Does Chikara lead to more arguments!?

[Mungojerry]

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[Elvis]

OD'ing on the 'none in Chikara?

How much of the gel did you use?

SOE is 'nol only (I think) and 1 dab NPA not a huge amount, I wouldn't have

thought that mix would have been particularly aggresive, although 'nol turns to 'none later. However, if you're

really clarting on the Chikara, I suppose it's possible you could OD. The other 'mones in Chikara will eventually

break down into 'none and if you wait long enough things could get interesting. How long after application did you

start arguing? What is you shower/bath regime.

[Mungojerry]

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[DeMoKiLL]

Im was in class one day and

this guy was like trying to get in a fight with me or whatever, I used like too much chikara, 3-4 sprays. I used SOE

lots, and 1 spray of perception, the next day he was very nice like a totally different person.

[bjf]

Here's the thing: Chikara is

only sold as a men's product not women's. I am not sure if that is simply because of the small amount of

none (TE/w, NPA/w and AE/w has it to though) or rone (SOE/unscented has this and is unisex and AE/w is female) in it

or whether it is because of the nature of one or some of the four undisclosed pheromones in there.

Perhaps

the nature is very masculine. The effects of chikara seem to be more on the social than sexual side, which always

made it surprising that it would not be marketed for women, but Bruce has said that this is definitely for men. He

is not going to lose revenue to female customers if it weren't the case, right? So there's perhaps something very

masculine in there.

I'd think something masculine would increase the sexualness of the product. Perhaps, or

perhaps not. Most masculine mones though would probably lead to arguing in large quantities.

[tiberius]

I have been wearing up to an

entire gel pack of Chikara without any negative responses (do have positive ones though).

[Mungojerry]

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[tiberius]

Thats the only bad thing about

chikara...not knowing what the unknowns are, how they work, and what ratios all the pheromones are in kind of makes

it hard to pin down an answer as to why some people get the results they do.

[j5fakt0r]

I don't think I've ever been

in a situation where mones have put me into any aggressive situations. I can see if you had lots of -none people

might be more intimidated and such, but considering that it's only chikara I doubt it's due to "intimidation."

It's possible that it's making you appear to be a "push over," and everybody could think they'd get their way

with you.

[Friendly1]

Seems several of you young guys

are getting a bit edgy with these products. I feel very comfortable when I wear the Beta Chikara spray. But there

is a sort of "I HAVE THE POWER" feeling in the background. Some nights, it's a real debate over whether I should

use Chikara or one of my other, regular combos.

[DrSmellThis]

SOE is Nol

and Rone, when I add the NPA there's some None in their too.

Anyway, even half a packet of Chikara

leads to the same effect, so I don't think its an od... especially seeing as the arguementative effects seem to

start within the first couple of hours after application and go on until the next morning.

However, i guess

it still could be a None OD, I am young (22) and therefore may produce quite a lot of none anyway, the extra in

Chikara may just push me over the edge. Hmmm

Also, i've been wondering whether the None could be affecting me

rather than the other people around me.All I do is dab from the CK gel packs. Half a pack seems like a

lot.

[Gegogi]

Actually, I'm afraid it's you

and your friend's behavior that caused the arguments, not Chikara. Hell, I can get into a blazing argument without

or without 'mones, depending on my choice of words and/or topic. It's easy to be an ass or be confrontational, and

friends always know which buttons to press to piss you off. It takes more maturity, control and tact to keep the

peace. All 'mones do is enhance your choice of words, intonation and body language.

[Elvis]

Actually, I'm

afraid it's you and your friend's behavior that caused the arguments...All 'mones do is enhance your choice of

words, intonation and body language.
I agree. However, I think the extent of this influence is at worst

unrecognised and at best underestimated. The night I swabbed on the entire gel pack of TE, I was like a werewolf (ok

it's an OD app, but it shows a point), snapping at the heels of everyone I spoke to. I barely knew myself and it

was actually frightening to feel myself act this way, as if I was possessed by some unseen entity.

[belgareth]

You are one who is very

susceptable to none. You need to be aware of that and regulate yourself just like the person who can't hold

alcohol. Use less none and you won't have that problem.

[Friendly1]

I think you could probably get

the men in your office to adapt to your increased levels of pheromones with regular usage. I did, actually, go

through something similar at work when I started using pheromones. I did my best to stay out of the way of the

dominant men in the company (but then, I was also a high status employee -- there were only three men who stood

above me in the hierarchy).

The commuter public is a different story. But you might want to give it some

thought before abandoning the products altogether. You are basically changing your social status with a spray of

the bottle or a wipe of the gel. Dominant men may indeed feel threatened for a while until they adjust to the

changes in their own body chemistries.

[Tiger4]

Anyway,

after reading a few posts on here I was persuaded to buy some Chikara gel packs. However... the result has not been

good. Everytime I seem to wear it I get into blazing arguements with my friends, whether they are female or male.



