View Full Version : pheromone addiction/dependency issues...
handtohandking
05-11-2004, 06:27 AM
I\'ve been viewing the topics in this forum, did my lil\' research on mones, and have come up with
a few issues. I\'m not tryin\' to criticize or anything, I just want to know your take on this...
1) I\'ve
noticed a HUGE range of results for mones: either (supposedly) very noticeable and even outrageously positive
responses...and then completely non-existent responses. Now, what EXACTLY does that mean? Is it because of the
individual\'s personal body chemistry, incorrect usage, or is it the person themself?
2) I believe a VERY
unhealthy dependence on pheromone usage is possible, especially for individuals who are desperate for a quick fix.
Now I know that these substances aren\'t SUPPOSED to be a quick fix and its been said before, but regardless there
are going to be many people who will use it as such. I\'ve seen posts (and no offense if it applies) of how
certain individuals have seen no results, plan on buying massive amounts of mones to test them all, spend all their
spare money on it, try extreme ways to increase their own natural pheromones, and in essence, becoming mentally
addicted and dependent on mones. I believe all these \"success\" stories on here are misleading a casual user and
making them expect women to lay down at their feet, when it\'s more than just chemicals. Yes, they may help, but
it\'s YOU.
3) Yes, the ethical question of mones in general has been brought up before. BUT...here\'s my take
on it. Why would you want to be with a female who is LITERALLY \"physically\" attracted to you and not physically,
mentally, and emotionally attracted to you? If these mones supposedly work like magic, these females will be
attracted to the MONES, not YOU. And what happens if you stop using them for some reason? Will insecurity and mental
dependency on mones affect you? If you\'re all about sleeping with as many women as possible, then I see you
wouldn\'t have a problem. And I know I will get responses about how it\'s only meant to enhance what you already
have, but so is plastic surgery...
Once again, no offense to anyone, just trying to bring up some issues which I
see. I\'m even thinking about experimenting with mones, I don\'t know, but I wanna know your opinions on the
above three points.
koolking1
05-11-2004, 07:10 AM
my take is:
1. You get differing responses for all the reasons you mentioned and another one which
is that a few people have a better sense of smell and they are more affected by mones. a person with an exceptional
sense of smell may provide and exceptional response!!!
2. Yes, people might become too dependent on them and
spend too much money (especially the younger guys who are really longing for some female company without much
success). If one is wearing mones and is grossly out of shape though, they stand little chance of the mones being
the answer. It does take more to meet and keep a love interest. Success stories, hmmm, if I read a book on how to
make/save more money have I been mislead - I don\'t think so. People want to know what they are buying and by
reading this forum they are learning about the products that Bruce has for sale. They learn the good and the bad,
nothing is hidden - I call that an exceptionally honest business practice.
3. I see nothing wrong with
\"gaining an edge\" in one\'s endeavors to either meet people or perhaps prevail in a business situation. No
one would criticize a woman for wearing perfume, would they? - or working out, aren\'t those also \"edges\" in
our quest for affection and acceptance?
Holmes
05-11-2004, 07:41 AM
</font><blockquote><font class=\"small\">Quote:</font><hr />
I call that an exceptionally honest
business practice.
<hr /></blockquote><font class=\"post\">
Me too.
Holmes
Holmes
05-11-2004, 07:43 AM
Good posts, btw.
Holmes
ironration
05-11-2004, 07:47 AM
1)
We do not know.
2)
True. If you cannot attract females without pheromone products the products
does not really help.
3)The effect is not that powerfull that you will become dependent on them. At the very
best is just a slight edge.
From a moral stanpoint: Why is wearing makeup, or good looking clothes or being
friendly any better. It is all things that you use in order to get what you want.
handtohandking
05-11-2004, 09:22 AM
Thanks for the responses...
On the last point I made:
Perfume, working out, wearing nice clothes,
being friendly, are only PRESENTING yourself better on the outside. They all do bring some sort of biochemical
reactions on a real technical level with varying degrees, but when something purely physical (contact) compels a
person to react differently because of physiological manipulation, it doesn\'t seem like just an \"edge\". Once
again, I\'m not tryin\' to talk bad about pheromone usage, because I am interested, but I live by certain ideals
and it\'s conflicting...
