another new guy

[CameraGuy]

Hi all. I have been

reading this forum for a while now trying to pick the perfect combination for my situation. before I place my order

I wanted to check with some of the experts here Oscar, BJF, Koolking any of you people that have mastered the art of

mones, please let me know what you think.

Here is my story. I am 21 years old and am considered rather good

looking. I have never had trouble getting women. I wouldn't really consider myself outgoing but I am not shy either

and have no trouble walking up to a beautiful girl and asking her out. I am currently living at home until I finish

school. I am 5' 11" with a medium build. I work out at least three times a week. As I said I have no trouble

getting women, with the exception of the one that I really really want. I have known this girl for years now. We are

very close but the problem is, she only seems to view me as her brother and best friend. It is driving me crazy.

Right now I am thinking about trying NPA and Chikara. I must get her out of the friend zone and into my heart and

bed. lol

What do you experts think of my choices?

[CameraGuy]

Come on guys. I really want to

place an order but I am waiting to hear back from some of you experts.

[cuddlebear]

OK, at the risk of

misrepresenting myself as an "expert" :p here goes ...

Chikara/NPA is fast becoming a popular combo so

that's probably a good choice ... I usually recommend SOE or a NOL product for newcomers to the forum, but if

you're trying to get out of LJBF land, maybe it is time for a product with some none in it ... AE has a loyal

following but Chikara right now is the top seller ... both of those contain none ...

OK, you're already

considering Chikara/NPA, why not go with that? :)

Hope that helped, if only to confirm your hunch :)



Cuddles

[CameraGuy]

Thanks Cuddley. I consider you

an expert too. I have read some kick ass stories from you! Thanks for your help. I am going to get the NPA and

Chikara.

[CameraGuy]

I wish I had ordered this

already. I see this girl every single day and I have got to change the way she views me. I hope these mones do the

trick.

[Friendly1]

You cannot change her. But you

can change yourself. The Chikara/NPA will help her perceive a difference about you, but you will need to make it

real. Otherwise, you'll just be wasting your time/money.

Think about what kind of man she wants, and whether

you want to be that kind of man. Then decide whether you are ready to make the change in yourself.

I won't say

you have only one shot at this, but if you're going to take the shot, then take the best shot you can.

[jub]

Hello guys

I am another

''Johnny Just come'', when it comes to mones. I am thinking of purchasing Primal Instinct as me

first go, since I'm sort of a lone fox. Can any one give me some gist about it?

[cuddlebear]

To Jub: Primal Instinct is a

good "sexual" None product, but if you are a "lone fox", it might scare some women off ... You might want to start

with Scent of Eros/m or unscented ... If you're interested in trying PI, then certainly do so, but you might want

to use it with SOE in a mix like KR#1 which is 7 parts SOE to 3 parts PI.

I recommended something with None

in it for CameraGuy because he is already friendly and wants to get closure, but if you tend to be a loner, you

might want to reel them in first, SOE seems to be better for that :)

[oscar]

CameraGuy,

Your choices seem

fine. In my opinion it would be presumptuous to say that any particular phero product was more likely than any other

to crack a specific case of LJBF, but as a good overall multi-purpose phero, Chikara would be a good starting point,

and eventually supplementing with NPA sounds good too.

Start out with just the Chikara as a stand-alone for a

while and then work in some NPA in very small quantities at first, then add just a bit more on each subsequent

occassion until you can decide whether or not it's getting you anywhere.

Pheromones are just one way of

attempting to overcome the LJBF scenario. A number of good suggestions that include behavioral methods of breaking

through the LJBF barrier as well as specific phero applications have been posted on these forums over the years. If

you do a search for "LJBF" you'll find quite a few. By attempting to implement several variations and combinations

of the methods that have worked for others you may find the key to your own success. You may not. You've chosen a

tough row to hoe. Be determined. Be persistant. But know when to quit.

There are people who've spent years

trying unsuccessfully to overcome the "friends barrier" because the "chemistry" just wasn't there. That's one of

the reasons that pheromones appear to hold out hope to those in this situation. The chemistry of relationships is

precisely what we're trying to manipulate by utilizing these chemicals. There's just no guarantee that the altered

chemistry is going to be the right one to achieve the desired results.
It's a crapshoot, but it's worth rolling

the dice. ;)

Oscar :)

[bjf]

Hello guys

I am

another ''Johnny Just come'', when it comes to mones. I am thinking of purchasing Primal Instinct

as me first go, since I'm sort of a lone fox. Can any one give me some gist about it?

If you are a

lone fox, primal instinct is that last thing you need.

Try chikara, soe, wagg or a little bit of

edge.

There is a search feature...go into an advanced search and change one of the options to display as

"posts" not "threads" (please change the default bruce). Then put in the names of the products and read up about

them.

