why you hate him"... the emotions will win hand

over fist anytime...

So, what I'm saying is learn how to create good emotions with women starting from first

contact and building up the ladder... pheros will help kick things off but if you're a dumbass or in a bad frame of

mind, go reframe yourself/get in a better mood and go for it then.

Later

[smooth312]

PI is so incredible, you'll

seduce any woman on earth.

Seriously, since I've been using it daily, I laugh to myself when I see a hot girl

nowadays.

It's like I can get any girl to melt. Even when I see a celebrity on TV, I think, ha, she would melt

if she spent 5 min with me.

I walk into a room and all the girls stare all oogly-eyed.

Again...:box:

[dunbar]

PI is so

incredible, you'll seduce any woman on earth.

Seriously, since I've been using it daily, I laugh to myself when

I see a hot girl nowadays.

It's like I can get any girl to melt. Even when I see a celebrity on TV, I think,

ha, she would melt if she spent 5 min with me.

I walk into a room and all the girls stare all oogly-eyed.



Again...:box:

are you serious?


but if all these stories here are true then mones do indeed have

a huge effect on people. this sounds way stronger than just a beer. when a woman drinks a beer she doesnt start to

stare at me or have a DIHL, whatever this is.

[live4themusic]

are you serious?




but if all these stories here are true then mones do indeed have a huge effect on people. this sounds way

stronger than just a beer. when a woman drinks a beer she doesnt start to stare at me or have a DIHL, whatever this

is.
I believe smooth is the only user I have read to report the kinds of results he gets with the

consistency he gets. While I don't doubt he is telling the truth, he also mentioned in one of his posts that he is

very good-looking and has had DIHLs (Deer-in-headlights- a very focused, rapt look of attention a girl apparently

gives you when her interest levels skyrocket) even without pheromones.

Pheromones will only take you so far. It

seems like they have taken smooth from 10 to 11, but if you're starting out lower, you're not going to get the

same kinds of results, even if you have the perfect mix for yourself.

Every aspect of your personal appearance

(the combination of those you can control and those you can't) is important as well.

Personally, I have not had

great success with pheromones, but I feel like things are about to change for me, because everything I am doing is

starting to come together. I believe pheromones have played a role in this, but I will not say I am positive of

this, as I have been working on improving myself in many other ways concurrently. In order to determine exactly IF

it's the pheromones that are bringing me success, and if so which ones, I'm going to bring my 'game' level up to

about 7 (where I'm getting laid regularly), and then try to figure out how much of it is the pheromones and how

much of it is other work I've done.

I would say before pheromone use, I had dropped off to about a 3, although

long before that I had been as high as a 6 before. Right now I would say I'm somewhere between 4 and 5, where 5 is

getting laid with decent-looking girls every now and then. I think objectively (but don't tell this to me when I'm

off the boards) in looks, I'm about a 4 or 5 as well (for my age group and location). My 'game' was lower due to

a low mental state, the fact that I'm living with my parents, didn't have a car, thought I was going to jail, had

a minimum wage job, bad body language, vocal tonality, social skills, etc. Before that, when it was higher, I was

maybe a 6-8 in physical appearance (I think my hair loss, weight gain, body hair takeover, and a few other things

have hurt my physical appearance a bit, to the point where I noticed I was having trouble gaining compliance in some

ways that came easier to me before, when trying to hook up with a girl, but even though I've logically accepted it,

I've blocked myself from FEELING that way about myself). In addition to my more 'youthful' appearance (even

though I'm only 21 now), I was perceived as high value by my peers due to a combination of my intelligence, ability

to relate to people, living in an apartment with 2 cool roomates, and the fact that I was selling drugs, and making

good money and generally a fun person to be around (I got arrested and went to live with my parents after

that)

My point is that there's a LOT besides your pheromone output that you need to work on if you want to have

success with women (or people in general). You need to have EVERY ASPECT OF YOUR LIFE in order to have the most

success you can get. If you are making great money, then you could afford the cosmetic maintenance, gym membership,

and wardrobe updates to ensure you are at LEAST a 5 in appearance (no matter what your 'base' appearance is). Once

you have that, you need to know how to carry yourself, what to say, how to dress, how to keep yourself groomed, AND

how to maintain firm control of your pheromonal communication through synthetic -mones.

Good luck in your quest

for success!

Oh, in case you're wondering, I've only been on my self-improvement kick for about 3 months, but I

am putting in about 3-4 hours of studying how I can improve myself and reading related materials a day. My grades in

school might be suffering, but I do have a decent-paying job now, and everyone around me has noticed how I'm more

confident and self-assured. And I guarantee you it's not just the pheromones.