I would like to clear up that I\'m not insinuating whatsoever that this site is some
sort of scam or deceptive, I\'m just sayin\' some of these success stories can alter a casual reader\'s
expectations of mones.
ToBeOrNotToBe
05-11-2004, 09:34 AM
In my humble opinion, the use of pheromones is no more than, for example, working out, dressing with
style or wearing a nice cologne. What is the purpose of using pheromones? Make ourselves more attractive, nothing
more. They won\'t put the ladies at our feet... they just make us more interesting, just like a good cologne
does.
I mean, for example, I am pretty sure that my muscle built body (without mones) achieves more than the use
of mones without the muscle built body (well, like I was before starting to work out). Well, this \"muscle built
body\" only exists cause I work \"hard\" at the gym, if I stopped doing that, I would slowly loose these
\"bigger than average\" muscles. So, it\'s the same as wearing mones and then stopping to wear them... you were
more attractive when you were using them, but when you stopped, you lost that advantage. It\'s exactly the same,
you stop working out and you\'ll also loose that advantage.
I hope you understand what I want to say...
English is not my native language...
Anyway, using pheromones is definitely not cheating!
/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/tongue.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smirk.gif
Elana
05-11-2004, 09:37 AM
</font><blockquote><font class=\"small\">Quote:</font><hr />
if I stopped doing that, I would
slowly loose these \"bigger than average\" muscles.
<hr /></blockquote><font class=\"post\">
Don\'t
ever stop!
handtohandking
05-11-2004, 10:04 AM
You see, there\'s a difference...
Working out, in the most general sense, is making your body
appear more attractive. YOU WORK FOR IT. You go the gym or train in your home, stay committed and sweat. Also you
probably change your diet to suit your needs and make sacrifices and take time out of your day. Even more material
things like cologne and clothes: clothes make the man, plain and simple, it shows you got style and take pride of
your appearance and that you\'re clean and have money to buy these clothes. Cologne, which is basically the
closest things you can get to mones because of this olfactory element, is NOT the same as using mones. Using cologne
is smelling nice, knowing what females want, your choice and ur knowledge of the brands and $$$ value, and again,
just making yourself presentable.
On the other hands, pheromones are chemicals made specifically to attract the
opposite sex...and that\'s it. No thought put into it other than \"This will MAKE them love me!\" and ingenuine
in a sense. A woman who comes up to and compliments you on how you work out and take care of your body, on your
smile, your humor, your fashion sense, or your new cologne is NOT the same as some random chick lookin\' your way
because your love potion is messin\' with her brain...
ironration
05-11-2004, 10:26 AM
I do not see your point. Mones on a man does not mess with a womens brain anymore then tight clothes
on a women messes with a mans brain.
They are just tactics used with the hope of increasing attraction. And no,
there is no mone that will make a women love you, it does not work that way.
ToBeOrNotToBe
05-11-2004, 10:36 AM
</font><blockquote><font class=\"small\">Quote:</font><hr />
I do not see your point. Mones on a man
does not mess with a womens brain anymore then tight clothes on a women messes with a mans brain.
They are just
tactics used with the hope of increasing attraction. And no, there is no mone that will make a women love you, it
does not work that way.
<hr /></blockquote><font class=\"post\">
I agree! By the way, mones make ppl
notice more than usual that you have been working out, for example. It helps to \"promote\" some of your
qualities.
Holmes
05-11-2004, 10:39 AM
</font><blockquote><font class=\"small\">Quote:</font><hr />
I agree! By the way, mones make ppl
notice more than usual that you have been working out, for example. It helps to \"promote\" some of your
qualities.
<hr /></blockquote><font class=\"post\">
Exactly. They \"advertise\" what\'s already there.
But if there ain\'t nothin\' to advertise...
