First Day with Pheromones

[LiteMeUP]

Just got my

beginers package yesterday.
this is just a day to day summary of my experience with pheromones. I will have a post

each day with my experience with different products to eventually find out if this stuff works or doesn't



first day.
1) aplied two sprays of SPMO:TE 50:50 mix with 1/4 of Chikara Gel Pack

[LiteMeUP]

oops hit enter by mistake. Btw

I applied two sprays of spmo/te mix and 1/4 of chikara gel pack

well this was what happened with the above

application.

Took the Train: No hits not even a stare
at work: same as any other work day.
lunch: no hits

not even a stare
train back home: no hits not even a stare

Strange think is that when i don't even use

pheromones I get at least 2 hits with long stares and smiles in the NYC subway ?? Today I had a total opposite of

what i expected

Summary: Im better of without pheromones according to todays experiment

tomorrow: Plan to

just use 1/4 pack of chikara only

sunday: plan to use Alter ego only

Monday: plan to use AE with Chikara



will keep posting results for those days.

thanks

[OrangePanda]

Haha. Today was my first

day too. Had NO results like you.

I did a mix of the EDGE and the MUSK OIL.

Though, I only took two light

sprays with that.

Around noontime at work, I was like ... WTF ... so I applied
some of the packet of Chikara I

carried in case I experienced
any OD effects.

The Chikara smells pretty damn good. But, that was about it.



Edge, Chikara .. noticed nothing.

Well, I'm an impatient person. So, I think I'll jump to the Alter Ego I

got
too. Probably mix it in with the Edge/Musk. I hope my cologne cover scent arrives
tomorrow.

Will have to

read the posts on the SOE tonight. Have a singles bar to hit tomorrow night. ;)

[chrome]

im noticing something wierd, ive

noticed that when people first try pheromones they don't notice any results like me. But after 3 or 4 rounds they

start noticing the hits, maybe our body balance the new mones with the old ones and we get nothing?

[Gegogi]

If you want hits, you normally

need to take the imitative: smile, say hello, strike up a conversation, look nice, etc. The 'mones will make your

efforts more effective and make you appear more attractive. In other words, they enhance you slightly. They won't

cause strange women to drop from the ceiling and bite you on the ass. Also, you need to have these women in your

personal space for a few minutes in order for you and the 'mones to work their magic. Notice I said "you and the

'mones." The 'mones won't draw women to a deadman...

Eariler this week I applied a mix of SOE, A-1 and

NPA, covered it with Calvin Klein One and went to work (I'm a music professor). I had an interview with a local TV

news crew and the college paper for an upcoming event, so I dressed extra nice and groomed myself to perfection. The

TV reporter, an attractive white woman in her early 30s, could not keep her hands off me. She also stood so close I

could smell her vividly (not a bad smell--just a woman smell). I'm around Asians most of the time--not touchy-feely

people until they know you well--so I was surprised. TV reporters are gregarious souls, but it was obvious the

'mones had her under my spell. The vibe was very sexual, her eyes dilated and I had to really restrain myself from

grabbing her in front of the camera man. She hung around for an hour, way longer than needed for our 3 minute

interview! Of course she was married...

The student reporter, a young Asian female, had the opposite

reaction. She was so nervous she could barely speak and, unlike the TV reporter, rarely made eye contact. Of course

the difference in age and culture account for some of the differences in reactions. After we talked for 15 or 20

minutes I thought she was going to pee her pants she was twitching so much. When a student walked in to ask me a

question she bolted for the door like a scared rabbit...

Now I think both women felt attraction to me but

handled it very differently due to personality, race, social standing and culture.

[MOBLEYC57]

Eariler this week

I applied a mix of SOE, A-1 and NPA, covered it with Calvin Klein One and went to work (I'm a music

professor).
Hey G! :wave: Can we the formula you used for mixing that mix? :POKE:

Did you spray it?

:think: Did you get her number? :think: You gonna do'er? :think: Tell the truth, shame the devil! :drunk:



Tanks! :cheers:

[LiteMeUP]

Gegoi

I understand that.