Has anyone else found this?

Yes, I've found myself getting pissed off and agitated more easily when

wearing Chikara except when I'm talking to women, then I tend to be very mellow. Not only that but it tends to

make me more impatient as well. This is why I can't figure out why people would bother to wear Chikara in addition

to NPA or any other strong none product.

[Friendly1]

Yes, I've found

myself getting pissed off and agitated more easily when wearing Chikara except when I'm talking to women, then I

tend to be very mellow. Not only that but it tends to make me more impatient as well. This is why I can't figure

out why people would bother to wear Chikara in addition to NPA or any other strong none product.
It may be

age-related. I am 45 and just don't get these kinds of feelings when I mix Chikara with The Edge. Guys my age

don't produce as much Androstenone as guys half our age.

[Watcher]

Chikara im finding up to 1/5 a gel

pack at once - any more than that and responses both female and male range from aggressive to sexual to permissive

to submissive

Dunno its a weird one - at he current time ive settled on a 2-4 spray perception and 1/5 of gel

pack of chikara over the last few weeks with 1/5 pack of SOE unscented or scented as well for social

occasions.

The edge gel packs ive restricted to home usage to wake myself up ie study and late nights in

front of the stockmarket trading screen.

[Gegogi]

Friendly comments, "It may

be age-related. I am 45 and just don't get these kinds of feelings when I mix Chikara with The Edge. Guys my age

don't produce as much Androstenone as guys half our age."

Hmm, I can spray Chikara 6-8 times, 4-5

dabs of TE and a few large strokes pf SOE and feel like Mr. Mellow Yellow at work. I never get agitated and it's

extremely rare for anyone to get huffy with me (except occasionally my ex-wife ot girlfriends). I'm 50 so that

might have something to do with it. Of course, it was about the same when I was 20 and had never used 'mones.

People have told me for years they feel relaxed just looking at me (not sure that's a compliment).

[ismellgood]

I have found that using

Chikara makes people nicer to me.

[Mungojerry]

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[Gegogi]

"I disagree with this. I

debate with people all the time but these rarely turn angry."

The key word here is "debate." I avoid

debates (and debate prone people) in social situatons as, 'mones or not, the outcomes are unpredictable and often

unpleasant and counterproductive socially. Professionally I must debate certain issues and some people never forgive

you no matter how elegant your delivery. Blaming Chikara for a debate gone sour is like blaming Jack Daniels for a

car accident or bar fight. You ultimately made the choice and participated...

[bjf]

If Chikara increases the likelihood

that he will get into arguments, regardless of whether it was ultimately responsible, it is interesting to know.

[surfs_up]

My brews normally have a high -none component at the level where they could be described as

intense. I notice that these turbo mixes require greater self awareness and higher social skill levels. Too much

-none CAN make you, or those around you buggy, sometimes tending to violent. Think prisons. I am aware that I am

projecting an intense vibe. It does get under my own skin and into my thinking, my identity as well. Something

animal is closer to the surface. I can get into these head spaces and notice that women are reacting to me purely

from body language, I am giving off a presence or a basic energy. Women will be checking me out with that knowing,

horny, need to get fucked in the worst way eye contact. I needed to go someplace in a hurry and a movie production

crew, must have been important talent with all the paperazzi buzzing around was blocking my path, I utterly didn't

give a shit for their presumed authority or pompous tinsletown bullshit and I walked right through their gaulntlet

calling them a bunch of assholes for taking over the street. Here this behavior was appropriate. They actually

cleared out of my way too, must have assumed it was my production. Now, this is the WRONG behavior in a Biker Bar,

as you WILL wake up dead. So I must learn to work with the big cat energy within with my rank cheetah piss sweat. I

get to the airport, they put me through a ludicrous security routine, I comply with all instructions but I am

laughing at the inspector, not directly AT his ego, but at the absurdity of all the bad theatre of it all, then I go

to pick up my boarding pass and they have screwed it up badly, total incompetence, the customer service woman is

both 1, so turned on she about to come in her double knit polyester blue airport costume probably so much that she

had to run and change a pantyliner 2, getting massively irritated with me simulatneously, while 3, I'm fully

keeping my cool and not letting any anger show, while 4, they get me straightened out and on a better flight, and 5,

she's sooo sweet to me as I leave... I got on the plane and the stewardesses are dancing around like I must be a

famous somebody that can't quite place but they have on the o-migod its a celebrity over the top stuff.... I'm

plain exhausted and want nothing more to crawl into my bed with my teddy bear and a warm glass of milk and swear up

and down I will dilute the stuff next time and up the ratio of the -nols (alpha and beta).... too much of a good

thing can be overwhelming

[Mungojerry]

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[tiberius]

I still have to disagree. I

tend to be an argumentative person sometimes and end up in passionate debates (usually over silly things), but

Chikara has never seemed to cause arguments.