[Gegogi]

Can you seduce people with

pheromones even against their will?

Sure, it works for insects and lower mammals. If only it were

that simple and easy for humans... Unfortunately, our massive brains get in the way of our tiny nads real fast. You

have as much chance at bedding someone against their will with pheromones as you would by wearing a nice shirt or

new pair of shoes. So, pretty dad burn slim.

Besides, if it were against their will it wouldn't be

seduction. It would be rape. You may get those somewhat willing but sitting on the fence to go for a roll in the hay

against their better judgement. However, they ultimately make a choice however whimsical it may be.

[maxo-texas]

live... I think I had some of

the same issue about hair loss.

It bugged me- and I let them know it bugged me which is of course like saying,

"Be sure to look or think about the HUGE white expanse and how it bugs me!"

As I managed it and my feelings about

balding- it dropped in importance to the ladies too (except the 1% who just have to have long hair- which is

unrealistic on their part when you are talking about 45 year olds).

I accept my strong parts- easy going,

non-judgemental, humorous, great teeth (more of a factor as years of poor dental habits catch up with the other

guys), fit (huge numbers of guys bloat up bad in their 40's), smart, successful, no substance problems, yada yada

yada.

I don't know what having a collection of girlfriends puts me at- I'm not a 10, but it is a relative

thing- I may be a 9 among 40 year olds.

I have seen mones have a powerful effect on *some* females. I have seen

them make me much more funny, interesting, comfortable to be around to many females. I've never seen any "buyers

remorse" on the part of the ladies tho- so they don't regret the time later. If they did, I'd say the mones and

my "game" was putting them into a false state.

I do get a lot of comments that indicate they get into states

they *LIKE* being in and that many other men can't bring them to. Those statements intensified after I added in

mones and appropriate male behavior and became slightly more alpha than I "really" am.

[Method]

im with gegogi...mones just

heighten your appearance...if phero use is rape then so is getting a nice haircut or wearing nice cologne

[Lor]

okay i can be silent no longer,
:LOL:

first, i work in a place where i decant my pheromones.
this

is a very public place.
i would be a horny MESS if pheromones, on a body or not, were to make me do anything i did

not already have in my mind to do prior.
this should actually be good news to the fellas; if a gal is all over you

and the deal is sealed, its all YOU,baby.
pheromones make me ballsier to act on what im thinking, and if im on the

fence they push me over, but they are nothing but a neon-sign saying " take a look! " . having said this, i still

dont ever want to be without them, they are too much damn fun!

[SoCal]

Not that I have

had much success yet, but my feelings is this:

This aspect of

Pheromones remind me of hypnotism. I am not saying they are in a trance state. What I am saying is that if you were

in a trance state by a hypnotist, where you subconsciously take suggestions, you will NOT by any means do something

that your mind and body says no to. This includes morals. Therefore, no matter how strong the phero reaction, if the

girl does not WANT you, or does not WANT to sleep with you, then she will not. She will not act on something if she

feels it is wrong. The only reaction in my opinion is that pheros help you be noticed, and help you with your own

mood. NOTHING ELSE. The only involuntary thing that I can guess, and only because I have read it, is EW might make a

man physically aroused. But I have doubts about that one too being uncontrolled because I imagine if I do not want

to be turned on, or if I do not dig that girl, I don't think anything will get me noticeably

aroused.

I hate that I am shallow, but I am. A pretty girl can

wear mones and I will notice her, a not so pretty girl could wear mones and I may notice her, but I will not act,

because I am a shallow person (which I am working on changing). I always think of things that are not attractive

when I talk to a less than attractive person.

Just my

thoughts.

[Monello]

You

Know Live and Maxo, you bring up an interesting point, intentionally or not. You mentioned that hair loss made you

horribly self conscious and thus created a negative effect. Yet one can take a Bruce Willis or Vin Diesel type

(hey I could say joe down the block but nobody on the forum likely knows Joe and I am making a point here!:lol:

) and they make bald sexy. Same circumstance different reaction. Sort of the glass is half full v. half empty

thinking. But beyond pessimism/optimism, it demonstrates, as you both discovered to your success, that it is

so much about attitude.

Incidentally, I have ordered Alpha 7 and will be very interested to see how it

works in with who I am compared to the Realm I tried a couple years or so ago. I have heard next to nothing about

Alpha 7 on this forum. Why is that?