Of course I don't expect results like in the movie love potion #9 where all the woman start chasing you down the

street. But I would expect at least an unexpected glance up. Even a good smelling cologne like obsession that

contains no pheromones has a girl look up to see who smelling so good and gives at least a smile. Of course I would

smile and be more outgoing with a femail but I would've expected a cologne with pheromones to do a lot better than

a cologne without :). Besides Im already and outgoing type and usually get lots of hits after all i do live in NYC

just thought the mones would step up my game. It still early and i haven't tried all the different products. There

is one product that has worked for me and thats realm. thats what got me into this mone scene .

thx

[MOBLEYC57]

LitUp, I'd say you had too much

on (two different scents), but I'm not a professional.

Annnnnnd, you didn't say how/where you sprayed

the mix, and where you applied your Chika. How old are ya/how tall are ya/how much do you weigh? :POKE: The more

advanced may need these answers in order to attempt to help you in your scientifc experiments. ?????

[gfunk]

The 'mones won't draw

women to a deadman
Well put... :thumbsup:

[Gegogi]

"Eariler this week I

applied a mix of SOE, A-1 and NPA, covered it with Calvin Klein One and went to work (I'm a music

professor)

Well, I'm more improviser than receipe, but basically I stroked the SOE rollon on my

neck, back of hands and forearms, probably 3 or 4 inches each time. I dabbed 5 or 6 dots of NPA in the same places

followed by a half eye dropper of half strength A-1. Calvin Klein Once was applied to the same places. Later I

usually touch up the same elements.

And, no, I didn't do her. I just enjoyed the tease and exercise. You

can't do every woman you tease or feel a momentary attraction to (you'd get bored and never get any work done).

[LiteMeUP]

Ill be more detailed on my next

post.
2 sprays to chest. and put 1/4 gel distributed evently behind ears and neck.

Im 6,4" weigh 235lbs.

Latino.

[LiteMeUP]

oh yeah and im 29yrs old

[CptKipling]

Two sprays of a 50% TE mix can

be a a lot for some people, maybe you should cut down slightly.

[MOBLEYC57]

Two sprays of

a 50% TE mix can be a a lot for some people, maybe you should cut down slightly.OR, use two sprays

without applying Chikara, in which I would guess was his problem. :think: Key word: GUESS.:run: And standing

6'4," Chikara might have added to his intimidating factors, yes? :think:

[Marlboro_man]

OR, use

two sprays without applying Chikara, in which I would guess was his problem. :think: Key word: GUESS.:run:

And standing 6'4," Chikara might have added to his intimidating factors, yes? :think:It does't add the

intimdating factor for me and I'm even taller and weigh more.

Also here is again proof of why my quest written

in my signature is so important.

[bjf]

It does't add

the intimdating factor for me and I'm even taller and weigh more.

Also here is again proof of why my quest

written in my signature is so important.

Marlboro, the problem is, their seems to be much stronger

factors that affect how the pheromone products work on us, other than a possible weak correlation between our ht/wt,

age, race etc.

So I think that is the reason why most forum vets don't really have a passion for that

info.

[Jonathan]

The Edge is pretty weak.

I recommend that you play with

http://www.unix.pro.br/pmixcalc/index.php some. One spray of

pure TE contains 0.0156 mg of pheromones, and half of that is LaCroy's secret ingredients (IIRC. The calculator

incorrectly counts those as 'none, right?), and you're only using a 50% TE mix in the first place, so you should

be getting about 0.0038mg of none per spray, or 0.00765 mg none total. Most people seem to have best results with

around (and no more than) 0.03mg of none, so you might want to try using a little more of that mix.



As for the Chikara dosage, each packet contains a total of 0.13mg of pheromones per 1.5ml gel pack. If

you're using 1/4 of a gel pack, that's 0.0325mg of Chikara pheromones. Now, we have absolutely no idea what ratio

the 7 Chikara pheromones exist in, so anything anyone can say about that is mere speculation. But if we speculate

that they're all in a 1:1 ratio (which is probably not TOO wrong), that would be about (0.0325/7)mg = 0.00464mg of

none, and 0.028mg of other 'mones from the Chikara.

In total, you're probably getting around

0.01229mg of none and 0.0355mg of six or seven other pheromones (depending if the LaCroy secret also happens

to be in the Chikara seven). That's not much. It's not that little, either. With this amount, I would expect you

probably would notice effects on people who remain close to you for an extended period of time and on people who get

very close to you briefly (e.g., for a hug).