The biggest effect I have notice on my person when wearing

chikara is I feel like it is easier for me to concentrate...or in other words I feel more aware/focused. I also feel

more confident like I could rule the world as well. Combine those 2 feelings and makes for a great time. I would

love to know what gives those feelings but it really is quite engerizing almost a testosterone espresso with a

couple shots of ginseng and ginko bilboa. :)

[Gegogi]

I don't doult the enhancing

effects of 'mones. I just think that one's personal disciple and control can override any influence of 'mones.

[Fatal]

My brews normally

have a high -none component at the level where they could be described as intense. I notice that these turbo mixes

require greater self awareness and higher social skill levels. Too much -none CAN make you, or those around you

buggy, sometimes tending to violent. Think prisons. I am aware that I am projecting an intense vibe. It does get

under my own skin and into my thinking, my identity as well. Something animal is closer to the surface. I can get

into these head spaces and notice that women are reacting to me purely from body language, I am giving off a

presence or a basic energy. Women will be checking me out with that knowing, horny, need to get fucked in the worst

way eye contact. I needed to go someplace in a hurry and a movie production crew, must have been important talent

with all the paperazzi buzzing around was blocking my path, I utterly didn't give a shit for their presumed

authority or pompous tinsletown bullshit and I walked right through their gaulntlet calling them a bunch of assholes

for taking over the street. Here this behavior was appropriate. They actually cleared out of my way too, must have

assumed it was my production. Now, this is the WRONG behavior in a Biker Bar, as you WILL wake up dead. So I must

learn to work with the big cat energy within with my rank cheetah piss sweat. I get to the airport, they put me

through a ludicrous security routine, I comply with all instructions but I am laughing at the inspector, not

directly AT his ego, but at the absurdity of all the bad theatre of it all, then I go to pick up my boarding pass

and they have screwed it up badly, total incompetence, the customer service woman is both 1, so turned on she about

to come in her double knit polyester blue airport costume probably so much that she had to run and change a

pantyliner 2, getting massively irritated with me simulatneously, while 3, I'm fully keeping my cool and not

letting any anger show, while 4, they get me straightened out and on a better flight, and 5, she's sooo sweet to me

as I leave... I got on the plane and the stewardesses are dancing around like I must be a famous somebody that

can't quite place but they have on the o-migod its a celebrity over the top stuff.... I'm plain exhausted and want

nothing more to crawl into my bed with my teddy bear and a warm glass of milk and swear up and down I will dilute

the stuff next time and up the ratio of the -nols (alpha and beta).... too much of a good thing can be

overwhelming


Can you tell us what you were wearing on those occasions? :think:

[MOBLEYC57]

Can you tell us

what you were wearing on those occasions? :think:
I'd like to know too! :box: Sounds like something that

will work while I'm bouncing on Saturday nights. My bosses said to my last night, that since I've been working

there, the fights have decreased lots ... no talk of a pay increase though. :rant: A mix like that would probably

have me starting the fights and get fired!

[cuddlebear]

I have not noticed anything in

the way of arguments wearing either Chikara or Chikara gel pack ... not more or less likelihood of an argument ...

actually I think it's because I'm just too cuddly to argue with :p

[Mungojerry]

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[Mungojerry]

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[Gegogi]

"This is one of the same

friends who was snappier and slightly less friendly when I wore larger doses of before. It seems the dosage may well

have been the problem."

Or he was just feeling bitchy that day. Maybe he was under stress, didn't

get laid for a month, didn't sleep well the prior night, etc. I know everyone is different, but I can basically

swim in Chikara and NPA and people are mellow and friendly. I'd have to work really hard to lure them into a

serious argument. :blink:

[ismellgood]

It seems that Mungojerry's

problem was simple OD.
I always had nice results with small doses of Chikara.
As they say in Toxicology, "the

dose makes the poison".

[Mungojerry]

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[Friendly1]

On the past

two times where I have reduced the dosage considerably nothing negative has occurred... actually I seem to be

getting more respect. However, I'm far less sure about these conclusions because I’ve only worn this lower dosage

twice so far.
But that is the right thing to do. Just keep experimenting with doses. Your own body

chemistry plays a part in the process.

[Mungojerry]

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[Visionary7903]

Firstly I would like to

say, as my signature says, I am a bit of a lone wolf in some ways.

For me Chikara can cause slight problems with

fellow staff members at my work. A few of the older women (in their 60s) who I work with seem to be uncomfortable

with me when I wear two sprays of the chrome-capped latest version of Chikara. Usually I get on very well with them

but sometimes when I wear this product they act as if Im playing up and have an attitude whereas Im just acting as I

normally do. Also one of my ex-bosses (an older guy who was more a beta than an alpha) seemed to be very serious

around me whenever I wear this alone as do other staff members. They lighten up more when I put SOE/m on as well as

the Chikara.