[bjf]

Chamera guy, oscar's recommendation

of chikara with a small amount of npa is one I would echo.

[Friendly1]

Friendly1,

thanks for the advice, but if you don't mind I would rather listen to the people that do really well with the

women. I don't go for all of that body language stuff that you are always talking about. But I do appreciate your

post.
Well, it was good of you to let me know I don't do really well with the women. I was wondering

what sort of success I might be havng.

Now I know.


This morning she walked by and gave me the

sweetest smile. She is so beautiful. I really hope these mones work for me.
Good luck, friend. You're

going to need it.

[Ismail]

Juding from

friendlys posts,i say he knows his stuff!!!!!If u dont read body language u are screwed!!!how will u tell if she is

interested or not???

I higly doubt that the pheros will help u a lot if u just sit there and smile.

Listen

to friendly not to the ones who say that pheros will do the work,belive me i tried Primal Instinct and it didnt do

shit!!!!And PI is supposed to be a powerfull phero product.



Friendly1, thanks for the

advice, but if you don't mind I would rather listen to the people that do really well with the women. I don't go

for all of that body language stuff that you are always talking about. But I do appreciate your post.





This morning she walked by and gave me the sweetest smile. She is so beautiful. I really hope these mones work for

me.

[Friendly1]

I don't think the other guys

are saying the pheromones will do the job. They are just answering the question without broadening the discussion.

I am the one who opens the door a little wider.

Frankly, I think most guys could improve their results with The

Edge and a good cover scent, but they won't necessarily get their best results. We keep telling everyone to

experiment and be patient.

But some guys keep asking for miracles. The only miracle we can promise, as a

community, is the one each of us shapes within himself. If what you have been doing hasn't worked, doing something

different has a better chance of working than continuing to do the same ineffective stuff.

That principle

applies in every aspect of life.

Those guys who don't want to change will NOT change and their results with

pheromones will be minimal at best.

[InternationalPlayboy]

But some guys keep asking for miracles.

I think this has a lot to do with the hype you see in

pheromone advertising in magazines and at other websites other than Love Scent. I've been aware of pheromone

products since the early 1980s. I also thought back then that just puting on pheromones would cause what I call the

"Hi Karate" effect - having to fight off the women after splashing on the mones. It wasn't until I started actively

participating in this forum that I learned that there is an art to pheromone use.


Friendly1 gives good

solid advice. Just because you paid $50 or more for a bottle of pheromones, that doesn't mean women are going to

lift their skirts at one whiff of you. There is a lot more involved. You may have come up with the ultimate combo in

the world, but the target woman may attribute the attraction to the guy standing right next to you who more closely

fits her ideals.

Truthfully, I was kind of put off by CameraGuy's dismissal of Friendly1's suggestions. I

think he gave completely valid advice.

[jub]

Thanks! I did do a search and read

up on each one of them but since they are so many. Well for a first timer you know its good to find out what the

more experience recommend based on their usage. l'll just lay off Primal for a while and try of the ones you

suggested

[camusflage]

I don't go

for all of that body language stuff that you are always talking about.
In a nutshell, you

should.

Around here, you see folks from time to time who say nothing they're using is working for them,

whether it's because they're using too much, not enough, they can't approach / be approachable, they're looking

for a miracle, they're one of the folks for whom mones do nothing or whatever, who knows. I can say this though. I

have the firm conviction that they are working, it's just that the wearer doesn't know how to pick up on it, nine

times out of ten.

Like someone else said, the juice won't make women throw themselves at you. It will make

them more receptive to you and more likely to approach you, if you're approachable. If you don't understand body

language, you might as well give it up now. It's far too ingrained in our nature to be anything but critical to the

process of attraction. Just like pheros, we're slaves to our more primal side there too.

If you don't

understand body language, you won't get the subtle signs that a woman is attracted to you. Whether it's the quick

glance over an up-raised shoulder or the shoe dangling from one foot, these are both VERY strong signals in and of

themselves. If you think all women who are attracted to you will throw themselves at your feet hoping you will deign

to show some attention to them, you've got another thing coming.

[Numanoid]

Originally Posted by

CameraGuy
Friendly1, thanks for the advice, but if you don't mind I would rather listen to the people

that do really well with the women. I don't go for all of that body language stuff that you are always talking

about. But I do appreciate your post.


Everyone telegraphs what they think

and feel unless they've been trained not to. There are several books available on the subject. You might want to

check some out.