You should note, too, that particularly with none-heavy mixes,

the tip-of-the-iceberg effect is quite strong. Unless the pheromones are working very well, most of the

effects of pheromones do not show themselves spontaneously. You never know what someone thinks about you unless

you ask them, or unless you interact with them. Sure, you might say that pheromones should make women find you

sexier, and you would therefore expect them to look at you lustily more frequently; however, it also might make

women more shy (at low doses of none) or intimidated (at high doses), which would make them look at you less

frequently. If you're wearing a lot of nol, that shouldn't be as much of a problem. Also, if you're wearing a lot

of anything (especially none), you shouldn't have that problem, as you will certainly notice reactions--they just

may not be positive. Regardless, you shouldn't expect people to lose all self-control and modesty the moment they

smell you. It doesn't usually work that way. (But it sure is nice when it does.) You should try seeing how

easy it is to chat people up both with and without mones. You might see a difference then. Given, you might just be

experiencing the placebo/confidence effect, but it's better to risk that than to risk not observing the mones'

(potential) effects.

Also, keep in mind that this is winter. During the wintertime, several things

happen which reduce the range and effectiveness of pheromones. First, people generally wear more clothing

(especially in NYC). If you apply mones on a surface that will be covered by clothing, you can expect them to be

less effective. Second, people tend to get colds and stuff when it's cold and, in general, produce more

nasal mucous, which would probably reduce the amount of mones that reach the VNO. Third, people sweat less

when it's cold. I don't know exactly how that would affect pheromones, but I think that evaporating sweat would

tend to carry mones off the skin and into the air (after all, that is how it's supposed to happen by nature in our

armpits, right?). Fourth, sweat evaporates much less quickly when it's cold. And last (and probably

least), the rate of diffusion for 'mones (and other things) is K*sqrt(temerature/molec. mass). That means

that mones will travel 4.48% faster when it's 25°C than when it's 0°C. What this means is that you can expect

mones to be much less effective at a distance during the winter than during the summer.

So what

do I recommend? Well first of all, you could try getting close and naked with someone in a warm

environment. If you can't manage that, either wear more mones, put it on a part of your body that gets a lot of

air (wrists, the backs of your hands, or your hair might work), initiate conversations with strangers, try to get

closer to people for longer periods of time, and/or try to get girls to inhale them directly (the "how's my new

cologne?" ruse works pretty well for this, despite its simplicity).

[tounge]

Nice post Jonathan. You seem to be

one of the few people around here that might know what the hell they are talking about.

[bjf]

Nice post Jonathan. You

seem to be one of the few people around here that might know what the hell they are talking about.

I

agree! Put this guy on payroll!

[OrangePanda]

Ok, second day with

pheromones. I started off in the morning by mixing up a batch of TE,
MUSK OIL with NOL (does this negate the

effects of TE/-none?) and AE. I filled the atomizer about 1/5th
of the way with equal TE and MUSK. Then put in at

least 6 drops of AE (1.5 dropper fulls).
Sprayed myself 3-4 times with it. NOTHING. Male ... Female ... Zilch.

So, I thought nothing of it ... since I
normally am not much of a socializer. I get my work done and 'vamos'

out of places.

So, later in the night ... I'm supposed to go to a bar where it's supposed to be a single's

gathering.
I drop on 6+ drops of AE. And, spread about 1/3rd a packet of the SOE onto my various zones (ears,

wrists, etc).
At the bar, I try and converse with this lady who's 30+ ... she's about within 12 inches of me ...

as, I'm trying to get
close to her possible. So, I'm talking to her for about 10+ minutes ... nothing great ..

but, she's still talking to me ... then when
one of her friend's comes (guy) -- she immediately excuses herself.

Because, she has a birthday party planned for her when guests
start arriving. So, her talking to me to begin with

was definitely nothing to do with the mones.

Being that was the case ... I go into the bathroom and apply the

rest of the packet of SOE to my body and hair again. The rest of the night (about an hour) -- nothing goes on.



So, at this point ... being that I have a skeptical nature to begin with ... I'm really skeptical on this. I

will probably OD on Monday (it being valentine's) with AE and SOE. Or rather, I will apply enough onto my body

that people will call it a OD effect ... although, I've noticed no one shying away from me so far ...

1) Should

I try applying the TE alone?
2) Or, should I try applying the SOE alone (without any AE or TE)?