Holmes
CptKipling
05-11-2004, 10:42 AM
Just like women wearing push up bras, if there is nothing to advertise, you\'re stuffed.
Holmes
05-11-2004, 10:44 AM
</font><blockquote><font class=\"small\">Quote:</font><hr />
you\'re stuffed.
<hr
/></blockquote><font class=\"post\">
/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif
/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif
Holmes
handtohandking
05-11-2004, 10:46 AM
Seeing tight clothes on a woman is visual, mones is physiological.
Pancho1188
05-11-2004, 10:58 AM
The following is a dramatization:
Magically make men more attracted to you! Improve your
appearance and look better to all of the people around you! Make men notice you and women respect you! Get men to
fall at your feet and kiss the ground you walk on!!! Take years off of your appearance! Look sexy and stylish! Be
more attractive than you thought possible!
What is this magical product? Makeup
Did you notice how
you could easily interchange that with pheromones or many other \"attract-the-opposite-sex\"
products?
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Hav
e you ever slept with an attractive girl and woken up next to a goblin? It\'s called makeup. How\'s that any
different in trying to make yourself appear more attractive than you actually are?
The only difference is that
one is accepted and the other is almost taboo.
I won\'t go as far as to say it\'s proven because I,
personally, feel that women look better without makeup most of the time. All of my girlfriends hated makeup as much
as I did...and they were still the most beautiful girls to me.
If you didn\'t notice, I\'m not a fan of
makeup. Maybe it should be the same for me and pheromones...maybe women would prefer me without them...I don\'t
know. However, I use them because it seems to make the environment around me more sociable. Honestly, I haven\'t
felt any extra sexual attention from it...not that I would be able to tell sexual attention if someone smacked me in
the face with it...
tallmacky
05-11-2004, 11:13 AM
</font><blockquote><font class=\"small\">Quote:</font><hr />
Seeing tight clothes on a woman is
visual, mones is physiological.
<hr /></blockquote><font class=\"post\">
I think your mindset on the
issue is a bit off, and you have a more unrealistic view of pheromones and their \"power\".
/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif
How is a woman wearing tight clothes a visual effect? That
is impossible it is a physcological, it effects the minds of men. Men are hard wired to look at women and to
especailly take notice when they are revealing something. There is no such thing as a visual effect. When I,or just
about any guy here /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif takes a look at one of Elana\'s pictures, it
is exploiting us I have no choice in the erection I get, hey where is our CONTROL?
/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif A bit off tangent
The comment about women appreciating a
man\'s style. That\'s bullshit, mate. Its not about his style but his ability to have a style, to afford one.
This is a satisfying effect of wealth. Same goes for nice clothes. By the way how come \"the clothes get to be the
man, to make him\"? Did he make them, did he design them, no he just wore them, same goes for those who wear
-mones. The guy who buys a certain pricey car or a nice shirt knows the subconcious effect it will have on women.
Nature itself is set up in exploitation, if -mones themselves caused a morality issue it would have been a solid
argument but as of now it has always been a passive one.
Besides we live in a cruel world, the dating scene
today is harsh, and unforgiving, people themselves are hedonistic, and not the most adoring and nice creatures in
this world. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif Out of all this madness to worry about exploitation of
this degree is useless. It is a promotion tool as said above, besides if -mones were all that dangerous and powerful
don\'t you think ironation would have pussy packed up to his neck by now?....but NO!
/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif
phinmone
05-11-2004, 11:15 AM
</font><blockquote><font class=\"small\">Quote:</font><hr />
stuffed.
<hr /></blockquote><font
class=\"post\">
double ~ ? /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif
no, serious.
i don\'t see
why do we have to argue about this subject.
<font color=\"red\"> let\'s all be friends here! </font>
what does it harm, if people are more talkative or chatty around you?! i don\'t see any problem with
that, it\'s fun!
TopDawg2050
05-11-2004, 11:29 AM
Not only does it do all of the above, it helps me with my confidence too!!
