To those who work out and know about pharmaceauticals

[CJ01]

I´ve been getting spam mail from these places:
www.lifetechlabs.com (\"http://www.lifetechlabs.com\")
and
www.sdi-labs.com (\"http://www.sdi-labs.com\")

Does anyone know of these companies (they have the same address) and the products they are offering?

CJ

[**DONOTDELETE**]

Creatine cannot survive the pH of your stomache, and the breakdown products dehydrate you. Any anabolic steroid alters your metabolism. It causes a large shift in the reconstruction of degraded material (muscles) when you are at rest. This is how you normally accumulate muscle, but with these steriods, the rebuild is greatly enhanced. Most diet supplements (weight loss,) if legal, are stimulants. Same idea as before, but from the other side. Stimulants increase metabolism, and turnover (or catabolism, the opposite of anabolism), more energy is used, and that has to come from somewhere. Unless you are in a problem group, diet and exercise are the best answer, mentally and physically.

[**DONOTDELETE**]

One other thing, creatine is not a muscle builder, at least not technically. In the body, the basic energy unit is ATP. It is used and made into ADP + Pi. Creatine, or phospho-creatine, and a phosphotransferase enzyme regenerate the ADP to ATP. Most estimates are that the stored ATP + Creatine Phosphate in the body will allow for 10 seconds of stress energy (Flight) before anaerobic metabolism kicks in for more energy. I know it is kinda off subject, but I put it up in case anyone wanted to know. . .

[Whitehall]

I\'ve tried creatine as a weightlifting adjunct. My understanding and personal observation is that creatine plumps up your muscles, making them standup and out by swelling them with fluid. No functional affects noted.

I was shocked after my first week of use and some self-portraits. My muscles were huge! Grotesque, even. I was hoping for a \"David\" or Apollo effect but way overshot! After laying off the creatine, the muscles quickly got back to normal and more what I was comfortable looking like. I have some photos if anyone\'s interested.

Frankly, I haven\'t bothered with creatine since.

[**DONOTDELETE**]

CJ,
Don\'t even bother with these things, they are just nutritional supplements like creatine (which I took but will never take again). These products are supposed to increase strength and endurance--but the side effects of such products are fuzzy- and should be used at ones own discretion. For example, Creatine (muscle builder) is legal here in the US but studies in Europe (French chemists) have proven it to be harmful to the body in the long-run and thus it is banned over there. So basically, to anyone who lifts weights, runs, etc.. and wants to become bigger, stronger, and so on--do it the old fashioned way and stick to the basics.

[**DONOTDELETE**]

CJ,

I have gotten some of their spams as well. These are crap products atually. They are being marketed as the legal alternative to steroids, and using very simular names as the illegal steroids.Anyway they are spammed all over the place.

TCO

[CJ01]

I am always suspicious about pharma products. I´d not buy them even if I had the dough. Side effects are the biggest problem with products like these. That´s also why I decided against getting xenedrine (we talked about this a while back) because I was certain it would not be good for me personally.

Has anyone here tried the Thermo Serum - there´s one for men and one for women. It´s on www.alloutfitness.com (\"http://www.alloutfitenss.com\") ùnder the category `weight loss´. It´s suppose to be taken before work out and help accelerate the fat burning process.
CJ

[CJ01]

It looks like I made a typo error here´s the link again :
www.alloutfitness.com (\"http://www.alloutfitness.com\")

I´ve never completely understood why someone would want HUGE muscles (especially women). Granted, muscle can be VERY sexy but bodybuilders often suffer from cardiacs and similar problems later on.

PS the company who makes this Thermo Serum is called Muscle Marketing. Does anyone know what kind od a reputaion they have because unfortunately there´s no info on the contents of the product on the allout fitness website.
CJ

[**DONOTDELETE**]

One other misconception is that protein will increase muscle mass. It does not. It gets made into fat, and urea. If you over consume protein it is bad. The excess urea causes long term kidney damage. If you are wondering about this, think along these lines. How many grams of supplement protein is listed to consume, vs. how many grams of muscle mass is gained after a workout session. Muscle is gained by stressing the muscles, not by eating.

[ December 20, 2001: Message edited by: Walter Mitty ]

[Whitehall]

Naw! The way to put on muscle is to stress it, so that the little fibers break and need mending. That\'s the \"burn\" bodybuilders aim for when training. Then make sure you have an excess of protein in your system. That way, the mending also makes bigger. Overstress your muscles without excess protein and they waste as when you overtrain.

Granted, excess protein without exercise turns to fat - lard, actually.

You\'re right that creatine DOES NOT add muscle mass, that is protein. It does add mass to muscles, through water retention or some such.

[**DONOTDELETE**]

True that protein is required to rebuild the muscle, but how much is needed? The body runs quite nicely on about 80 grams (320 Calories of Pro) a day. This is a minimum, but if you were to add a 100 gram supplement to this, you would waste a lot of calories. As far as how much more muscle is built, in most cases, it is not measurable from day to day. Also, the burn you mentioned, well, lifting is not aerobic, the muscle accumulate lactic acid from anaerobic metabolism of glucose, and it takes a day or so for the body to transport it to the liver for gluconeogenesis. Hmmm, nice run on. The destruction of muscle fibers could also play into this, but I am guessing that lactic acid is the major player.

[ December 20, 2001: Message edited by: Walter Mitty ]

[**DONOTDELETE**]

Well, extra protein can be turned into Lard, but that requires a pig. The extra protein in us can be used for a variety of things, but most of us are overfed, so it turns into fat.

[Whitehall]

Different kinda \"burn.\"

Aerobics do \"burn\" but you stay, well, aerobic rather than anaerobic. Musclebuilding \"burn\" is breaking muscle microfibers and you usually stay anaerobic. It has to hurt the day after too! Mixing weights and aerobics the same session or day is counterproductive.

Yes, bodybuilding is a waste of calories, I will admit. The rule of thumb is supplement with 1.5 grams of protein per kg of body mass so a 220lb guy would need 150 grams of protein a day EXTRA. But the excess drives muscle mass additions - no one said it was efficient. And yes, it it hard on the kidneys so drink plenty of water.

But, as CJ pointed out, many women do get VERY turned on by the right amount and placement of muscle on a man. Too much is too much, I quite agree. Still, I\'ve been amply rewarded for my time in the gym. I just love those giggles of delight I\'ve been getting!

[**DONOTDELETE**]

I´m goinging to stick my head out here images/icons/laugh.gif and recomend http://www.t-mag.com/ (\"http://www.t-mag.com/\")
for any advice that might be needed on supplementation and training(unlike some so-called training \"experts\" they actualy know what they are talking about and they are(in my opinion) the last word on hormones and muscle growt/training, hell they even answer emails within a few days as well)

As far as supplements I whole-heartedly recomend http://www.biotestedge.com/ (\"http://www.biotestedge.com/\")
O´yea I´m new........

Satan

[Whitehall]

Yes, Biotest products are some of the best and www.t-mag.com (\"http://www.t-mag.com\") is great site for bodybuilding info. I\'ve especially liked their AndroSol spray-on androstenediol. It gave me very impressive muscle mass gains. Medlean offers a similar product too.

I also use AndroSol before hot dates, the quasi-testosterone being great for the libido, virility, and stamina. A short dose is good for women\'s libido too although they can get irratible.