[Jonathan]

Panda: I'm counting one

dropperful of AE as being about 13 drops, which would make 1.5 droppers 19.5 drops. I'm not sure what gave you the

6 figure, so I'm going to use the mean of the two figures--12 drops--for my calculations.

The atomizer has a

10ml storage chamber, so 1/5 of that is 2ml. Add 12 drops of AE at 0.05ml/drop, and you have a total volume of

2.6ml. 1ml of TE has 0.05mg of -none and 0.05mg of LC secrets. 1ml of SPMO has an unknown amount of -nol--according

to some, maybe as much as 0.5mg (though I REALLY doubt that), and maybe (and probably, if you ask me) as little as

0.01mg. 12 drops of AE has 0.12mg -none, 0.09mg -nol, and 0.06mg -rone. In total, that's 0.17mg -none, between

0.1mg and 0.6mg -nol, 0.06mg -rone and 0.05mg LC secrets in 2.6ml, or 0.065mg/ml -none, 0.03 to 0.23mg/ml -nol, and

some change. 3-4 sprays is about 0.4ml, so you should have gotten 0.026mg -none and (I'm guessing) about 0.012mg

-nol. That's a fairly good dose of -none and a somewhat light dose of -nol.

Then, when you added 6 drops of

AE, you added 0.06mg -none (!) for a total of 0.086mg -none, plus an additional 0.045mg -nol and 0.03mg -rone. The

1/3 packet of SOE would have added about 0.035mg -nol and 0.075mg -rone. That should have been a moderately strong

overdose. You had a lot of -nol in there, though, so I wouldn't have expected people to see you as aggressive and

dangerous per se, but your presence still would probably have made them uncomfortable. I might guess that that was

what happened to the 30+ woman: she probably felt uncomfortable with you, a bit intimidated, and while not quite

threatened, and probably a little bit attracted, certainly not at home. The fact that you were trying to get close

to her might have enhanced the sensation of having her comfort zone, her personal space, invaded. If you were in

that kind of situation, what would you do? Maybe run towards some token of security, such as (for example), a

non-threatening, brother-like male friend of yours?

See, there is more than one way that people can shy away

from you. The most obvious way is when people think you stink. That usually involves people clamping or wrinkling

their noses and saying something to that effect. A second, but still pretty obvious way is when people are simply

intimidated and frightened by you. That's a simple -none overdose, but with sufficient cover scent to avoid the

stinkyness. The problem with a dose like the one you had--where you practically OD on practically everything--is

that it tends to cause really strange, confused, indirect, and unpredictable feelings in people. Often, when you

have too much of everything, it can appear almost exactly like you don't have enough of anything because most of

the positive and negative affects associated with each of the component pheromones stand in opposition and leave

those you interact with with little to show except a sort of general unease. At one moment, they may feel (because

of the -nol) a desire to expose their heart to you unembellished, and the next moment (because of the -none) a

desire to present only their strengths and no weaknesses, and end up doing neither. Of course, unless you've

studied NLP or body language and are really good at reading people's faces and such, you'll have no idea that

these things are going through these people's minds. It'll seem to you like they just aren't interested in

interacting with you.

Don't get me wrong, powerful mixes/doses like the one you had that night can be very

effective, but only if you really know what's going on. In a situation like that, you would have to anticipate and

answer any and all qualms your audience might have about you because of the -mones. If you do that properly, you can

make a girl fall in love with you very quickly. Of course, you probably would feel next to nothing for her (which

would make your manipulative masquerade just that much more difficult), and believe me, it's not much better to be

the object of unrequited love than the subject.

I seem to see a lot of people expecting pheromones to somehow

magically fix their social lives. They won't. What they will do, however, is change the way people feel about you.

It's still your job to take things from there. Want more (female) friends? Wear a lot of -nol, but be prepared to

open your heart to them. Want to have sex now? Wear a lot of -none, but you'd better have some smooth moves to put

women at ease, and you'd better be ready for some raw, emotion-free sex.

It sounds like you just want want to

figure out if these things even work at all. Well, if that's your goal, I recommend trying some of the pheromone

components in relative isolation. You could start with that TE:SPMO:AE mix of yours, since it's already mixed and

it's mostly -none (and doesn't smell TOO bad, I hope). I'd stick with about the same dosage as you were

using--maybe 2-6 sprays to start, with maybe 1 refresh spray every 4 hours--and try interacting more with people.