Other than that though Chikara seems to be a very balanced formulation for me at work. I get plenty

of respect and feel confidence. Chikara and SOE/m would probably be a good mix for me at work permanently for the

reasons above. However I feel that any 'freshly-applied' A-none on me just causes too much trouble than it is

worth.

For me I am at the stage where Ive kind of given up on 'freshly applied' none applications at work. My

idea is to apply None at higher dosages many hours beforehand to minimize on the negative reactions and maximise on

the positive ones (see my thread 'day-after-hits'). Another idea is to try a mix I used with decent results last

year of NPA/w: WAGG 1:1 with decent results including some sexual hits. Search the forum under the names of

Pretorius and Frenchie who first started the mix.

[obie]

I have tried anywhere from 1-5

sprays of Chikara and not noticed any reactions at all. Will try it on vacation after the New Year.

[bjf]

Visionary:

I was going to

comment on this before, seems lie the none in chikara is likely what is causing the arguments. A little bit of none

on you makes a big difference. A lot of the clint eastwood guys say this. I was wondering if it was the none or

perhaps some other masculine pheromone in chikara (there are three unknown mones in there that we have no clue the

nature of, but 1 or 2 would have to be socially/trusting oriented, given the general effect chikara creates when

used by most consumers).

[Gegogi]

Wouldn't adding NPA or TE make

the "lone wolf effect" stronger?

[Visionary7903]

Hi Have_Courage I am 25

and slightly thin. Yeah i mean I definitely dont produce too much none according to my natural mone signature -

before my mone days and whenever I am not wearing mones people never notice when they cant see me but I am getting

close to them. I notice with Anone applications that people often if not always notice me getting close to their

personal space. Plus I dont naturally command great respect as someone with an Anone heavy natural signature does

nor do I ever intimidate people greatly.

I think the problem lies with my facial expression. I am dark haired and

have a permanently serious/intense look on my face. I notice when I smile a lot at people the lone wolf thing goes

away almost as quickly as if i were wearing WAGG - people initiate conversations, arent comfortable around me etc.

If we smile at people with our teeth out Im sure it would help the effect although it would never go away I think.

However I cant always be in a great mood to do this.

The other major problem I have is that I have a hard time

with social skills and interest in talking with people I may have nothing in common with (ie. girls my age) however

I am improving in this immensely through the use of supplements and learning. Anyway in the past Ive been hanging

out with guys too often I feel to the detriment of understanding women.

Thanks for the Chikara:WAGG mix sounds

very interesting as Ive yet to experience the great 'social' effects of Chikara yet. However I still want to get

sexual hits permanently so this may not be my ideal mix. Wow here's an idea maybe u could try adding NPA/w to that

mix and see what happens (Chikara:WAGG:NPA/w 1:1:1)! U would not be overdosing on the None then but benefiting from

the LaCroy secret ingredients. I may try this myself as I have all the products at the moment.

Nobody really

seems to understand what NPA/w does by itself (perhaps enhances men's moods, possibly attracts men), and I dont

know exactly what it does to women. Anyway with WAGG it seemed to do something interesting in bringing the WAGG away

from just being a non-sexual trust based pheromone product into a more sexual product retaining all the

trust/approachability benefits of WAGG.

Finally, I will never try NPA/m at work again even with WAGG. U cant be

sure the other person is getting the dose of WAGG with the NPA/m all the time as Ive found out - I have probably

made two enemies at work from wearing it a few times... We had arguments at the time and although things are better

now the trust is just not there - we are not relaxed around each other etc.

Visionary

[eric_pelletier_tw]

ok i didnt read the

entire tread :P but here is my take on aggressive behaviour &mones
i read lots of post & lots of OD things are

indeed agressive reactions 1/2 pack is way too much at a time from my stand point ... id say lower doses ... i

started at 1/16 pack of TE im now at 1/4 ?starting to see reactions?

ok too small but here is what i think if

you have the none quantity of an alpha just not behaviour then its better to be cautious.note that in the wild two

alpha males get kinda rude to each other & the town gets too small for the two of them :they must fight ! :) ok

sounds like a western but here ya go :2 alpha togetter & you got arguments,fights & stuff.Btw 80 to 90 % of what you

say is without spoken words!! So you may not have talked to anybody but you may have said more than you whant !

[lordcrazyd]

It has been said that the

none in chikara is very minimal, its almost to the point where you can say its just a touch of none to it. I don't

believe the none in it is to the effect you guys make it out to be. Just remember that nol converts to none with

time so that my have alot todo with it also :frustrate

[ismellgood]

I never use more than 1 spray

of Chikara, and sometimes use only a half spray (but I suspect that my endogenous pheromone production is high).