[Pancho1188]

Everyone telegraphs what they think and feel unless they've been trained

not to. There are several books available on the subject. You might want to check some

out.
I partially disagree with this statement. Introverts specifically do not express

themselves through body language as much as extroverts. I am frequently asked what I think about something because

people can't tell. I remember the other week when I was watching a street magician perform tricks, and he

continually made jokes about how I was 'unimpressed' because I made no facial expressions whatsoever. On the

contrary, I was very impressed and would have liked to know how he did it like everyone else. He was a very

talented man, yet he had no clue that I thought this because my expression was completely blank. Introverts process

information differently internally and therefore do not use as much external feedback cues. However, this strange

absence of body language cues disappears in many situations when an introvert feels comfortable (or very

uncomfortable such as embarrassment or anger) and is interacting a lot with someone else.

Other than this and

maybe some other exceptions that I may not be aware of, I would agree that people do give off signals.

[Friendly1]

I partially

disagree with this statement. Introverts specifically do not express themselves through body language as much as

extroverts.
Yes they do. Their body language is normally closed, and that is why people cannot tell what

they are thinking or feeling.

The body language an introvert speaks is very different from the body language an

extrovert speaks.

Most people who read body language are better at reading extroverts, who project their

feelings, than at reading introverts.

I know that trained counselors/psychologists can read introverts far

better than the introverts believe.

[Pancho1188]

Yes they do.

Their body language is normally closed, and that is why people cannot tell what they are thinking or feeling.



The body language an introvert speaks is very different from the body language an extrovert speaks.

Most

people who read body language are better at reading extroverts, who project their feelings, than at reading

introverts.

I know that trained counselors/psychologists can read introverts far better than the introverts

believe.
That's what I just said. I must not have been expressing myself appropriately. :lol:



Seriously, though...when I'm thinking, people have no idea what is going on in my head. I've gotten the

following comments for no reason at all:

"Are you bored?"
"Are you tired?"
"What's wrong?"
"Do you want to

leave?"

In fact, I think I've been scarred as a child because everyone asks me what's wrong.

The main

reason I probably don't get the hits I would with strangers using -mones is that I don't express emotion. I've

seen a lot of girls that probably think I'm attractive, but I have such an emotionless expression when I'm by

myself on the bus or walking around that they probably think I'm not interested. I guess the continuous checking

out isn't enough to show interest unless you do that whole body language thing...bastards.

It's a curse,

really.

(Before I start getting advice, I'm just stating observations to argue for a lesser-known type of body

language.)

[Pancho1188]

As for the original point of

this thread, I would like to comment that you have a solid combo with Chikara and NPA, but I'd watch for a -none OD

on that. (I might actually be speaking for Bel on that one) Anyway, I'd recommend trying Chikara by itself first to

test your -none tolerance with that product and trying AE if your current products do not work because that is a

good product to push the envelope on a friends->more than friends transition. Since you're already there, you just

need a push to get her thoughts toward seeing you as a sexual being, a protector, a provider, etc...whatever she

wants to see in a man she is attracted to. My only warning is not to come off too strong with the -none because

"brother" to "sex hound" probably isn't an easy or plausible transition...but just enough to twist her perception

of you is what would be best for that situation.




...or you could pour it on and hope that your animal

lure in combination with an extreme bout of horniness on her part will just make her take what's immediately

available. :lol:

[Friendly1]

Facial expressions are only a

small part of body language. If the street performer you mentioned was really just focusing on your face, then he

or she wasn't very good at reading body language. But I think it more likely the entertainer was just trying to

interpret your closed language.

No one can actually read your thoughts through your body language, of course.

Some people make shrewd guesses, but our body language normally reveals something about our state of mind. A closed

of state of mind is less likely to project feelings. An open state of mind is more likely to project feelings.



People often misread my mood. I often misread other people. The more closed you are, the more difficult it is

for people to read you, but that doesn't mean you are NOT communicating. You're just speaking a different

language.

Of course, the good thing about body language is that you can take control over your own body

language. Try it. Force yourself into some open gestures the next time you get into a conversation with someone.

Consciously remind yourself of how you are feeling, and if you are not feeling excited or interested, try posing a

little. ACT excited and interested.

Experiment. Let us know what happens.

I occasionally take control over

my body language and it does sometimes make a difference.

[camusflage]

I guess the

continuous checking out isn't enough to show interest unless you do that whole body language thing...bastards.



It's a curse, really.
Actually, it's not.. It's a blessing. Once you learn about it and <gasp>

practice showing what you want, it's a lot easier to inject a few gestures into closed body language to "say" what

you want to than it is to alter already expressive body language to change the message.

Think about it like a

foreign language. French and Romanian share many similar words, but it's just a little bit different. This is the

same way that introverts and extroverts differ in how they communicate. iNT's focus on the message and the

delivery, eSF's on the meaning behind the words, eNF's on the feelings inspired by the words, etc. Even between

the genders there are communication differences.

Once you know how to read a bit of body language in others,

you can begin using that knowledge to change what you yourself express. As a total introvert, I can safely say

making a few subtle gestures during critical times has gone great distances in modifying others' perception of me

as someone who is warn and open.