You won't notice people initiating contact any more with you if you're (just) wearing -none, but they should react

to you differently. Try telling people jokes, especially random strangers. People will probably laugh at even the

unfunny ones, but won't find the really funny ones as funny as they normally would. Basically, they'll probably

laugh more out of the social need to appease than out of humor. Also, try telling stories in front of groups while

wearing this mix: if you get any success whatsoever, you'll find it much easier to get the group's

attention than before, as if you're somehow an authority on whatever subject you're discussing.

Later, try

out some SOE by itself. 1/3 to 2/3 of a packet should be good. You should notice people open up a lot, and,

depending on the culture of the area where you live, you might even see people start to approach you and start

talking about whatever is on their minds.

But most importantly, take your time. Give it a couple of weeks. One

day is too short a time to figure out how a mix is working. Try the same mix/dosage for a few days. You'll probably

see things the first day that you think was related that you'll later realize weren't, and so forth. And don't

expect too much. (Warning: oversimplification coming.) Pheromones are unique among scent-like chemicals in

that they affect the limbic system of the brain (i.e., the "reptilian/visceral/emotional brain") directly, without

the messages passing through the cerebral cortex ("conscious/cognitive/thinking brain"). However, it's important to

remember that all of the decisions that really matter are made by the cortex, not the limbic system; if a girl

decides to sleep with you, it will be because her cortex tells her to, not because her limbic system does. The

limbic system is important because it acts as a sort of "data source" which the cortex uses to make decisions. The

cortex will look at the emotions and memories associated with a person, and decide what actions to take regarding

that person. Pheromones won't make girls act like animals. Animals have much smaller cortices, and proportionally

larger and more empowered limbic systems than humans. Pheromones won't make the limbic system take over in humans;

they will only change what the limbic system says.

Anyway, good luck. I hope you figure out how to use them and

what to expect. And if not, there's always that money-back thing of Bruce's.

[OrangePanda]

Thanks for the long reply.

I actually skipped the dosage calculation and how much mones is in each drop (etc). My brain can't handle that

type of math.

I guess I should also mention there are some things I'm pretty impatient about. So, I will stick

it out with what I have until the supply runs out and see if there's any difference. Differences, I think I'm

quite observative when it happens ...

Will keep reading up on other posts to see what I might be doing wrong.

Thanks.

[CptKipling]

Jonathan,

Your

posts have a lot of brilliantly insight in them, but there are also some things I would like to correct.



Firstly, 1 spray of TE can be too much for some people, you are simplifying optimum -none levels too much and

disregarding other ingredients (or ingredient in this case). By my calculations (using this:

http://pherolibrary.com/LSPC/Files/Exper

imentation%20Spreadsheet.xls (http://pherolibrary.com/LSPC/Files/Experimentation%20Spreadsheet.xls) ), you would end up with 0.005 mg per spray of -none and the secret, 0.01 mg

total. Similar problems with C7 dosages, you are disregarding the other ingredients and that serveral people have

found more than 1/4 of a pack to be too much.

Lastly, AE's dropper gives drops of volume (approx.) 0.02 ml, but

I agree that he is still ODing.

[MOBLEYC57]

This is the part that I HATE!

:rasp: You math FREAKS ... when you finish with the war of the minds ... is it possible that you can post how many

drops of AE & NPA, since those are the two that's discussed here, equals the .03 mg that suppose to do the sexual

thingy trick? :blink:


Thanks!:run:

[bjf]

Is the .03 right though? I like what

jonathon said...multiplying npa/te none content by 1.5 because of the secret ingredient.

[MOBLEYC57]

Is the .03 right

though? I like what jonathon said...multiplying npa/te none content by 1.5 because of the secret ingredient.


That's the part that I'm waiting and hoping for. It pay to have intelligent math freaks around :box: , if

you're a Mobley! :blink:

Don't know if it's true, but Bassman said .03, and now Jonathon, so that's where

I'd place my bet! :thumbsup:

[CptKipling]

It was between 0.02 and 0.03

mg, but I'm not sure how that relates to other pheromones.