/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/cool.gif
tallmacky
05-11-2004, 11:40 AM
Its too good to be true, you can\'t lay down $50 bucks and be changed, its supply and demand if this
was, things would be different, eh? The world seems to have strict order the \"just my luck\" philosophy. Things
never work out like that the rules of life do not allow pheromones to turn your frown upside down, Maybe they can
give you a sort of sh*t-faced grin, but there are no miracles in life.
/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif
Unknownshadown20
05-11-2004, 11:47 AM
I can almost guarantee right now that if we had more proof supporting \"mones\" and if it
meant that every women that use them would get far more attention. They would purchase them in a heart beat, are
saying they won\'t? Even if it was consider cheating like you might think, the universe doesn\'t care.
Sexyredhead
05-11-2004, 11:59 AM
</font><blockquote><font class=\"small\">Quote:</font><hr />
I can almost guarantee right now that
if we had more proof supporting \"mones\" and if it meant that every women that use them would get far more
attention. They would purchase them in a heart beat, are saying they won\'t? Even if it was consider cheating like
you might think, the universe doesn\'t care.
<hr /></blockquote><font class=\"post\">
You could say the
same thing about Angel perfume--for men or women. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/tongue.gif
jvkohl
05-11-2004, 07:33 PM
Friends from the Ludwig Bolzman Institute in Vienna have detailed many aspects of sex differences in
courtship. Anyone who can read German, might do well to read their book chapter.
Grammer, K., Jutte, A., &
Fischmann, B. (1996) The battle of the sexes and the war of the signals. In: Sexuality in the Mirror of Science:
University Edition. Hirzel: Stuttgart.
Excerpt: Translation by John Kohl
Human males who are exposed to female
\"copulins\" (15 minutes) appear to exhibit an increase in testosterone that lasts about 40 minutes. Less
attractive females appear more attractive and compare favorably with copulin presence. \"The mechanism seems to be
some chemical warefare induced by females which induces male sexual responsiveness or male competition and equals
out male attractiveness perception.\"
----------------------------------------------------------
Simply put,
women and men will use whatever means becomes available (and cost effective) to enhance their ability to attract the
opposite sex. Pheromones are just another means to an end. Personally, I\'m glad to take advantage of a rather
inexpensive (less costly than an Armani suit) way to help ensure availability of women who are above average. They
also are happy to take advantage of me, despite my use of \"bait,\" if not sexually, then certainly financially.
Could some women do better? Certainly, and the ones who can, typically, will. However, most women still do not know
enough about copulins to understand the terms of battle as I have come to know them. So, for this brief period of
time, we have men getting pheromone-enhanced attention, before the women turn the whole thing around and begin
manipulating men further through chemical enhancement of their natural charms. For those of you who don\'t know:
these charms are all of chemical origin. Estrogen levels manifest in female pheromone production condition the male
visual response so that we find more estrogenized women more attractive than those who are less estrogenized. This
explains male attraction to female facial features, breast size, waist to hip ratio, skin tone, skin
color--everything (because it\' the influence of estrogenic pheromones that conditions men to respond with a
testosterone increase to women\'s charms).
More estrogenized women get to choose whatever man they want, since
men almost always will respond to female pheromones with a testosterone increase. If a man wants to increase his
choices, he can only hope that there will be more ovulatory phase women available whose hormonal state lends them to
a more powerfull influence of male pheromones. Then, if he\'s smart, he adds some testosterone-linked pheromone
enhancement to his battle tactics. War is hell, but proper armament is still required to do battle.
jamesdeanmartin
05-12-2004, 05:53 AM
I enjoy it when people who have never even tried the products or read through the research chime in and
pass judgment on everyone.
JDM
Pancho1188
05-12-2004, 06:20 AM
</font><blockquote><font class=\"small\">Quote:</font><hr />
I enjoy it when people who have never
even tried the products or read through the research chime in and pass judgment on everyone.
JDM
<hr
/></blockquote><font class=\"post\">
*Begin Dream Sequence*
\"Pheromones are wrong and dangerous. They
work to seduce women and render them helpless to your powers. The government should ban them immediately...and by
the way, you suck, JDM!\"
*End Dream Sequence*
Yeah, I hate when that happens.