For Mobley: 5 drops of AE gives 0.02 mg of -none, 8

gives 0.032 mg

[Jonathan]

CptKipling:
I'm still

new here, so I'm sure I'm still making a lot of mistakes. Yeah, it's really hard to predict what Chikara would do

based on dosage. I have no idea what's in it, and one (or all) of the three secret Chikara -mones may be more

potent, have a lower OD threshhold, or otherwise produce undesired effects in that dose range. 1/4 of a packet may

be--and likely is--too much Chikara. However, I'm guessing that LiteMeUp was probably looking more for

typical -none effects, since he is a newbie, and that's what newbie's are generally more interested in/aware of.

This would suggest And in those terms, 0.0123mg -none (+ 0.0325mg other) isn't that much, especially in cold,

crowded, fast-paced NYC. Also, I think I've read other people posting success using 1-2 (or something) sprays of

Chikara as a base during the day and at work, and then when going to clubs, adding a couple of drops of NPA for

sexual oomph. I think the same people have posted failures when using more than 2 sprays of Chikara. This suggests

to me that the Chikara overdose is not a -none overdose, but something different. Of course, there are other

possible explanations for that, and I'm not sure that my memory isn't deceiving me, so grain of salt.

As

for drop size, I think there's something funky going on, and it's not just the AE. I think people have been using

drop sizes of 0.05ml for most of their calculations in general (including the ones that the 0.03mg figure comes

from), but I think that a lot of the products out there--basically, anything alcohol-based, plus a lot of

dropper-based products like AE and SPMO--have drop sizes which are closer to 0.02ml. If that's the case, there's

probably half the 0.01mg and 0.012mg -none in one drop of AE and NPA (respectively) that I used above. But it might

also be the case that the 0.03mg rule is really a 3-drops-of-AE rule, in which case it should really be a 0.015mg

rule. After all, 7 drops of AE (the amount which would have 0.03mg -none based on 0.02ml drops) sounds like a bit

much, and I've heard of ODs with that dose. The online pheromone calculator uses 0.05mg drops for everything, and

so I've been trying more for consistency than for accuracy until I'm certain how big each product's drop size is

and that 0.03mg is both a good rule of thumb and based on accurate data.

OrangePanda:
Sorry for

last night's post. I made it at 3:29am, and I didn't express myself as eloquently as I could have, so I think I

garbled the message a bit.

You really have to be patient. I'm sorry, but it's true. Maybe not with

me, because I can really be trying on people's patience, but certainly with the -mones. As HL Mencken said, "for

every complex problem, there is a solution that is simple, neat, and wrong." Now, dosage of pheromones really isn't

that complex. However, the things that you're dosing--people--are. And examining the way humans interact is even

more complex, because not only do you have two complex beings instead of one, but you also have emerging properties

in that system. Adding a simple pheromone to that complex system will not produce simple results, and, depending on

the circumstances, it might not even have any visible effects at all. So you haven't noticed anything happening,

both with Chikara and with TE. While that might be (partially) a dosing problem, I think it's probably more likely

that you're mostly just expecting the wrong things--expecting pheromones to "just work," when they won't. You said

in your second post that "I normally am not much of a socializer." Pheromones simply will not replace social skills

at all. They will change the way people interact with you, and they will change the way people talk to you, but if

you don't engage people in conversation (or don't try), you probably won't see any effects from pheromones.

Now, if you just want to see effects of the -mones so you know that they do something, I recommend that you try

ODing on that TE:SPMO mix of yours. (Keep in mind that there are some differing opinions on what an OD dose will

be: some say two sprays of that mix will do it, but I personally think it would take at least five, probably seven,

and possibly as much as ten sprays of that mix to get a solid, unequivocal OD.) Of course, ODing on TE isn't fun,

but I'm sure you know that already. However, seeing -mones do something might give you enough confidence in

their potential efficacy to be more patient with them in general. And what should you do once you have that

patience? If you want to develop a social life, use SOE, and learn how to engage people in

conversation. SOE will make this easier for you, but it won't speak for you. Without SOE, people will

generally expect you to be speaking about 50% of the time. With SOE, you can usually get away with 25%, and

sometimes as little as 10%. So for a 30 minute conversation, you would normally be expected to have 15 minutes worth

of things to say, but with SOE you might be able to get away with seven, or even three minutes' worth. But even

then, that's only if it's the right three minutes. SOE also makes that right three minutes easier to find: women

are particularly responsive to open-ended questions when you use SOE--they read more into them, and respond to them

longer--but SOE won't ask the questions for you. That's something you have to do yourself.



Mobleyc57:
The 0.03mg isn't magic. It's generally a good rule of thumb, but all generalizations

are false. If you're using 0.02ml drops, as CptKipling did, then 0.02mg or 0.015mg is probably a safer rule of

thumb, with 0.03mg being the upper limit of usable doses. If you're using 0.05ml drops, 0.03mg is probably a good

figure to shoot for, with 0.05mg being the upper limit. (Also, keep in mind that the secret ingredients and lack of

-nol and -rone in NPA makes it more powerful and easier to OD on.) In sum, what's this mean? Well, in terms of

drops, you should use 2-5 drops of AE or 1-3 drops of NPA--pretty much what most people recommend anyway. The x.xxmg

rule is more important when you're mixing products, or using dilute or very concentrated products like TE or EW

(even though that's not -none) or applying in unusual ways (like mixed with cologne, for example), and therefore

when dosage guidelines are harder to come by.

[Philip-]

I'm also having a hard time

catching up on the math but hopefully i'll understand how it works sometime :). I have a little question though

that i have been wondering about. Let say that i have found out 1 spray of Chikara solely is a superb amount for me,

and 2 daps of NPA solely is also a very very good amount for me. But when I mix them together is it then possible

that they wont work very well? And lets say i have found out that 2 sprays of chikara with 4 daps of npa is very

good, but then if i want to go with less npa because eg. i think it might be able to get better resuslts, so i

decrease it to 2 daps instead, would i then have to cut down chikara down to 1 spray too, in order to keep it in

the same ratio and make it work? Im asking because i still dont have found any mix that works for me, and have been

wondering whether my chikara amount was good enough, but my npa amount was too little/big and thus destroyed the

mix.


(Sorry if its too off topic, i just thought it would be stupid to make a whole thread about it and it

seems to fit a bit with all the math here :))

[bjf]

pick the most precise thing for you,

ie one of the products. Use that ideal amount, keep that constant, and adapt the second product's amount to work

in conjunction with the first amount.

[Philip-]

Ok, i'll try that and thanks

bjf =)

[Jonathan]

Let say that i

have found out 1 spray of Chikara solely is a superb amount for me, and 2 daps of NPA solely is also a very very

good amount for me. But when I mix them together is it then possible that they wont work very well?
Yes,

it's possible. I'm not sure if it's probable, but it's definitely possible. One of the things that makes Chikara

difficult is that nobody really knows what's in it, so it's difficult to predict exactly what it will do,

especially when mixed with other products. Chikara definitely contains -none, though, as does NPA, and -none is

responsible for a lot of ODs, so the extra amount of -none in Chikara may push you over the edge. However,

I've heard of a couple of people who add NPA to their highest possible sub-OD dose of Chikara without ill effects,

so I would guess that something other than -none causes Chikara ODs. In other words, if you add a spray of Chikara

to the highest possible dose of NPA that you can use, you'll probably OD. But if you add a drop or two of NPA to

the highest possible dose of Chikara that you can use, you probably won't. But, of course, YMMV.


And

lets say i have found out that 2 sprays of chikara with 4 daps of npa is very good, but then if i want to go with

less npa because eg. i think it might be able to get better resuslts, so i decrease it to 2 daps instead, would i

then have to cut down chikara down to 1 spray too, in order to keep it in the same ratio and make it work? Im asking

because i still dont have found any mix that works for me, and have been wondering whether my chikara amount was

good enough, but my npa amount was too little/big and thus destroyed the mix.
Ratios of one product to

another can sometimes be important (e.g., with WAGG or SOE), but they aren't always. Generally, that's only when

you have a pheromone in one product that reduces or masks the bad effects of a pheromone in another product. I doubt

that happens to any significant extent with the Chikara/NPA mix, so you should be able to play with the doses of

each product independently without worrying about what it might do to the product ratio.

[Bigman808]

Man, you seem know what

you're talking about, Jonathan. You also worded your posts very simply, so thanks for making it easy to understand.

Phillip-I'm going to try what bjf suggested as well, as I'm having a hard time finding a good mix. Jonathan, I

take it you use mones. If you don't mind me asking, which ones do you use? If you mix, what's it consist of and

what's the ratio? Thanks, bro