/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smirk.gif
camusflage
05-12-2004, 10:14 AM
I have and love the men\'s flavor. Wearing it with his Cologne cuts down on the high notes well
enough to make it an everyday type of thing.
As for the women\'s, I like the original stuff, but REALLY like
Angel Innocent for more regular usage.
oscar
05-12-2004, 01:32 PM
</font><blockquote><font class=\"small\">Quote:</font><hr />
I\'ve been viewing the topics in this
forum, did my lil\' research on mones, and have come up with a few issues. I\'m not tryin\' to criticize or
anything, I just want to know your take on this...
1) I\'ve noticed a HUGE range of results for mones:
either (supposedly) very noticeable and even outrageously positive responses...and then completely non-existent
responses. Now, what EXACTLY does that mean? Is it because of the individual\'s personal body chemistry, incorrect
usage, or is it the person themself?
2) I believe a VERY unhealthy dependence on pheromone usage is possible,
especially for individuals who are desperate for a quick fix. Now I know that these substances aren\'t SUPPOSED to
be a quick fix and its been said before, but regardless there are going to be many people who will use it as such.
I\'ve seen posts (and no offense if it applies) of how certain individuals have seen no results, plan on buying
massive amounts of mones to test them all, spend all their spare money on it, try extreme ways to increase their own
natural pheromones, and in essence, becoming mentally addicted and dependent on mones. I believe all these
\"success\" stories on here are misleading a casual user and making them expect women to lay down at their feet,
when it\'s more than just chemicals. Yes, they may help, but it\'s YOU.
3) Yes, the ethical question of
mones in general has been brought up before. BUT...here\'s my take on it. Why would you want to be with a female
who is LITERALLY \"physically\" attracted to you and not physically, mentally, and emotionally attracted to you?
If these mones supposedly work like magic, these females will be attracted to the MONES, not YOU. And what happens
if you stop using them for some reason? Will insecurity and mental dependency on mones affect you? If you\'re all
about sleeping with as many women as possible, then I see you wouldn\'t have a problem. And I know I will get
responses about how it\'s only meant to enhance what you already have, but so is plastic surgery...
Once
again, no offense to anyone, just trying to bring up some issues which I see. I\'m even thinking about
experimenting with mones, I don\'t know, but I wanna know your opinions on the above three points.
<hr
/></blockquote><font class=\"post\">
handtohandking,
On your first point I think it\'s necessary
to view both extremes with just a slight \"shadow of doubt\", taking much of what we see with the proverbial
\"grain of salt\".
In the cases of the most \"outrageously positive results\" being reported, we have to
consider among other things, that the target exhibiting the outrageous behavior may have done the same even without
exposure to pheromones due to any number of factors such as hormonal spikes or alcoholic disinhibition.
Humans
are complex creatures whose responses are a great deal more difficult to analyze in behavioral studies than rats or
mice. Short of being able to literally \"turn back the clock\", exposing the same target, to the same subject,
under the same conditions, at the same point in her menstrual cycle, once with pheromonal stimulation and once
without, we really can\'t make definitive statements on the efficacy of the products. \"Anecdotal evidence\" is
all we\'ve really got to work with, so we do our best with what we\'re given.
I might also add here that the
\"completely non-existent responses\" might be looked upon with a tinge of doubt as well, since one of the things
that I\'ve learned by reading these forums over the years is that there are many guys who routinely miss or
misinterpret blatant, obvious signals of interest from women.
One\'s body chemistry, usage methods, and
personality all will affect the degree of success one will likely achieve using pheromones, but I believe that how
well attuned one is to the responses has a lot to do with the wide variance of results we see posted that range so
drastically from \"astounding success\" to \"miserable failure\".
On your second point I can really only
see pheromone usage becoming an \"unhealthy dependence\" if someone is spending the money they\'d otherwise be
using for food, or shelter, or other necessities on pheromones instead. We\'re really NOT talking about that
expensive a habit here. If you\'re purchasing the products wisely, the average one-day pheromone application only
costs between $0.25 and $0.50 U.S.
I do see a concern in the cases of those who DON\'T see results wanting to
buy many more different products to see if there is something that WILL work for them. Hopefully these guys will
either find something that does work for them before exhausting the catalog of products (or their savings) or
they\'ll simply give up. Many have. Many have not.
I can\'t see that an unsucessful pheromone user would ever
become addicted to the use of the products; obsessed with the hope that the products will eventually benefit him
perhaps, but once someone\'s tried them all and still not noticed positive changes, I can\'t see that person
perservering in what appears to be a futile effort.
For those who have seen positive results I suppose there is
the possibility of a psychological addiction. But the vast majority of us who are mature reasonable beings know that
pheromones aren\'t the \"end all, be all\" products that some websites make them out to be.
If you\'ve got
the personality type that allows you to easily become psychologically dependent on something, you may want to take a
pass on pheromones.
You yourself answered in part to the third segment of your post when you wrote at
the end of the second segment, \"Yes, they may help, but it\'s YOU.\"
Pheromones are not knocking women
unconscious or brainwashing them. There is a guy that\'s going to be standing there in the aura of the synthesized
pheromone cloud, and that guy is either me or you, and neither of us is going to be able to \"put anything over\"
on the target female that she\'s unwilling to accept. We\'re just tweaking the initial perception.
Myself, I
don\'t think I would continue using pheromones in a potential long term relationship even if they had played a
part in the initial attracton. I believe I would want to know that I could sustain the bond without any artificial
means. But I would probably \"wean\" myself off them rather than going \"cold turkey\" just to be on the safe
side.
Your ethics are yours, and mine are mine. I\'d no sooner expect you to adapt mine than I would adapt
yours.
But something I noticed in a subsequent post of yours further down the thread struck me.
You wrote,
\"YOU WORK FOR IT\" in reference to the comparison of building up ones physique vs. pheromone usage. I think your
work ethic might be getting in your way here. You\'ve no doubt been brought up with the understanding that
\"there are no magical fixes\", \"you can\'t get success in a bottle\", and \"there\'s no such thing as a
Love Potion\".
And here you\'re presented with the possibility that all of that might not be entirely true. I
can\'t blame you at all for being skeptical.
I\'m guessing that your research took you to other
websites, because some of the phrases and concepts you used in your initial post don\'t look like claims that
people on this board make or take seriously: \"work like magic\", \"expect women to lay down at their feet\",
etc.
A guy who called himself \"golem\" once posted a
mantra (\"http://www.server2.love-scent.com/ubbthreads/showflat.php?Cat=&Board=UBB5&Number=26093&Forum=UB B
5&Words=blade%20iceberg%20cake&Match=And&Searchpag e=0&Limit=25&Old=allposts&Main=26093&S
earch=true#Post26093\") for phero users, and I think it much more accurately reflects the attitudes of
the majority of phero users on this board than do those colorful phrases above.
\"To gain confidence,
repeat this everyday when you put on pheros:
Pheromones are just the tip of the iceberg.
But I am the
ICEBERG!
Pheromones are just the icing on the cake.
But I am the CAKE!
Pheromones may give me an
edge.
But I am the BLADE! \" - golem
I think this outlines a healthy and reasonable mindset for
pheromone use.
The bad news is that as an Asian male you would be among that group of pheromone users who
have reported the least degree of success with the products.
The good news is that if you DO decide you want
to give them a shot, there are ways of trying a fairly broad range of different pheromones for relatively little
expense.
I\'d recommend you try the unscented SOE gel packs. SOE, which contains Androstenol and Androsterone,
seems to be one product that has performed well for Asian males. If you wish to try your luck with a bit more
\"risky\" a product, you could also try the TE gel packs, which contain Androstenone and a \"secret
ingredient\".
For about $20 you can get a pretty fair idea of whether or not the products will do anything for
you and be able to put those other issues into a \"first person\" perspective.
Your Call!
Good Luck!
Oscar /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif
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